Engine Braking

[msremmert]

This follows on from a thread I spotted on the PH forum.

How many of you use the engine to slow the car when approaching a set of lights rather than using the brakes?
I like to drop a cog or two as I'm approaching roundabouts where there is clear visibility or when I'm approaching a set of lights in anticipation of them turning green rather than chundering towards them then hitting the brakes.

It's something I never used to really do in my earlier cars but when I bought the 182 I got straight onto practising rev-matching and it's become part of my regular driving habits as I quite liked the smoothness of it all.
My primary question is, is it mechanically sympathetic?
I hear the argument that "brakes are cheaper than gearboxes" and I've heard rumours that swapping the clutch on the Clio is a tawt of a job (though mine is fine) so I was just wondering what everybodys thoughts are.

To be honest I quite like the gurgle the Clio makes when I blip down anyway. :rasp:

 

[JamesBryan]

I always slow down through the gears.

Obviously not banging it into gear and just letting the clutch out, rev match and it'll be fine.

 

[AlexW]

Always done it a bit, when I got a bike it became every time as its a pig going down more than one gear at a time on a motorbike!

 

[DaveDreads]

I always use engine braking on the roads to modify my speed to the conditions,
but not mega high revs.

 

[MartinR]

Use the gears alot as my brakes squeel and do my head in lol.

 

[Andyman]

I usually back off the throttle so it naturally slows up, brake then drop down a cog on approach but not from high speed.

 

[Wick]

I quite literally heal and toe (#hero) into every corner or roundabout.

I cringe when people don't rev match now. Sounds so unhealthy.

Brakes may be cheaper but as long as you are sympathetic, why should it make any difference to gearbox/clutch life.

 

[sbridgey]

I quite literally heal and toe (#hero) into every corner or roundabout.

I cringe when people don't rev match now. Sounds so unhealthy.

Brakes may be cheaper but as long as you are sympathetic, why should it make any difference to gearbox/clutch life.

I do the same, its somewhat satisfying matching the revs and slowing almost to a stop without pressing the brake pedal.

 

[Adamm.]

I usually back off the throttle so it naturally slows up, brake then drop down a cog on approach but not from high speed.

Pretty much exactly this.

Gave up trying to heel and toe on the road. I will rev match if its getting a bit if stick and I want to drop it down a cog into highish revs.

 

[AdDaMan]

LOL at heel and toeing without using the brake

 

[Charlie-silver172]

Not sure if it's me being a t**t but I've found the clio to be abit or a b*****d to heel & toe in,

the mk5 fiesta I had before was the b****cks for it but I've found the clio to be abit harder? :S

 

[barnesautos]

I'm still practicing heal and toe , so pretty much any opportunity I get I'm on in .

 

[msremmert]

Not sure if it's me being a tw*t but I've found the clio to be abit or a b*****d to heel & toe in,

the mk5 fiesta I had before was the b****cks for it but I've found the clio to be abit harder? :S

I struggle to heel-toe due to the throttle being so much lower than the brake pedal. I still try when the roads are deadly quiet to prevent someone piling into the back of me as I lurch around but I'll openly admit I suck at it.

But I find it hugely satisfying coming to a crawl while gurgling through the gears without touching the brake pedal though. :approve:

 

[aucky]

I find it difficult to heel toe much on the road because I don't need o brake every hard. I still do it where I can and rev match to engine brake though. Or if I'm in gear I'll do a bit of left foot braking now and again

 

[llgsimpson]

I do this its been habit ever since I had my old 106 and the brakes wernt all that great, its stuck now though, My wife hates it, she says "how does anybody know your slowing down", suppose she does have a point :/

 

[AlexW]

That is something I sometimes think about it, I do sometimes just touch the brake pedal so the lights come on, on a motorbike I'd just drag the rear brake a tiny bit.

 

[Stu172cup]

The teach you to rev match and select the right gear to be prepaired to make progress

In the IAM courses which I believe are based on the police advanced deivers course

Heel and toe in my old mini have done since - but people are right the brake pedal and accelerator

Are quite distant in level. Im thinking of bending or adding a spacer behine mine in the track car ti remedy this.

 

[NickMelson]

I quite literally heal and toe (#hero) into every corner or roundabout.

I cringe when people don't rev match now. Sounds so unhealthy.

Brakes may be cheaper but as long as you are sympathetic, why should it make any difference to gearbox/clutch life.

This, Heal and toe and rev match every time I slow down/need to stop. Doesn't matter what I'm in I don't even realise I'm doing it now.

 

[pupster92]

I do it all the time no matter if im in the renault master van, the wifes ibiza or the clio. I find some cars dont pick up revs quick enough though to be able to properly rev match. I also like the noise you get from a little blip of the throttle, down a cog and let it run, nice little pop.

