Cursed, Unlucky, or Lucky?

[jaycc]

Last week I decided to trade my Clio Sport 182 in for a 2 1/2 year old Clio R27. My Clio 182 was immaculate, Fully serviced (inc belts etc..) by Renault Specialist.

R27 was HPI clear etc..

I p/x my Clio and took the rest on finance.

After 6 days of ownership, I decided to take the car to my local Arnold Clark for some warranty repair. Dropped it off in the AM and got a call lunchtime. "Sorry Sir, but it appears your car has been in a serious accident. The passenger door is a different colour which has been resprayed, and the chassis has been welded to unsatisfactory standards" They refused to honour any warranty due to this.

Me: WTF?!?!



I collected the car (+ engineer report and photos). Took it back to the dealer (independent dealer) where i bought it. I was calm and professional and told him the situation. He kept the car for 5 days whilst he had it inspected.

I go down to the dealer today.

He has said i can have a refund. However he said he has "sold" my p/x Clio 182. I p/x'd this in for £4700. However he is only willing to refund me £4500 saying "I have taken £200 off because when you go into a dealership with cash instead of a p/x, you have more negotiation potential with price"

I said "what the hell has that got to do with THIS deal?" "Refund me the FULL amount"

I've already lost the car at a low price (could have sold it privately for £5,000+)

He threatend "right, well we will just give you your keys back to the new car, and see you in court, we dont have to do this, its a gesture of good will"

I told him "Dont be silly, I know my rights (i've studied the Sale of Goods Act in relation to used cars, and had advice from Trading Standards/ Consumer Direct and a few law friends)

However he would not budge.

I took the cheque for £4500, without signing anything. I have contacted Trading Standards who have advised me to write back to the dealer and ask for the FULL amount.

I suppose i've had a lucky escape getting out of the deal with the R27, but i'm angry i've lost out on a great deal of money on my previous car.

I will be taking the £200 situation further (probably through the courts).

Anyone else been in a similar situation and may be able to offer advice?



My lesson learnt: ALWAYS pay for a FULL COMPREHENSIVE vehicle check, even when buying a full HPI clear car from a reputable dealer.

 

[AlexHealy]

Whilst I completely understand and agree with you, is the time and effort worth £200.

Count your blessings you found out, and look out for a new car. You've been given a lesson, and you've learnt from it.

 

[Daniel]

Nowt you can do, you've taken the money so thats it.

To kick off now is a bit redicluous over £200. Will cost you double that to take it to court!

 

[iimushroomzii]

I'd be glad you found out when you did tbh.

 

[Jimmybs]

As much as I can see your frustration, and I know it is principle rather than cost, I do think that you should swallow your pride and just move on. It WILL cost you much more in legal fees, trust me, this happened to me when i bought my 182, i had it around 6 months and later on in its life i was told that the engine in there was not the original!! All hell broke loose and several grand later I was no better off really.

The only thing I can say for you to do, if you really want to prove a point or pursue it, is threaten him that you will go to the press or somethings in regards to the car being faulty and that the dealer in question should not be trusted and therefore in turn it will affect his potential new business. Trust me if i was a dealer and you said to me I will spread the word that I deal in cars that are dodgy, then i would never risk the publicity, i would give you the 200 back.

Anyway i personally would leave it, but that is one suggestion which could work!

Hope this helps!

 

[SteveS Cup]

I know exactly how you feel mate!

Hopefully you can get another R27 on finance with the £4500 you've got from him.

I guess he may well be as pissed off as you are as he may not have known about the damage either and he's probably realised he's got a shiTTer.

The only time I've bought a car from a dealer ended up in a stupid confrontation and it never got properly sorted.

 

[MCC-182]

I think this is disgusting, how can a dealer sell you a car like that!

 

[R-Sport.]

I know exactly how you feel mate!

Hopefully you can get another R27 on finance with the £4500 you've got from him.

I guess he may well be as pissed off as you are as he may not have known about the damage either and he's probably realised he's got a s**tTer.

The only time I've bought a car from a dealer ended up in a stupid confrontation and it never got properly sorted.

Is it registered as a CAT D??

trader may have bought an unrecorded car & either not known or been shafted himself ( Unlikely though)

S

 

[Beef-Mc]

Might be a wise move to post up the reg number so others aren't caught out as well.

