cam timing + general not running right!

[Adams_16v]

I took the car to have it tuned on the RR yesterday. He said hed check if the cams needed timing and if so would have to arrange another day, as id originally just mentioned a basic setup with fuelling adjusted etc.

Anyway he rings me back, and says that the car is not running right at all! the idle is seriously too lumpy, and the PPC (i think) reading was over 3 times what it should be. he said its not running anywhere near its best

He said there is no speedo cable signal at all, errors on air sensors, and that the cams are not timed right at all. Said it needs a full day with him to sort properly.

Any views? as im not 100% sure about what he was sayin (partly cos i was concus from a nice right hander i ended up on the end of the other night) and I certainly havent got lots of money to chuck about but I want whatever is best to get the car running to its best.

Was thinking of a visit to GDI!

 

[2 live]

the ppc is all about the mixture mate........

what cams u had put in and what have they ben set to?

if theyre miles out, or fairly hot cams this would happn

 

[Adams_16v]

cams are only fast road spec. 285 i think! they were set to kent standard recommendation, but my idle is proper lumpy as fuk, it chugs. that bloke said it shouldnt chug like that even with wild cams in! i.e they are miles out

so you think that the cams being out would be causing the propane to be over 3 times what it should be?

on the positive side, it means more potential for the engine once its sorted tho dont it.

 

[2 live]

i take it they on an 1800 then lol........2.0s are fairly hot at that spec

aye if the cams are chuckin the fuel in at the wrong time the emissions will get fukt up.like u say tho when the cams are set rite it shud give it a little more scope afterwards

 

[Adams_16v]

yes its an inferior 1.8 lol im pretty sure the cams are that spec, but i know for defo they are just fast road, nothing wild.

best get the fecker setup right then, once iv sorted this damn speedo cable earth.

cheers jon

 

[Paul C]

thats not good at all mate. can he give you any odea on cost? if so see what he has to say about it.

Speak to Andy as he is a top bloke and knows his stuff.

Paul

 

[Adams_16v]

yeah im gonna give andy a ring 2day! im supposed to be on a track day on 27th but dont fancy it if the car aint right

 

[2 live]

cant say i blame u there mate...not worth fukkin it up for the sake of a day or so wait

 

[Paul C]

may as well get smt6 as well!!

 

[Adams_16v]

yeah i thought that matey but funding is a bit low not been working much with exams and that.

 

[Paul C]

not good mate!! well as soon as the exams are over you can get a full time job and waste all your money on cars like me!!

Paul

 

[Adams_16v]

yes defo hehe, thats when its jap turbo time though! but not finished with the valver yet.

 

[u33db]

I wouldnt put too much faith in what the rr guy said about the idling. Hillpower told me that when theyve fitted 285s they always got idle issues so only use 270s now. Given this, the lumpy idle is probably just an annoying side affect of the cam duration in the 1.8 rather than them actually being timed wrong....

 

[Martin]

Quote: Originally posted by Adams_16v on 22 May 2004

yeah i thought that matey but funding is a bit low not been working much with exams and that.

You must be able to find a bit of money somewhere.

 

[2 live]

lol.know the feelin bout funds......cant even think about any more mods til end o next month ....then its ecu/chip time i thinks

 

[Adams_16v]

u33db - i forget the actual cam profile mate, i have that in my head but not certain they are that spec.

the car really does hum like a mofo. ill film it tomorrow so ya can see!

yeah my main prob is im a bloody student! but iv got 1 more exam on wednesday then thats it, after 23 year i can actually finish learning bollox and get me some money earnt!

then its evo time

 

[stan*]

did he say there was false readings on the MAP sensor? if so this will be doen to the longer duration of the inlet cam.

high hydrocarbon readings at idle r due to exhaust gas dilution because of the increased overlap--vacuum in plenum when butterfly is close (i.e. @idle) causes low speed exhaust gas to be drawn back in2 combustion chamber

IMO if he doesnt KNOW these things r caused by "hotter" cams, then u should consider goin elswhere.....

 

[Adams_16v]

didnt mention a false reading on teh map sensor.

He said he would usually be concerned if the ppc reading reached 1000. mine was 3100.

he should know what hes on about, hes a very reputable motorsport tuner round here, but im not thaty clued up so most of what he said went over my head.

 

[stan*]

ok, well if there is a problem with NTC1 (air temp sensor), than that wont be helping fuelling matters....

as far as the MAP sensor goes, its not necessarily always a problem.

wot was she running like b4 u swapped the cams?

 

[Adams_16v]

yeah he said he wasnt getting a air sensor reading. where is the air temp sensor matey?

the car was fine before the cams. but i had the whole engine rebuilt, as the cambelt went on it.

The car was running spot on for months and months bar the lumpy idle, which was never a problem really. The guy who built it said he timed the cams to kent recommendation and that was that.

I went to Hill power for a chip, and nick hill heard the idle and said the cams definately need timing, i cant remember if he said advancing or retarding now as it was a long time back!

Then i started getting the common idling problems, where it would idle low and also cut out when slowing and teh clutch in.

it would also stop popping when this started to happen, whereas before it would pop on demand. iv changed map sensor, CTS, ISCV, potentiometer, lambda, speedo cable, everythin and still not 100% fixed.

im gonna change another speedo cable and check the earth as he said he wasnt getting a road speed signal either. then gonna get the cams timed properly, then the fuelling setup.

its been on a few rolling roads and always produced good power, even as it is now, seems to drive fine as well. hopefully once the timing is sorted and the fuelling it will be a bit quicker

 

[jimbo1]

craig ur running fast road kent regrinds matey. 258degree duration. fairly mild cams.

jimbo

 

[Adams_16v]

rato cheers Jim! i couldnt remember what profile they were. idle shouldnt be lumpy as that with those in really.

 

[jimbo1]

nah it shouldnt chug. it should sound slightly off-beat at idle, but not like a petrol lawnmower! lol

jimbo