Anyone any good with sound systems?

[Michael Woodford MST]

I have a 2003 Clio DCi

I want to improve the sound system but there are some catches.

I'm not after something that's dedicated to boom boom boom.

I don't want any subwoofers in the boot or anything mounted in the parcel shelf as I use it more often as a van than a car.

I have an Alpine CDE-103BT head units which I've been told is good enough for the job.

Can anyone recommend a good underseat sub and a quality set of door speakers with tweeters? I have been talking to chip about it and I also need something to stop the door speakers playing too much bass?

Thanks

Mike

 

[Ed.200]

Depends how much you want to spend, and the quality of sound you are looking for.

I've used the guys at Car Audio Security in Hayes, and they have always been great.

Underseat slime line sub - http://caraudiosecurity.com/ksc-sw11-compact-active-bass-tube

As for your door speakers, I would have thought the settings from the HU would control the amount of bass going to the speakers, but then age and build quality may also play a part.

 

[Steven103]

Stopping the speakers playing too much bass is simple enough. Hit the "sound" settings button on the head unit, scroll along to "HPF" and set it to 200 (Hz) if/once you've got the subwoofer, or anything from 60-100 Hz depending on how good the door speakers are, until you get a subwoofer.

If you don't want to do any cutting/modifying/feeding wires anywhere and you don't want tweeters stuck/self-taped to the top of the dash: http://www.caraudiodirect.co.uk/pioneer-ts-q131c-renault.html

If you want the exact criteria as above, but want to spend less: http://www.caraudiodirect.co.uk/pioneer-ts-130ci-custom-fit.html + http://www.caraudiodirect.co.uk/con-ct55-05-ct55-05-speaker-loom-adaptor-for-vauxhallrenault.html (for the tweeters so that you don't have to run wires to the door)

To be honest both the above are adequate for a normal person who does not feel the need to occupy car parks at night etc. You do inevitably pay a bit of a premium for the ease-of-fitting.

Obviously you're capable of using a hole saw in your A-pillar etc or drilling through the door electrics connector, but you might not be fussed about faffing around.

 

[SkidMarx]

A decent headunit will have high pass filter to get rid of the low frequencies.

Ive got a pioneer underseat sub and its perfect. http://www.caraudiodirect.co.uk/pio-tswx110a-pioneer-ts-wx110a.html

If your after a decent set up its worth buying Alpines KTP-445 amplifier, Should work with your HU. It boosts the standard headunit from 20w RMS to 50w RMS and it sounds ace, Even through standard door speakers. http://www.alpine-usa.com/product/view/ktp-445/

 

[ThomasBrentnall]

Caraudiosecurity are an excellent company. There's also car audio direct which we get free shipping or some form of discount from!

One of the best things you can do, is sound deadening, especially in a clio as the acoustics are s**t. Makes a world of difference. Then a decent set of components!

 

[Dink]

i'd highly recommend the KTP-445 (not the KTP-455U as you have an alipne hu)

i forget just how loud it is sometimes when pulling into car parks and stuff

 

[Chip-mk1]

If the head unit has a high pass filter then use that, if not a couple of caps will do the same thing.

Then some decent component speakers and an amplified underseat sub.

 

[SkidMarx]

i'd highly recommend the KTP-445 (not the KTP-455U as you have an alipne hu)

i forget just how loud it is sometimes when pulling into car parks and stuff

Yea really is a fantastic bit of kit, Takes 2 minutes to install too.

 

[Michael Woodford MST]

Thanks for all the help guys.

I really like the look of the Pioneer speakers. I like the way they just fit with no messing around.

I'm not after having a sound off in my local McDonnalds but doing about 1500-2000 miles a month, I just want something nice to listen too.

 

[Dink]

imho i'd go for them and a ktp-445 and see what it's like

i run my alpine head unit + ktp-445 on the oem speakers in my polo and can't turn it up above 20 and feel no need for a sub (within reason)

 

[SkidMarx]

A standard head unit will not power those Pioneers to there optimum, They will obviously sound better than standard but ideally you want to be running those from the KTP-445.

 

[Steven103]

Not to hi-jack as this could also help the OP...

I found squeezing the ktp-445 into my my 182 a complete nightmare! Where are you guys, who are saying it's a 2 min install, putting it?