 

[Daniel]

^^^Do this!

I think this is disgusting, how can a dealer sell you a car like that!

What if the dealer didn't know???

 

[The Chubby Pirate]

Did you use a reputible HPi company prior to purchase?

 

[SteveS Cup]

Is it registered as a CAT D??

trader may have bought an unrecorded car & either not known or been shafted himself ( Unlikely though)

S

Nah he said it was hpi clear.

I think there's a fair chance he's been shafted too.

 

[The Chubby Pirate]

Sorry never read the OP's first post

Saying so it could have been damaged and repaired without notifying the insurance company.

 

[W17GLE]

i'd be happy for the 4500k it's far better than getting stuck with the fail car.

 

[Daniel]

Did you use a reputible HPi company prior to purchase?

If its been repaired without the insurance company knowing it won't make any difference though mate.

 

[The Chubby Pirate]

i'd be happy for the 4500k it's far better than getting stuck with the fail car.

In principal id be pissed, if he wanted this lad to buy another car from him he would have gave him the full amount and pleaded ignorance to any HPi reports stating it had been registered as C/D damaged surley...?

 

[W17GLE]

Hpi checks are a bit useless when it comes to crash damage as its easy to repair a car with out informing the insurance company. It is good for finding out if there is outstanding finance though.

 

[The Chubby Pirate]

If its been repaired without the insurance company knowing it won't make any difference though mate.

Aye i just realised the guy said it came back clear, total nightmare situation

You ever had hassle like that?

Who do you use for hpi reports?

 

[SteveS Cup]

In principal id be pissed, if he wanted this lad to buy another car from him he would have gave him the full amount and pleaded ignorance to any HPi reports stating it had been registered as C/D damaged surley...?

It was HPI CLEARED! So the car had obviously been repaired cheaply through a mate and then was got shot of quick.



***EDIT*** I'm too slow!!!!!

 

[jaycc]

It had been repaired using a replacement (red) door and re sprayed, plus chassis damage. Was not registered as write-off on HPI. Used HPI and AA.

 

[The Chubby Pirate]

Did you use a reputible HPi company prior to purchase?

Sorry never read the OP's first post

Saying so it could have been damaged and repaired without notifying the insurance company.

It was HPI CLEARED! So the car had obviously been repaired cheaply through a mate and then was got shot of quick.

Yeah..

 

[SteveS Cup]

see previous post!!!! edited!!!! Sorry!

 

[The Chubby Pirate]

lol

 

[R-Sport.]

see previous post!!!! edited!!!! Sorry!

The OP said the the trader 'said'it was HPI clear-

didnt say he saw the check....


S

 

[Daniel]

Aye i just realised the guy said it came back clear, total nightmare situation

You ever had hassle like that?

Who do you use for hpi reports?

I use Experian. (Well, I buy cars from Seat and BMW and thats who they use)

These are my thoughts...

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=451363&highlight=thinking

 

[SteveS Cup]

The OP said the the trader 'said'it was HPI clear-

didnt say he saw the check....


S

I might just go to bed... I think i've had to apologise on this forum 4 times in the space of 10 minutes! :lol:



SORRY!

 

[Ralphizzle]

Err. very unlucky me thinks!

DAAIM!!! :dead:

 

[_WILL_]

Thank god you didn't find out the hard way, ie it not protecting you in a crash. As said forget the £200 and find yourself another car. Must be a s**t feeling tho.

 

[jaycc]

Thank god you didn't find out the hard way, ie it not protecting you in a crash. As said forget the £200 and find yourself another car. Must be a s**t feeling tho.

Thats exactly how i currently feel.

Cheers for your input guys, i hope this thread acts as a warning to anyone purchasing a used car in the future.

 

[Munson]

f**king pansies. The same pansies no doubt who would have suggested Needster bend over and take a rogering by accepting a car with no documented service history because 'its just easier'.

I'd push for the full refund. He probably sold your 182 for £6k+. The 197 is his problem, not yours. Cheeky c**t.

 

[Ollie82.]

Sounds like the previous owner has binned the car and had the repair done cheap (2nd hand door suggests this, as well as the shoddy chassis repairs) and paid cash.

