Interesting (GT5 Vs Forza 3)

[Turkish]

Not looking to start a fanboy flamewar with this thread btw. Interesting that almost at the same time we see trailers with the 458 in from PD and T10. IF PD address the shortcomings in their physics engine and add some more features to spice things up the next few months (assuming GT5 gets a 2009/early 2010 release) could be very interesting for the driving sim lovers amongst us.

GT5
[YOUTUBE]lYCsnEMpFsg[/YOUTUBE]

Forza 3
[YOUTUBE]zdufEmwlpf8[/YOUTUBE]

 

[Scutch]

Good stuff.

 

[Scutch]

The graphics on GT5 there are truly staggering at times.

 

[Nigel]

I was thinking the same Scutch, you can actually see the LED's with in the bootlid brake light. Ultimate detail!

 

[Turkish]

It's just a pity that their in game look doesn't match up to the heavily processed trailers/replays. I guess with Forza (certainly with 1 & 2) is that the in game and replay were both equally average.

 

[BIFCAIDS]

yea, details defo GT's fortay. still think the paint looks pretty flat on forza tho

 

[FiXX]

and remember the gt5 one is a far far far higher detailed car than in game as its only having to show one car on screen and was rendered just for the promo, the in game models certainly wont match that. Meybe if they concentrated on teh game and stoppped making promos for ferrari they could release it this decade and we could get to play it.

 

[Chris n nic]

Yeah it is very good especially the first bit but a little cheeky releasing it just as T10 and no doubt there will be war on forums worldwide of people comparing the two vids when they really shouldn't

Chris

 

[Turkish]

Bit of direct comparison (so long as it's not just childish fanboy flame baiting) is no bad thing. If GT pushes Forza to work on the visuals/presentation, and Forza pushes GT to work on physics and features then we all reap the rewards of that competition. Nothing drives technological advancement harder or faster than war

 

[Hixle]

It's just a pity that the 458 will be an antique by the time GT5 gets released :dapprove:

/troll

 

[oska]

Lick my anus the GT5 one looks good. I watched the Forza one first and was very impressed but GT5 goes one better. Just what they would both be like in game though is another matter, Forza looks damn impressive.

 

[Darren S]

The GT5 one was much more enjoyable to watch and pleasing on the eye. However, if Forza nails it for better realism/handling, then that would be my personal choice.

I'd rather have a bag of chips that tasted superb than a five-course meal with the depth of taste of boiled rice...... if you get what I mean.

D.

 

[oska]

The GT5 one was much more enjoyable to watch and pleasing on the eye. However, if Forza nails it for better realism/handling, then that would be my personal choice.

I'd rather have a bag of chips that tasted superb than a five-course meal with the depth of taste of boiled rice...... if you get what I mean.

D.

Well said. I just hope all the delay will have given them time to pull something awesome out the bag. Sadly I'm not sure they will.

 

[Rich-D]

those videos certainly look impressive, but the trailers always do...

it's all down to the gameplay in the end for me and Forza is more likely to deliver IMO, wheras GT5 will be probably better visually, however I suspect they will both be epic games

luckily I own a 360 and a PS3, so I can have both

 

[Rich-D]

The GT5 one was much more enjoyable to watch and pleasing on the eye. However, if Forza nails it for better realism/handling, then that would be my personal choice.

I'd rather have a bag of chips that tasted superb than a five-course meal with the depth of taste of boiled rice...... if you get what I mean.

ditto :approve:

 

[Turkish]

Same

I'm just hoping GT5 delivers on the driving and experience as a whole not just a superficial visual gloss.

 

[Christopher]

those videos certainly look impressive, but the trailers always do...

it's all down to the gameplay in the end for me and Forza is more likely to deliver IMO, wheras GT5 will be probably better visually, however I suspect they will both be epic games

luckily I own a 360 and a PS3, so I can have both

Nail on the head.

Personally, my money's heavily on F3.

The fact that you can only damage the race cars on GT5 is a complete piss take.

