Valver/willy 5th injector

[Paul16V]

I know that the valver and willy engines have a 5th injector for cold start yeah. Just someone said something today about using the 5th injector so it works all the time to increase performance. Sounds like bullsh*t to me, thought I would ask though.

Anyone know?

 

[cliokongen]

Dont think the cold start injector will be suited for "acting" as a fifth injector... Get a MF2 system with wich is a system with an injector and a control box, Fit the injector in the beginning of the manifold..

Just my opinion...

Michael

 

[weight]

Just cause it to run rich, slow you if anything!

 

[Chris_H]

you see years ago I first mentioned this on 1916V.com I in fact afaik pioneered it. Others used it and it does improve the top end performace where it does lean off a bit.

teh 5th injector is also suitable for being open constantly. Its not pulsed liek normal injectors.

 

[weight]

Why does it lean off as standard??

 

[Roamer]

Then only reason why youd want to run an extra injector is if your oxygen input has increased (as in Nitrous Oxide injection or some kind of forced induction which cant be mapped or has reached the standard injector limits etc), otherwise as weight says youll just overfuel and slow down LoL

 

[cliokongen]

Very useable on cars with a turbo....

@ Chris_H: Why not just map the chip properly... much easyer to control!

Michael

 

[Chris_H]

99% of cars lean off at high revs.

Way they are mapped. They run daft rich when booted at lower revs then as the revs increase they lean off, and off and off a bit more.

Ever watched a car in front especially a big one like a new jag or something boot it and the puff of black smoke? Thats full load enrichment which is fine there but it leans off and off.

All maps are a comprimise. It may be lean on one car and the car built 2 misn later may be running rich at the same load, speed etc.

get the car on the rollers and make sure the loads held for long enough and watch the AFR.

Problem with most RRs are they dont hold the speed long enough to actually highlight these probs.

Also stock ecus lean off at certain points to comply with emmisions, noise regs and the fuel economy figures.

Its a bloody hard job mapping a road car ecu, thats why manufacturers spend a wee bit of cash.

 

[cliokongen]

Quote: Originally posted by Chris_H on 10 July 2003


99% of cars lean off at high revs.

Way they are mapped. They run daft rich when booted at lower revs then as the revs increase they lean off, and off and off a bit more.

Ever watched a car in front especially a big one like a new jag or something boot it and the puff of black smoke? Thats full load enrichment which is fine there but it leans off and off.

All maps are a comprimise. It may be lean on one car and the car built 2 misn later may be running rich at the same load, speed etc.

get the car on the rollers and make sure the loads held for long enough and watch the AFR.

Problem with most RRs are they dont hold the speed long enough to actually highlight these probs.

Also stock ecus lean off at certain points to comply with emmisions, noise regs and the fuel economy figures.

Its a bloody hard job mapping a road car ecu, thats why manufacturers spend a wee bit of cash.

Yes... all cars lean off at certain points... Running economy = closed loop... leaning off, fueling, leaning off... etc.

A manufacturers chip is as you said a compromise... must be able to use various fuels in different conditions

Had my chip done while driving.... was adjusted on the PC in different loads etc. That works!!!

Michael

 

[Paul16V]

So is this actually gonna do anything?

 

[Chris_H]

try it and see then!

The way I done it was popped down the scrappies cut of an injector plug from a scrapper with EFI runnign bosch injectors wired one side direct to earth the other to a switch inside the car then to the battery.

Flick it on and off when you wish.

 

[Paul16V]

dont fancy tryin it on mine hehe. just wondered if anyone else had done it.

 

[Ben H]

I could be way off here, but when I bought my Valver it came with an adjustable Facet valve that I think basically acts as a fifth injector to stop the car running lean at high revs and supposedly to help the car idle better with the cams it uses (often called a PBV, I think). Might that help explain why I regularly get a massive cloud of black smoke when I boot it at high speed (like in 4th gear at 5000rpm+) and then change to a higher gear???

 

[BenR]

your way off........

its an adj fuel pressure reg, it can still lean off if you set it up wrong, or it can run massively rich. Its a rising rate reg, affected my manifold vacuum and has an extra large diaphram which responds faster to snap throttle movements. All it does is affect your rail pressure.

 

[cliokongen]

Ive also tried a PBV.. Not impressed! The difference is so small that i hardly noticed it was there. Maybe it was setup wrong, dont know. Fact is, that the ECU sort of made countermeasures to the higher rail pressure. That is, cutting back on the time the injector would be open. Air/fuel ratio did not change (maybe a tiny bit). I have an air/fuel meter installed so i could see if there was any changes. Maybe it did react quicker to throttle movements, but i could not feel it...

It think the best would be to have a higher rail pressure and then a remap of the ECU... That works!!

Michael

 

[Chris_H]

PBVs are very usefull but they need to be set up correctly in order to work properly.

If you go on RSC and do a search I have fully explained PBVs and their benifits on there.