If insurance were involved and it had had a big enough shunt to do chassis damage it would be sent to recommended repairer and then declared Cat D/C if the repair was too costly, so it sounds like both you and the stealer have been unlucky.

 

[KMB]

I would consider asking to see the sales invoice for your car that was sold - If it's more than he is offering then his argument on high trade-in value is irrelevant.

 

[Munson]

I would consider asking to see the sales invoice for your car that was sold - If it's more than he is offering then his argument on high trade-in value is irrelevant.

Exactly, and the issues surrounding the 197 are not the buyer's problem, they are the seller's. If you buy a DVD player from John Lewis and it doesn't work, do you a accept partial refund on the grounds that they didn't know it was faulty?

The OP has already accepted a lower value for his car offset against the ease and convenience of a part exchange on a vehicle that he no longer has. A full refund is the least the dealer should offer. Whether or not they knew the cars was bent, is completely and utterly moot.

Saying that, I'm no lawyer. It's the general principle.

 

[Revels]

Jesus christ. Let's all give advice about things we have no idea about.

A car is only listed on a HPI report if it's written off.

If you bang it into a post and it gets a new bumper, regardless of it being fixed by insurance or your mate BobbyBill, it won't be listed on any check. Ever.

I'd take what he's offering as you have no hope in court. Surely you should have noticed the door was a different colour?

 

[Mike_182]

FPMSL at the door being a different colour and not noticing!

 

[Munson]

If you're referring to me, I didn't offer advice, just an opinion. I don't like getting fucked over. The dealer should refund the PX price, and I personally wouldn't just bend over.

 

[Revels]

I didn't mean you. But all these people blaming the HPI. Makes no difference.

As Dan pointed out with his advice thread, you shouldn't just take a HPI as gospel. Always put a bit of effort in yourself.

 

[nth]

^^^Do this!



What if the dealer didn't know???

is it not in his interest to know? ignorance isnt ever an excuse, thats if it goes to court anyway.

I'd push for the full refund

agree here

I would consider asking to see the sales invoice for your car that was sold - If it's more than he is offering then his argument on high trade-in value is irrelevant.

what he sold it for doesnt really matter, the dealer can say anything re: price.

the solution sought should be one which returns the op in the the position before the whole transaction.

I p/x my Clio and took the rest on finance.

He has said i can have a refund. However he said he has "sold" my p/x Clio 182. I p/x'd this in for £4700. However he is only willing to refund me £4500 saying "I have taken £200 off because when you go into a dealership with cash instead of a p/x, you have more negotiation potential with price"

I said "what the hell has that got to do with THIS deal?" "Refund me the FULL amount"

I've already lost the car at a low price (could have sold it privately for £5,000+)

He threatend "right, well we will just give you your keys back to the new car, and see you in court, we dont have to do this, its a gesture of good will"

I suppose i've had a lucky escape getting out of the deal with the R27, but i'm angry i've lost out on a great deal of money on my previous car.

I will be taking the £200 situation further (probably through the courts).

My lesson learnt: ALWAYS pay for a FULL COMPREHENSIVE vehicle check

finance not binding?

nonsense

if you take him to court who will cover the legal fees? yes its a matter of principle but this will by far exceed £200, if you win you may get your money back and compensated for all the hastle but is that a risk you are willing to take?
perhaps getting some legal advice would help, as the court route isnt ever the first option.

oh and show him this...

You could argue breach of contract under S.14(2)(b) Sale of Goods Act 1979 that stipulates;
(a) fitness for all the purposes for which goods of the kind in question are commonly supplied,
(b) appearance and finish,
(c) freedom from minor defects,
(d) safety, and
(e) durability.

You're entitled to a refund under 48(B)(2)(a) but this stipulates a refund may be issued under a reasonable time from purchasing goods, however with a 6 month time gap you're likely to fail on this and it'll be a replacement or repair.

however, it could it said that you shouldv made more of an effort to ensure it wasnt damaged/repaired etc

 

[R20 CWH]

name and shame the dealer and the car.

 

[.Ben.]

FPMSL at the door being a different colour and not noticing!

It was originally a red door, but painted black? :S