 

[Charlie-silver172]

I struggle to heel-toe due to the throttle being so much lower than the brake pedal. I still try when the roads are deadly quiet to prevent someone piling into the back of me as I lurch around but I'll openly admit I suck at it.

But I find it hugely satisfying coming to a crawl while gurgling through the gears without touching the brake pedal though. :approve:

The only way I could h&t in the clio would be if I was slamming on the brakes bloody hard, which by that time I'd be stopped before the clutch pedal went down lol

 

[Chip-mk1]

I tend to use engine braking too, but if not rev matching then remember kids its a LOT easier to change your brake pads and its your clutch you will be putting some of the wear onto that you are saving off your brake pads!

 

[Saul]

I rev match when engine braking, saves wear on parts and makes for a more comfrotable drive! the blip of the throttle sounds cool to ha.

 

[Dan@SJM]

I heel and toe everything I drive. It's second nature to me now. I even did it in 44t article when driving manuals. But the auto/ semi autos do it for you now.

 

[Edges]

How do people find it hard to heel and toe in a Clio? Pedals are perfect for it! I always rev match/heel and toe when slowing down. Yes, I get it wrong time to time but it's a sense of achievement when I get it spot on!

 

[l33th3tr33]

I wanted to learn how to heel and toe about 2 months ago, and practiced at every given opportunity. I went on a beer run last night with my dad and he asked why I was doing it, and at that moment I realised that I'd been doing it every time I've been driving. It's a bit awkward what with the throttle being lower than the brake but it's second nature to me now.

I do agree I'd rather change brake pads than a clutch though!

 

[Dan@SJM]

If you do it right it's better on the clutch than standard driving.

 

[Filippo]

Heel and toe around town...yeah nice one. I would sooner change my clutch every 20,000 miles than sound like a bell end every time I approach a set of traffic lights.

 

[The Fatty]

Not sure if it's me being a tw*t but I've found the clio to be abit or a b*****d to heel & toe in,

the mk5 fiesta I had before was the b****cks for it but I've found the clio to be abit harder? :S

dont literally heel & toe, use the side of your foot on each peddle like this:




if your trying to do the traditional heal flick maneuver its hard as f**k.

 

[MWRS182]

I use rev match and engine braking. I do about 400 miles per week. Engine braking does improve your mpg slightly too as the engine uses next to no fuel during this.

 

[The Fatty]

I use rev match and engine braking. I do about 400 miles per week. Engine braking does improve your mpg slightly too as the engine uses next to no fuel during this.

so same as when you use the brake then?!

 

[Charlie-silver172]

dont literally heel & toe, use the side of your foot on each peddle like this:




if your trying to do the traditional heal flick maneuver its hard as f**k.

Nice I'll give it a shot! Never thought of that haha!

Yeah I was trying the traditional way where you twist your foot around. Easy in the fiesta, near impossible in the clio

 

[BoatNonce]

I only heel and toe when I'm braking hard, but the rest of the time I just come down through the gear I'm in.

 

[Dan@SJM]

so same as when you use the brake then?!

Yes, however you also use your brake pads.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Heel and toe around town...yeah nice one. I would sooner change my clutch every 20,000 miles than sound like a bell end every time I approach a set of traffic lights.

If you do it well then you dont make any noises as you only rev the engine upto what the clutch is going to bring it upto when you engage it anyway.

So if you are changing down at 2Krpm, you rev to 3Krpm ready for the next gear down etc.


Done well it is without a doubt the best way to drive a car to minimise wear on components.

 

[Edges]

so same as when you use the brake then?!

If you coast off throttle for 500 yards you use zero fuel except a little bit when you're blipping it... Or drive 300 of that 500 yards then brake for 200 you're using fuel and brakes where as the former uses niether

 

[The Fatty]

If you coast off throttle for 500 yards you use zero fuel except a little bit when you're blipping it... Or drive 300 of that 500 yards then brake for 200 you're using fuel and brakes where as the former uses niether

or... you could lift off the throttle, apply the brake gently over the 500 yards and use less fuel as your not blipping it at all!!

 

[Andy93]

I rev match everything I drive. It's just a habit now.

I only heel and toe when I'm properly pushing on as I find I need to be quite deep on the brakes to be able to keep steady pressure on the brake pedal while rev matching.

 

[Edges]

or... you could lift off the throttle, apply the brake gently over the 500 yards and use less fuel as your not blipping it at all!!

Then you're still using brakes

 

[The Fatty]

Then you're still using brakes

We are not talking about brakes, he originally said he saved fuel, which is bs

 

[Edges]

The Fatty you have a point there but I was thinking more generally than just fuel