Acid dipping a shell

[M4D M4X]

I'm after info on this really as next year my plan is to rip into my M3 and start from scratch and rebuild it to concours condition with the occasional mod's, i've looked into sand blasting but it pits the metal so not a chance in hell this is happing.
From what i've been told acid dipping can be expensive but it shows what has been covered up in the past so a better option for me, only problem i have does anybody have any experience or have had there shell dipped? If so who did you use?.

What's the treatment/primer that goes on after it's been dipped? apparently this is crucial for it not to rust.
Another thing has anybody had experiences with spraying a car after this stage (providing the shell's mint) was it the same process as other respray work or did other work need to be done?.

Any help would be great .

 

[mugglesquop]

bare metal, por 15.

sand blasting doesnt have to attack the metal, depends of what medium is being used and the air pressure.

 

[M4D M4X]

bare metal, por 15.

sand blasting doesnt have to attack the metal, depends of what medium is being used and the air pressure.

I assume por15 is some technical term for acid or treatment that it goes through.

Can sandblasting remove seam sealer if the granules used was fine and at a low air pressure?.
Cheers

 

[mugglesquop]

google por15

sandblasting will remove whatever you point it at. por15 would easily coat the dull finish left by sandblasting

 

[bozothenutter]

there was an article on dipping cars in the last or previous racecar engineering, a uk company that could dip a shell and coat it for rust protection

 

[mugglesquop]

it will need coating as soon as the acid is washed off, otherwise the moisture in the air will make it brown overnight.

 

[Craigus]

If it isn't primed immediately after being removed it will look like a Lancia the next day. Spraying is no different to anything else, as long as it has been primed correctly.

 

[M4D M4X]

google por15

sandblasting will remove whatever you point it at. por15 would easily coat the dull finish left by sandblasting

Just checked a few videos on you tube the car in question is almost mint so think that por15 is for more serious rust, but saying that i don't know what's been covered up in the past so hence the dipping idea.

Always a option after being dipped if it's a nail lol.

 

[mugglesquop]

por15 is hard wearing (like under seal) and also helps prevent rust, its the proper way of doing it very highly recommended by a lot of people.

if you arent going to drive it however, a coat of lacquer will do.

 

[Tony Hunter]

480bhp on here had his Clio dipped,went rusty by the time he got it home.

 

[M4D M4X]

there was an article on dipping cars in the last or previous racecar engineering, a uk company that could dip a shell and coat it for rust protection

Awesome i'll look for the mag or website and get all the relevant info .
Cheers

 

[M4D M4X]

it will need coating as soon as the acid is washed off, otherwise the moisture in the air will make it brown overnight.

Does these acid dipping company's offer the coating after it's been dipped? If not then that's going to be a problem .

 

[ado]

http://www.surfaceprocessing.co.uk

As Tony said 480bhp had his done at the above place. I can't remember whether he had to do any welding before being e-coated.

We have another MX5 going to be dipped. Mainly so it's a light as possible.

 

[M4D M4X]

If it isn't primed immediately after being removed it will look like a Lancia the next day. Spraying is no different to anything else, as long as it has been primed correctly.

That's ok then, I spoken to a few respray garages around my way and none of them had experiance with cars that's been dipped so i wasn't sure of the process.
Cheers

 

[M4D M4X]

por15 is hard wearing (like under seal) and also helps prevent rust, its the proper way of doing it very highly recommended by a lot of people.

if you arent going to drive it however, a coat of lacquer will do.

Yes i'll be driving the car once the car is all done, i'll look more into por15 and find a bodyshop that's had experience working with the stuff.
Cheers

 

[M4D M4X]

480bhp on here had his Clio dipped,went rusty by the time he got it home.

Gutting, that's one thing i don't want to happen.
Cheers

 

[M4D M4X]

http://www.surfaceprocessing.co.uk

As Tony said 480bhp had his done at the above place. I can't remember whether he had to do any welding before being e-coated.

We have another MX5 going to be dipped. Mainly so it's a light as possible.

Awesome, I'll give them a bell and see what they recommend is the best option.
Cheers

Keep me posted on the outcome of the mx5 .

 

[mugglesquop]

are you sure you want to acid dip? whats the reason?

a full stripdown will show any bad parts, acid dipping is for royally fucked shells.

 

[Tony Hunter]

[video]http://www.surfaceprocessing.co.uk/technical-process.html[/video]

 

[ado]

Awesome, I'll give them a bell and see what they recommend is the best option.
Cheers

Keep me posted on the outcome of the mx5 .

The MX5 won't be going for a while.

My friend had his Alfa race car dipped and coated and it's looking good after nearly 2 yrs. The main thing I would be worried about if there's any acid that could be trapped and eat the shell from the inside but it doesn't seem to be happening.

 

[M4D M4X]

are you sure you want to acid dip? whats the reason?

a full stripdown will show any bad parts, acid dipping is for royally fucked shells.

The reason i was thinking of acid dipping was to remove every part of the paint/primer/underseal/seam sealant and stone chip underneath the car and whatever else is lurking under the paint work.
When the car gets sprayed it will have a few coats of paint inside/outside/underneath then numours coats of laquer, there will be no stone chip put underneath the car either.

