Car wont start after new engine and new loom.

[ben_p]

Spec is:

Full engine rebuild
I removed most of the old wiring, and ecu (renault siemens)
It now just runs an omex 600 with pre-assembled loom

Car cranks on ignition and the pump primes but will not fire up?

Injectors have got 12 volts on ignition 2 and when cranking (both sides)
Coil has 12 volts on ignition 2 and when cranking

All of the sensors are wired up as per 600 manual

Thoughts?
P.s I got a bit of paint on the fly wheel (about 3inches long) when I painted the block (with hammerite) could this affect the cps?

 

[ditz]

thats the problem,, poor power supply 2volts is nowhere near enough to start it

 

[ben_p]

2v?

I ment ignition position 2

 

[ben_p]

just to add, just test that it get fuel on crank not just on prime.. and it does.

 

[Russ_16v]

i guessing you have checked for spark fella?

 

[ditz]

oh sorry misread it!

yeah have you checked for spark and that the injectors are being triggered??

work that out then go from there are paint wont affect the cps signal

 

[ben_p]

coil is giving 12v on ignition position 2 and on crank (im testing this from the connector not connected to the pack)

but when holding the HT lead just above the coil pack hole i cant see a spark jumping??

also it was getting dark but i couldnt see fuel coming out of the injectors down the ITB's

the inertia switch is clicked off so it cant be that.

 

[Russ_16v]

Hmm, does it smell of fuel mate? in my experience you should be able to see the spark jump easy

 

[ScottyD]

Tried the TDC Sensor?

 

[Matteh]

cant you not connect your omex to a laptop and see that it's getting the correct cranking signal?

 

[ben_p]

Hmm, does it smell of fuel mate? in my experience you should be able to see the spark jump easy

yeah seems strange cant smell fuel and can't see the spark jumping? But feul is defo there on prime and cranking and also tested the injector plugs, there were getting 12v on ign 2 and crank on both pins ( I dont know if 0v is the switch for them or what?) coil is showing 12v at the plug (off) on both igmition 2 and crank

 

[ben_p]

Tried the TDC Sensor?

In what way?

 

[ben_p]

cant you not connect your omex to a laptop and see that it's getting the correct cranking signal?

Not sure? I need a laptop!

 

[stan*]

cant you not connect your omex to a laptop and see that it's getting the correct cranking signal?

as matty says...get coms with the ecu and check cranking and TPS load position--sensor may have been nudged and need recalibrating.

Also 12v is a bit low, you really want 13.5 ISH volts at battery and coil/starter.

how exactly are you checking for a spark?

 

[Andy GDI]

you need to see if you are getting STAT SYNC in the software

which crank sensor are you running Ben?

 

[Andy GDI]

you only need about 9.5volts to start the car

 

[Andy GDI]

it will most likely to be the CPS, you may have the pins back to front as well.

red needs to goto pin 1 of the CPS

 

[ben_p]

as matty says...get coms with the ecu and check cranking and TPS load position--sensor may have been nudged and need recalibrating.

Also 12v is a bit low, you really want 13.5 ISH volts at battery and coil/starter.

how exactly are you checking for a spark?

I thnk the batt has only got 12 in it,

Could only check fir spark by holding the lead above the coilpack to see it would jump

 

[Hutchie]

you have done it wrong

will be something simple, always is tbh

 

[ben_p]

Andy I'm running the blue Renault sensor, will have to check which way the wires are, will the laptop tell me that?

 

[Andy GDI]

no, but it will tell you on the start screen if you have stat sync

you can try reversing the wires... but that will change the timing offset massively so is a risky strategy

i will try and find the pin connections to the std sensor

 

[Daz Clio Cup]

Have you changed the jumper in the omex?

 

[ben_p]

The what what?

 

[ben_p]

no, but it will tell you on the start screen if you have stat sync

you can try reversing the wires... but that will change the timing offset massively so is a risky strategy

i will try and find the pin connections to the std sensor

The way I worked it out was by tracing the old loom back to see which wires were T'd in where and matched the colours that way

 

[Andy GDI]

there is a small jumper on pins JP1 on the ecu board..

with the std sensor you sometimes get too much amplitude so the jumper can help with that.

 

[stan*]

you only need about 9.5volts to start the car

You reckon?!
That would mean cranking voltage would be down to like 4v!!!

Besides on a freshly built engine, you can't get away with the same drop in voltage as with a ready-run engine.

Worth charging the battery imo.

 

[Andy GDI]

The way I worked it out was by tracing the old loom back to see which wires were T'd in where and matched the colours that way

then you prob have it correct.

you may need to move the sensor up and down, there is probably a slot in the CPS

dont forget before though the signal was split and now its not so it will be stronger.

 

[ben_p]

there is a small jumper on pins JP1 on the ecu board..

with the std sensor you sometimes get too much amplitude so the jumper can help with that.

I don't understand this, sorry for being thick, how can I test/ fix this?

 

[ben_p]

then you prob have it correct.

you may need to move the sensor up and down, there is probably a slot in the CPS

dont forget before though the signal was split and now its not so it will be stronger.

Move the pin in the sensor or move it in the mounts?

 

[Andy GDI]

undo the bolts that hold the CPS, just enough to move it up and down...

obviously dont go too far down as it will hit the flywheel.

 

[ben_p]

undo the bolts that hold the CPS, just enough to move it up and down...

obviously dont go too far down as it will hit the flywheel.

Ok will give this a shot tomorrow, what cable do I need for the omex to laptop?

 

[Andy GDI]

serial lead, if you have a usb laptop then you will need a serial to usb adaptor

 

[Daz Clio Cup]

undo the bolts that hold the CPS, just enough to move it up and down...

obviously dont go too far down as it will hit the flywheel.

Change the jumper on the omex first. moving the cps closer will increase the signal, and besides these cps sensors are calibrated at that distance from the flywheel, i know i investigated it for 6 months, with my dodgy starting itbs/omex conversion. the jumper cured it no problems.

 

[Daz Clio Cup]

Ok will give this a shot tomorrow, what cable do I need for the omex to laptop?

Out of curiosity if you have no cable for the omex, how did you get a map loaded in? or get the omex set-up?

 

[Andy GDI]

it already had a map from before

 

[Daz Clio Cup]

it already had a map from before

Ah secondhand map, But it's still not set up, tps etc? mmmmmm

 

[ben_p]

Daz it's using my old map since then I have changed the compression and cams, so it should still start on that map with a bit of gas.

Can you write a quick guide for the jumper fix? I don't even know what one is

 

[Andy GDI]

ben

call me, I can go over it on the phone

andy

p.s. it may also help to have one of our new crank sensors (better than the std renault one)

 

[ben_p]

K will do

 

[Adam]

Have you attached the batt???