understeer!

[ben_p]

Having a few issues with under steer, I get little grip and a constant slide

set up is..

front;
182 roll bar
182 inner and outer powerflex bushes
powerflex wishbone bushes
LEDA coilovers
front 300lbs 7inch spring
6 clicks from 0 on the shock
LEDA camber bolts

front settings are

Toe n/s -0.06' o/s 0.07'
steer ahead 0.00
Camber n/s 1degree and 39 minutes (-ve) o/s 1 degree and 38 minutes (-ve)

caster is 2 degrees and 18 minutes on both sides.


Yoko Parada 195 50 15

all tests done on dry road


car is not stupid low and there is travel in the shocks, there is about a 3/4 inch gap between front tyre and arch

rear has a 2mm gap between rear tyre and arch

(rear set up is, LEDA shock (9 clicks) with 400lbs 5inch spring

I have no issues with the rear end, when it slips it progressive I have a good thrust angle of 0.02 too and I only run 1 degree and 35 minutes on each rear wheel with stock 0.25 toe


anyone? my first thoughts was there is just too much camber on the front, as i can lock the wheels easy under hard braking (4 pots mind) and its spins easy on accel out of bends etc


im about to buy 4 pe2s too, maybe paradas dotn suit the car?

also im unsure on what pressures to run.

 

[FlameR]

prob just cos you're a fat cvnt putting to much weight on one side of the car.

 

[ben_p]

Na I had your mum in the boot for rear end traction, you know how I roll

 

[FlameR]

looks more like your mum tbh

 

[ben_p]

na lol meh

 

[RobHardyUK]

Softening the front suspension will increase grip. or you can counter act by increasing the rear pressure but i would sort the front if the rear feels ok.

 

[ben_p]

hmm, il drop the front down to two clicks tonight, i just cant work it out, ive tried alsorts of settings

it also seems to skip round round abouts if they are bumpy

 

[Dan R]

I would say front is too low and springs are tad heavy on the front. try 285lb fronts. raise the car up a tad!!! honestly.

 

[Dan R]

(quietly wating while ben p gets his tape measure out)

 

[ben_p]

the front is at a good hight, you can get your whole hand between the arch but it still has a good rake angle. when you jack the car up the shock only sets a futher 2 -3". so there is plenty of travel in the insert too

i will give the springs a try.. £56 a pop though i may get the car to leda? maybe they have differnt springs i could try etc, save me buying loads of others.

 

[Dan R]

Having a few issues with under steer, I get little grip and a constant slide

set up is..

front;
182 roll bar
182 inner and outer powerflex bushes
powerflex wishbone bushes
LEDA coilovers
front 300lbs 7inch spring
6 clicks from 0 on the shock
LEDA camber bolts

front settings are

Toe n/s -0.06' o/s 0.07'
steer ahead 0.00
Camber n/s 1degree and 39 minutes (-ve) o/s 1 degree and 38 minutes (-ve)

caster is 2 degrees and 18 minutes on both sides.


Yoko Parada 195 50 15

all tests done on dry road


car is not stupid low and there is travel in the shocks, there is about a 3/4 inch gap between front tyre and arch

rear has a 2mm gap between rear tyre and arch

(rear set up is, LEDA shock (9 clicks) with 400lbs 5inch spring

I have no issues with the rear end, when it slips it progressive I have a good thrust angle of 0.02 too and I only run 1 degree and 35 minutes on each rear wheel with stock 0.25 toe


anyone? my first thoughts was there is just too much camber on the front, as i can lock the wheels easy under hard braking (4 pots mind) and its spins easy on accel out of bends etc


im about to buy 4 pe2s too, maybe paradas dotn suit the car?

also im unsure on what pressures to run.

Theres something really not right there. Mine does none of that!

 

[ben_p]

look at these pics! the front seems to be all over the place :S but the back looks planted

that was on fronts 225 lb rear 325 lb

 

[Dan R]

the front is at a good hight, you can get your whole hand between the arch but it still has a good rake angle. when you jack the car up the shock only sets a futher 2 -3". so there is plenty of travel in the insert too

i will give the springs a try.. £56 a pop though i may get the car to leda? maybe they have differnt springs i could try etc, save me buying loads of others.