Your prob thinking i'm mad for doing it this way but i'm never going to sell the car, so this way i wouldn't have to re do it in 20/30 years time .

 

[Sam@NP]

A good dipping place should prime it as well straight after.

 

[Tony Hunter]

Thats why I put a link up,they do offer this service as well.

 

[M4D M4X]

The MX5 won't be going for a while.

My friend had his Alfa race car dipped and coated and it's looking good after nearly 2 yrs. The main thing I would be worried about if there's any acid that could be trapped and eat the shell from the inside but it doesn't seem to be happening.

Awesome, I assume a simple 3mm drill hole in the bottom corners of any panel would let it drip out, then a case of spot weld the hole after .

 

[M4D M4X]

A good dipping place should prime it as well straight after.

Just seen Tony's post with the video .

 

[ado]

They also make sure it's all washed before being coated so the chances of that happening is pretty much nil. It's usually just scare tactics from people who haven't had it done.

 

[M4D M4X]

Thats why I put a link up,they do offer this service as well.

Cheers for the video Tony, didn't realise they had to be dipped in so many tanks lol.

 

[Sam@NP]

All proper racing cars are dipped

 

[M4D M4X]

They also make sure it's all washed before being coated so the chances of that happening is pretty much nil. It's usually just scare tactics from people who haven't had it done.

I surpose so, don't think they would give you a shell back with acid still in small places so it can harm people's skin and eat the body from inside.

 

[mugglesquop]

the acid will become unreactive once its eaten so much stuff anyway.

we hot dip stuff at work, citric acid @ 70/80 degrees iirc, goes through a wash after. not big enough for a car tho

 

[M4D M4X]

All proper racing cars are dipped

Didn't know that, good to learn something new everyday .

 

[M4D M4X]

the acid will become unreactive once its eaten so much stuff anyway.

we hot dip stuff at work, citric acid @ 70/80 degrees iirc, goes through a wash after. not big enough for a car tho

Thats a shame you couldn't get a car in it .
Yeah didn't think of that, so more dips the better the outcome.

When i have the car done i'll have 20 lol.

 

[Tiger260]

Why don't you have it dipped and then zinc dipped. It's not terribly expensive and will protect it forever.

 

[frenchthing]

i was looking at having my 106 shell done but the costs became too much...

i went to visit the SPL plant and they were very helpful... the basic run through was this:

they dip the shell, cleaned to bare metal, its then rinsed and given back to you for any prep/repairs (cage fitting/patching/seam welding)..

they then dip it a 2nd time to remove any surface rust and welding deposits left from repairs..

once that 2nd dip is completed and rinsed, its then dipped in there Ecoat and its ready for paint..

i cant remember the exact figures for each stage but the overall cost was approx £2500..



that said.. i made a spit for my shell and have took the underneath to bare metal and undertook repairs/cage fitting and its a s**t job!! £2500 is a fair price for the labour it saves imo..

1 other point.. if you have a cage every tube needs drilling top and bottom to allow the fluids in and out...

 

[M4D M4X]

Why don't you have it dipped and then zinc dipped. It's not terribly expensive and will protect it forever.

I take it zinc dipped would have to be done after the priming dip or before?

 

[M4D M4X]

i was looking at having my 106 shell done but the costs became too much...

i went to visit the SPL plant and they were very helpful... the basic run through was this:

they dip the shell, cleaned to bare metal, its then rinsed and given back to you for any prep/repairs (cage fitting/patching/seam welding)..

they then dip it a 2nd time to remove any surface rust and welding deposits left from repairs..

once that 2nd dip is completed and rinsed, its then dipped in there Ecoat and its ready for paint..

i cant remember the exact figures for each stage but the overall cost was approx £2500..



that said.. i made a spit for my shell and have took the underneath to bare metal and undertook repairs/cage fitting and its a s**t job!! £2500 is a fair price for the labour it saves imo..

1 other point.. if you have a cage every tube needs drilling top and bottom to allow the fluids in and out...

Cost doesn't bother me, the car will be done over a couple of years anyway, there will be no cage getting fitted as it will be a road car so all luxuries as it would of came out of the factory apart from a few mod's to stand out a little .

Thanks for the info didn't realise they had the car 3times but as i've already said it will be over a few years time so no rush .

 

[mugglesquop]

zinc dipping (galvanising) is usually done by dipping said item into a pool of molten zinc. The zinc is sacrificial, and corrodes over its life rather than the steel. You could paint afterwards, but you have to have special paint that will actually stick...

depending on how its done, it can leave a rough finish, as the above method, you get runs and webbing on corners. easy to remove, just a PITA

its the ideal solution in my mind, peugeot galv'd their cars from '88 onwards, and they only usually rust from a gash for cheap replacement panels from crashes...

 

[Daniel]

My mate had his splitscreen dipped.

 

[Daniel]

Then had it restored...

 

[Matt350.]

^ that campa is lush the wife and I are going to start a mini project and are going to use spl, I spoke to them at a classic car show few years back.

IMO the only people to use when restoring old shells