 

[Rich-D]

Thursday can't come soon enough, I soooo want to play the Forza demo!

 

[Seedy172]

Am I not right in thinking that FM3 is now running on the GT5 Engine? And that FM3 also only has damage on a certain amount of cars. Serious question btw. TBH, Forza will no doubt be epic, but i'm still a strong believer in PD... If they are to be believed, a lot has changed since Prologue was released. It wouldn't at all suprise me if they pulled something rather big out of the bag, and soon Atleast that's what i'm hoping, their version of the tribute was STUNNING, simple.

 

[Christopher]

Forza does not use the GT5 engine. It's far, far better. Modelling tyre flex, yaw, sidewall profile etc. Seriously anal stuff.

Forza has damage to every one of it's cars.

 

[The Ironist]

Why is a 458 overtaking an Enzo?

 

[Turkish]

Yup 360 FPS for physics modelling, tyre temperature at multiple points across the width, internal gas temp, fuel weights, chassis flex apparently now too.

Dan Greenawalt described it well when they were at a press event in Le Mans, when comparing it to competitors he mentioned the distance covered between each calculation when flat out down the mulsanne straight as like a flickbook/series of still frames in comparison due to the lower speed physics engines. Which when you think of the adjustments you make to throttle brake and steering makes a huge difference.

 

[Turkish]

Why is a 458 overtaking an Enzo?

An Enzo laps fiorana slower than an F430 Scuderia

 

[BIFCAIDS]

Forza does not use the GT5 engine. It's far, far better. Modelling tyre flex, yaw, sidewall profile etc. Seriously anal stuff.

yea but honestly chirs do you really need that in a game? all that makes me :sleepy: and if GT's going like that :dead:

 

[Turkish]

The details/info might make you bored but the experience/feel of driving wont. The fact they go that indepth makes you able to feel the car is breaking traction, by how much and from which end of the car, you feel suspension load up, wheels loose touch as you hop over kerbs etc. It's difficult to put into perspective but if you play Forza back to back with GT5p it makes GT5 feel very one dimensional, don't get the same feedback and all cars have a tendancy to understeer heavily. If it's a case you can't drive a game that models physics that well as it's too punishing you can leave the traction and stability set to on, you don't get punished in the same way you would with the aids off but you still get the feel of that better physics engine.

 

[Seedy172]

Unless you have a wheel, with some form of feedback (which most people who buy this game wont), your not going to actually 'feel' anything.

 

[Turkish]

Horseshit tbh.

 

[Seedy172]

rofl

 

[Christopher]

LOL!! I don't mean "feel" literally.

Of course you need that detail in a driving sim. It's what makes the game.

GT fanboys (I used to be one) are just pissed because Turn 10 have invested many hundreds of hours in something worth while, instead of pouring hours into how the reflection in a wheel is rendered.

I have no doubt that PD are amazing, but they'll need to start from scratch to even come close to Forza 3, after the shocker that was GT5P. Really.

And don't even get me started on damage... promising damage, then announcing it's only for the race models. Seriously, deary me.

 

[Seedy172]

I do really like forza tbh. Its the only reason I would ever own an xbox, I just can't justify the money involved for that 1 thing. Im certainly no GT fanboy, but I just think their holding back deliberately. They have released very little information, but have mentioned that the physics have been completely revised... anyways, only time will tell I guess. If I could have both, then I would.

 

[BIFCAIDS]

The details/info might make you bored but the experience/feel of driving wont. The fact they go that indepth makes you able to feel the car is breaking traction, by how much and from which end of the car, you feel suspension load up, wheels loose touch as you hop over kerbs etc. It's difficult to put into perspective but if you play Forza back to back with GT5p it makes GT5 feel very one dimensional, don't get the same feedback and all cars have a tendancy to understeer heavily. If it's a case you can't drive a game that models physics that well as it's too punishing you can leave the traction and stability set to on, you don't get punished in the same way you would with the aids off but you still get the feel of that better physics engine.

oh s**t how thick do i feel now, i should have know what all that stuff chris said makes a difference i moan about stuff like that

 

[adam1942]

LOL!! I don't mean "feel" literally.