I seriously think your runnin out of suspension travel. Raise it up a tad. You got nothing to lose. Also make sure the back is stiffer than then the front. If its not then theres your problem!!!

 

[ben_p]

Having a few issues with under steer, I get little grip and a constant slide

set up is..

front;
182 roll bar
182 inner and outer powerflex bushes
powerflex wishbone bushes
LEDA coilovers
front 300lbs 7inch spring
6 clicks from 0 on the shock
LEDA camber bolts

front settings are

Toe n/s -0.06' o/s 0.07'
steer ahead 0.00
Camber n/s 1degree and 39 minutes (-ve) o/s 1 degree and 38 minutes (-ve)

caster is 2 degrees and 18 minutes on both sides.


Yoko Parada 195 50 15

all tests done on dry road


car is not stupid low and there is travel in the shocks, there is about a 3/4 inch gap between front tyre and arch

rear has a 2mm gap between rear tyre and arch

(rear set up is, LEDA shock (9 clicks) with 400lbs 5inch spring

I have no issues with the rear end, when it slips it progressive I have a good thrust angle of 0.02 too and I only run 1 degree and 35 minutes on each rear wheel with stock 0.25 toe


anyone? my first thoughts was there is just too much camber on the front, as i can lock the wheels easy under hard braking (4 pots mind) and its spins easy on accel out of bends etc


im about to buy 4 pe2s too, maybe paradas dotn suit the car?

also im unsure on what pressures to run.

Theres something really not right there. Mine does none of that!

in what sense?

 

[sideways danny]

what pressures are you running in tyres now? too high would account to some degree for easy locking up, skipping in bends and understeer. I'd look at softer front damping and lower tyre pressures. Alternatively raise the rear damper rates to slow down the weight shift from corner to corner

 

[ben_p]

the front is at a good hight, you can get your whole hand between the arch but it still has a good rake angle. when you jack the car up the shock only sets a futher 2 -3". so there is plenty of travel in the insert too

i will give the springs a try.. £56 a pop though i may get the car to leda? maybe they have differnt springs i could try etc, save me buying loads of others.

I seriously think your runnin out of suspension travel. Raise it up a tad. You got nothing to lose. Also make sure the back is stiffer than then the front. If its not then theres your problem!!!

il give it a bash tonight, the back is defo stiffer, its on 9 clicks and the springs are 100lbs harder

 

[ben_p]

what pressures are you running in tyres now? too high would account to some degree for easy locking up, skipping in bends and understeer. I'd look at softer front damping and lower tyre pressures

front 33

rear 31

 

[Dan R]

look at these pics! the front seems to be all over the place :S but the back looks planted

that was on fronts 225 lb rear 325 lb

fronts too soft. 225lb bit low. 325 rears. too excessive. also depends on quality of suspension!!!

 

[Dan R]

Theres something really not right there. Mine does none of that!

in what sense?

I have excellent turn in. Dont suffer at all with wheel spin. Nor braking problems and have very very minimal understeer. Ive told you. its too low all round. I bet you!!!! drive down and go in mine

 

[ben_p]

it seems to only be me having issues with the LEDAs, ive been doing lots of reading and the race teams fuckign love them

 

[ben_p]

in what sense?

I have excellent turn in. Dont suffer at all with wheel spin. Nor braking problems and have very very minimal understeer. Ive told you. its too low all round. I bet you!!!! drive down and go in mine

i would like to take a ride on ASTs

whats your postcode dan?

 

[ben_p]

lol 2 hours away

 

[Dan R]

it seems to only be me having issues with the LEDAs, ive been doing lots of reading and the race teams f**kign love them

bin em!!! old hat now mate. not what ive heard on the race teams side of thing. Powerstation took on a team recently that were running 12k worth of sachs stuff on their race cars and werent totally happy with them. Curtis offered them a build on a set of AST's to test. He built them all up and sent them off to the team. They tested them for 3 races and were blown away by them!!!!! Then curtis told them that they would would only be costin them around 2k a set!!!!!! They were kind of happy saving nearly TEN GRAND!!!! on a set of shocks and they were miles miles better!!!!