Note I have a stalk adaptor already taking up space, and did not take the dash off. Ended up pushing the ktp-445 "up and to the left" sort of above the glove box.

I had a ktp-445 and the cheaper pioneer custom fits in my Clio. Massive improvement over standard, plenty loud enough and decent sound quality. However it always left me wanting more highs and lows (sub would solve this). I also felt it didn't seem worth the £160 or so it was worth (however maybe I'm unfairly comparing it to my surprisingly good, yet 1/3 the price, 5.1 surround system I use for gaming). Also it's inevitably not as good as £100 speakers on a conventional £50 amp, but then we're back to the argument of being very easy to fit. But then again maybe that's just cars, whatever you spend you'll always want more.

 

[ben lee]

fit a good set of components up front and coaxals in the rear will just sound more clear and crisp than the standard setup no need to stop the bass to them as they will be playing a different range to the sub. could also run a small amp to power the speakers to get the best out of them.

alpine do some great value speakers and underseat subs.

 

[Michael Woodford MST]

Don't know if it makes any difference but I listen to a lot of Trance, Dance, House etc.

 

[Harbinger]

Mike, In my Opinion the best thing to do to avoid thumping bass destroying the trims and rattling the car to pieces would be to invest in some good components for the front, such as Rockfords or Alpine but with Rubber cones not plastic / paper crap, that have a low freq range down to 20Hz is easy to get hold of for £100 a set and rig the lot up with a 4 channel AMP under the passenger seat, Sony make a good one on sale via CAS as above for £100ish, it's what I have. all in cost me under £350 for the lot. but the key thing with speakers is the frequency range, most cheapish ones only go down to 80-100HZ you need down to 20-30hz for good quality, some claim up to 10's of thousands but the human ear can't detect up to half of that iirc.

 

[Harbinger]

Sorry and mount the speakers with sound deadening foam on the backing plates, will absorb resonance and costs minimal to do.

 

[SkidMarx]

Not to hi-jack as this could also help the OP...

I found squeezing the ktp-445 into my my 182 a complete nightmare! Where are you guys, who are saying it's a 2 min install, putting it?

Note I have a stalk adaptor already taking up space, and did not take the dash off. Ended up pushing the ktp-445 "up and to the left" sort of above the glove box.

I had a ktp-445 and the cheaper pioneer custom fits in my Clio. Massive improvement over standard, plenty loud enough and decent sound quality. However it always left me wanting more highs and lows (sub would solve this). I also felt it didn't seem worth the £160 or so it was worth (however maybe I'm unfairly comparing it to my surprisingly good, yet 1/3 the price, 5.1 surround system I use for gaming). Also it's inevitably not as good as £100 speakers on a conventional £50 amp, but then we're back to the argument of being very easy to fit. But then again maybe that's just cars, whatever you spend you'll always want more.

Mines on a Ph1 so maybe slightly different, but remove the radio / outside temp display panel and trim off the dash top.. the KTP just fits just inside the top of the dash.. basically just above the centre heater vents.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Sorry and mount the speakers with sound deadening foam on the backing plates, will absorb resonance and costs minimal to do.

I also suggested to mike it would be worth using some dynamat or similar on the door panels themselves. I used to find that helped when I was playing around with car stereos a lot.

 

[McGherkin]

Can you hear underseat subs from outside the car? I don't like anyone else hearing my music, but I would like a bit more power low down.

 

[Tim.]

It probably depends on how loud you have your music turned up and what the ambient noise levels are like.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Can you hear underseat subs from outside the car?

If on even moderately loud then yes, Bass is very penetrative.
Higher frequencies less so, so if it sounds like you have an even amount of all frequency in the car, outside it will sound like its mainly bass.

 

[SkidMarx]

Can you hear underseat subs from outside the car? I don't like anyone else hearing my music, but I would like a bit more power low down.

Not half as much as big subs in the boot. My setup with an under seat sub still doesnt make as much bass as my friends standard Toureg sound system.

 

[Harbinger]

^ this is due to cone depth, Size and Displacement, the short underseat sub cones do not flex very far compared to regular subs that travel further, and the seat above absorbs a lot of the noise, also if you mount the sub on some MDF under the carpet will improve the quality as it's more rigid.