Of course you need that detail in a driving sim. It's what makes the game.

GT fanboys (I used to be one) are just pissed because Turn 10 have invested many hundreds of hours in something worth while, instead of pouring hours into how the reflection in a wheel is rendered.

I have no doubt that PD are amazing, but they'll need to start from scratch to even come close to Forza 3, after the shocker that was GT5P. Really.

And don't even get me started on damage... promising damage, then announcing it's only for the race models. Seriously, deary me.

i agree with damage but its a racing sim not a crashing sim! also GT5P was not 100% complete it was a demo of what was to come. GT5 will run a full hd 1080p @ 60fps whereas GT5p does not. expect a lot more my friend

p.s i have the logitech gt wheel designed for gt5p and its immense!!

 

[Munson]

GT5p isn't a demo. It's a game. Demos are free.

 

[Turkish]

Demo's/beta's are free GT5p is not, PD cannot hide behind the fact it's a "smaller" product to explain away its shortcomings.

As for the damage and crashing comments it definitely makes an adjustment on how people play the game. Like it or not if people know there is no consequence to hitting another car off the track or braking way too late into a corner they will do so. Meanwhile everyone who's racing as you would do in real life can end up unfairly beaten by what amounts to a cheat.

 

[adam1942]

..btw http://www.gtplanet.net/

 

[adam1942]

GT5p isn't a demo. It's a game. Demos are free.

maybe demo is the wrong word... gt5p is a prologue (hence the name) so its the introduction to the game. I would also like to point out it was released back in 2007? which is a long time in development!

also not all demo's are free

 

[adam1942]

Demo's/beta's are free GT5p is not, PD cannot hide behind the fact it's a "smaller" product to explain away its shortcomings.

As for the damage and crashing comments it definitely makes an adjustment on how people play the game. Like it or not if people know there is no consequence to hitting another car off the track or braking way too late into a corner they will do so. Meanwhile everyone who's racing as you would do in real life can end up unfairly beaten by what amounts to a cheat.

this is true but then again i'll bet that the people doing this (at least 99%) of them are using the standard physics which are sh...! if you try to do that with professional you'll just end up spinning. also if you play online just play the professional levels they are stuck on prof physics!

 

[Turkish]

..btw http://www.gtplanet.net/

I'm well aware of that forum, as are a few others on here tbh.

this is true but then again i'll bet that the people doing this (at least 99%) of them are using the standard physics which are sh...! if you try to do that with professional you'll just end up spinning.

The issue is the actual collision physics, the daft penalty system which is a poor work around for a lack of damage. And the overall understeer that no matter what car what power and what wheels are driven seems to remain almost constant. When you busy the throttle in a high power rwd car exiting a bend you do not push the nose wide.

 

[Munson]

maybe demo is the wrong word... gt5p is a prologue (hence the name) so its the introduction to the game. I would also like to point out it was released back in 2007? which is a long time in development!

also not all demo's are free

It's a way of making the final game cost everyone ~£25 more. End.

 

[adam1942]

I'm well aware of that forum, as are a few others on here tbh.



The issue is the actual collision physics, the daft penalty system which is a poor work around for a lack of damage. And the overall understeer that no matter what car what power and what wheels are driven seems to remain almost constant. When you busy the throttle in a high power rwd car exiting a bend you do not push the nose wide.

I've yet to see that happen in all honesty! stick on the tuned s2000 which is the easiest way to see this go round a corner and plant it and tell me the nose pushs wide with either N, S or R tyres on.

I agree the collision penalty system is crap as is the fact that if you go a tiny bit wide you are hit with a 5 second penalty I can understand if you go off every lap but when you go off once in a blue moon and get b**ch slapped its a bit unfair! especially if you are pushing and trying to defend the line!!

*edit*
again this is with the physics on professional.. also i fail to see how damage would effect the game as if someone smacked in to someone elses car they would both be out which would cause people to start crying.