 

[ben_p]

hour each

il try the AST you can try the leda

 

[Dan R]

lol 2 hours away

WR11

 

[sideways danny]

what pressures are you running in tyres now? too high would account to some degree for easy locking up, skipping in bends and understeer. I'd look at softer front damping and lower tyre pressures

front 33

rear 31

I'd definitely say that's too high front pressure

 

[ben_p]

195 50 15 btw

 

[Dan R]

front 33

rear 31

I'd definitely say that's too high front pressure

Thats ok for road use i would of said. maybe a tad less for 15's

 

[Ali]

Does the car pivot mid corner, or push on?!

Sounds like the back is pushin on to me - Need to take some grip off from the rear.

Failing that, fire some more front toe on it...

 

[Dan R]

Does the car pivot mid corner, or push on?!

Sounds like the back is pushin on to me - Need to take some grip off from the rear.

no suspension travel!!! ill keep sayin it. or poor shocks

 

[Dan R]

hour each

il try the AST you can try the leda

Ok. But ill want mine back after!!!!

 

[ben_p]

Does the car pivot mid corner, or push on?!

Sounds like the back is pushin on to me - Need to take some grip off from the rear.

its strange, feels like it pushes on, but then somtimes il sweep into a bend and the front just always slides even whenthe back isnt doing much!

 

[sideways danny]

yeah dont mean major pressure drops, just 2psi tweaks. Wheel and tyre size shouldn't really make much difference to tyre pressures (anything different obviously needs fine tuning), it's more important how much the car weighs. If you've done much weight saving you'll need to run lower pressures to achieve a contact patch the same as standard. 33psi is what i run on the front of my 1300kg 200sx

 

[ben_p]

hour each

il try the AST you can try the leda

Ok. But ill want mine back after!!!!

confident!

meet at stoke/stafford?

 

[ben_p]

yeah dont mean major pressure drops, just 2psi tweaks. Wheel and tyre size shouldn't really make much difference to tyre pressures (anything different obviously needs fine tuning), it's more important how much the car weighs. If you've done much weight saving you'll need to run lower pressures to achieve a contact patch the same as standard. 33psi is what i run on the front of my 1300kg 200sx

car weighs around 900kgs

il drop them to 30 tonight, and raise it up a tad

 

[sideways danny]

yeah dont mean major pressure drops, just 2psi tweaks. Wheel and tyre size shouldn't really make much difference to tyre pressures (anything different obviously needs fine tuning), it's more important how much the car weighs. If you've done much weight saving you'll need to run lower pressures to achieve a contact patch the same as standard. 33psi is what i run on the front of my 1300kg 200sx

car weighs around 900kgs

il drop them to 30 tonight, and raise it up a tad

30 should be better. I always ran 29 front 30 rear on my 205 gti with 195/50/15s very similar weight.

 

[Dan R]

yeah dont mean major pressure drops, just 2psi tweaks. Wheel and tyre size shouldn't really make much difference to tyre pressures (anything different obviously needs fine tuning), it's more important how much the car weighs. If you've done much weight saving you'll need to run lower pressures to achieve a contact patch the same as standard. 33psi is what i run on the front of my 1300kg 200sx

car weighs around 900kgs

il drop them to 30 tonight, and raise it up a tad

Yeah drop them to 30 fr, 27 rear??

 

[Dan R]

Ok. But ill want mine back after!!!!

confident!

meet at stoke/stafford?

oh im confident alright. Im too poor to drive up

 

[ben_p]

LOL!

 

[Ali]

mayb you??!! Not to point the finger?!

I found about 4tenths in the caterham by changin my braking point and corner entry. PI basically showed that the weight transfer over the front axle is too much. Hence the intital understear and then when the balance shifted it resulted in the arse getting a little loose.

Are you getting as much understeer in the dry as you are in the wet? Mind you need to soften the car up in the damp etc!!! I.e Softer ARB.

If this was a kart it would be so easy to answer but a car is 100x more complex.