 

[Dink]

Mike, In my Opinion the best thing to do to avoid thumping bass destroying the trims and rattling the car to pieces would be to invest in some good components for the front, such as Rockfords or Alpine but with Rubber cones not plastic / paper crap, that have a low freq range down to 20Hz is easy to get hold of for £100 a set and rig the lot up with a 4 channel AMP under the passenger seat, Sony make a good one on sale via CAS as above for £100ish, it's what I have. all in cost me under £350 for the lot. but the key thing with speakers is the frequency range, most cheapish ones only go down to 80-100HZ you need down to 20-30hz for good quality, some claim up to 10's of thousands but the human ear can't detect up to half of that iirc.

i'm lost as to where to start with this tbh

rubber cones? bet they sound like they are under water. an ideal cone would be something as rigid as possible while being light.

"average" human hearing range is 20Hz - 20kHz but asking a component to play below about 60Hz is mental

 

[Harbinger]

well here is 35Hz and I found them in Seconds

http://caraudiosecurity.com/ts-e130ci-13cm-components

You know most car speakers are made of Rubber right? as are these ones with a Butyl edge, Material is very important, if you actually check good quality speakers such as Mission and Bose as an example you'll find the cones are made up with Good quality rubber edging, none of this Fibre paper crap.

 

[Dink]

a rubber roll yes but the cones are not made from rubber are they?

yeah might be able to play down 35Hz but it'll ruin the rest of the sound quality (also the 35Hz would be @ something like -12dB)

 

[Harbinger]

It won't ruin it at all, all the cones are made from some sort of polymer, the thing I was trying to get across was not to buy cheap paper crap, and no to get the best sounds range you want the lowest and the high Hz range, you never notice you cannot hear bass out of speakers? it's nothing to do with power so to speak as even a sub at level 1 volume delivers more, it's because it hit's the lowest Frequencies, bigger range = a more capable speaker without the need for large subs to a certain degree, unless you want ear bleeding bass.

 

[Dink]

but you are asking a speaker to do every thing and it is going fail at something and that will be sound quality.

not all cones are made from polymer at all (i had a pair of subs made of metal)

yeah subs are good at bass as that is what they are designed for and will reproduce low frequencies at 0dB

 

[Chip-mk1]

You are getting hung up on the word rubber.

Rigid plastic is what he means I would imagine.

 

[SkidMarx]

Ive got my HPF set to 120hz so it makes no odds to me how low they go, the under seat sub does everything from 120hz down. It just allows me to turn it up more without it sounding shet.

Ive always avoided components just because you've got mess about with wiring, particularly through A pillers and doors etc. KTP-445 and those Pioneers wont sound as good as components amp'd up but for people that cant be bothered with loadsa wiring then they're a perfect compromise

 

[Harbinger]

What Chip said. remember not all " Rubber" is used to rub pencil out and soft flimsy crap.

 

[Jack!]

Bumping this thread.

I've read through a few threads, my current setup is completely standard - advice without having to do lots of work sounds like it's best to just wire in a sub, I don't want to take up boot space, so would like a good underseat sub.

Is there any way to retain the standard HU, or is it best to change it, can the standard HU limit the bass to the door speakers? Can I use a power pack like the KTP-445A with the standard HU? I'm really out of my depth with wiring, what wires would I need to cut or whatever?

Thanks.

 

[.Joe]

Hi Mike, i have an alpine under seat sub that you can have free of charge if like

thanks
Joe

 

[McGherkin]

If he doesn't want it I might.

 

[ckings6056]

Bumping this thread.

I've read through a few threads, my current setup is completely standard - advice without having to do lots of work sounds like it's best to just wire in a sub, I don't want to take up boot space, so would like a good underseat sub.

Is there any way to retain the standard HU, or is it best to change it, can the standard HU limit the bass to the door speakers? Can I use a power pack like the KTP-445A with the standard HU? I'm really out of my depth with wiring, what wires would I need to cut or whatever?

Thanks.

I have a Kenwood under seat sub and it's pretty good.... Retained the standard head unit to. Wiring is pretty easy.
If you get stuck let me know will get the info you'll need (wire colours etc)

 

[Dink]

i'd give the KTP-445U a try first

i use mine with the standard speakers (although not a renault) and it is surprising how loud it goes before it distorts (not sure what gives out first)