Diesel Fault - Injector Related? Help Please

[Squeak]

Calling anyone that has had a fuel related issue for their DCI

HELP ME PLEASE

I have a fault with my MK2 Phase 2 DCI 100. Car just ticked over to 97000 miles BTW


A few months ago I noticed when in 5[SUP]th[/SUP] around 3500 rpm if I put my foot the floor the glow plug light, engine management light and stop light will flash a couple of times for about 1-2 seconds at a time and then go off. If I backed off by ¼ throttle it would go away.

Since then I have done the following:

Wynns diesel injector cleaner run through the tank.
Replaced fuel filter with genuine renault item.
Emptied the contents of the fuel filter into a bag and put a magnet across it. Doesn’t appear to be any crap in it just the filter is breaking down a bit.
I also put some wynns injector cleaner (not a lot tbh) straight into the filter to try and flush it through.
Removed injectors and stripped each of them down to ultrasonically clean each component. (This worked for about a month leak down test improved and fault lights where pushed further up the rev range and only in 5[SUP]th[/SUP].)

At the moment I am currently experiencing:

MPG has decreased
Fault light is coming on more frequently and lower down the rev range, 3[SUP]rd[/SUP] 4[SUP]th[/SUP] and 5[SUP]th[/SUP] gear.
The biggest problem starting from hot is an absolute joke and cranks over for quite a while.

I am putting the car on a snap on diagnostic tonight to rule out anything else (will advise what was said)
I will also be doing another leak down test and try and measure how much diesel is returning.

My questions are

Can the injectors still play up and yet the leak down test comes back as ok?

If I have the components changed in my injectors (i.e Overhauled by a company like Delphi) would they need to be recoded to the ecu?

When companies overhaul them do they replace the components or do they do what I did and strip them down clean and reassemble?

What is the piece of equipment needed to recode the injectors to the ECU?

Should I stop faffing about and just buy new injectors rather than getting them overhauled? Are they likely to fail again?

Is there any other checks I can do? I.E Fuel Pressure check? Check the compression of the engine?

Any help or advise would be appreciated

Thanks Dan

 

[lemonnobby]

Have you cleaned the egr valve.
I use clip to recode injectors
we have had injectors re built in work and they have been fine

 

[Dan@SJM]

I say new Egr valve

 

[Squeak]

I cleaned the egr valve when i first got the car havent done it recently. By rebuilt do you mean with all new components. Dont mean to sound stupid just want to clarify lol

I have a spare EGR valve that i could try but would the EGR valve cause the fault high up in the rev range and the poor starting when hot?

The egr valve that i have is off of a 65hp model i dont know if they are compatible? Is there a simple check i can do to see if it is in fact faulty?

The codes i got off the snapon tool tonight where:

DF137 Rail Pressure Regulation Function
DF137 Rail Pressure Regulation Function
DF137 Rail Pressure Regulation Function
DF247 Flow Capacity function

Also done a leak down test left it running on idle for about a minute. 3 definately looks no good and 4 does look too bad

Pics in post below

 

[Squeak]

 

[Dan@SJM]

Ok ignore my previous post.

What's the fuel pressure on cranking?

 

[Squeak]

How can I check that easily?

I dont know at the moment

 

[Dr HMS Derv Destroyer]

Sounds to me like a pump issue or fuel rail sensor having a hissy fit.

You'll need a good diagnostics tool to read live data.
Once you do, go on live data , watch the fuel rail pressure on cranking.

Definatly not EGR

Ive had this twice on old fuel pumps/injectors.
One pump did what you said fault light wise and codes until it finally started cutting out.
The other was a sticky injector locking open on WOT dropping rail pressure for a few seconds

How did you messure the fuel leak back quantities ? Pulled all four returns off and ran pipes to bottles, also blocking off the inlet to the return pipe on the pump for the leak back from injectors.

 

[lemonnobby]

if you done that leak off test right i would say that injector is passed its best.
pump pressure should be around 300 bar when cranking

 

[Squeak]

Sounds to me like a pump issue or fuel rail sensor having a hissy fit.


You'll need a good diagnostics tool to read live data.
Once you do, go on live data , watch the fuel rail pressure on cranking.


Definatly not EGR


Ive had this twice on old fuel pumps/injectors.
One pump did what you said fault light wise and codes until it finally started cutting out.
The other was a sticky injector locking open on WOT dropping rail pressure for a few seconds


How did you messure the fuel leak back quantities ? Pulled all four returns off and ran pipes to bottles, also blocking off the inlet to the return pipe on the pump for the leak back from injectors.

dont tell me pump lol. I'm sure it isn't as when I cleaned all the crap out of the injectors it was a lot better for about a month.


How can I check that the fuel rail sensor is running correctly?

if you done that leak off test right i would say that injector is passed its best.
pump pressure should be around 300 bar when cranking

I literally removed the leak off pipe work, run a pipe from each injector into a separate bottle and then put my finger over the nipple on the pump to prevent air going back into the system

i take it that's correct?

 

[Dr HMS Derv Destroyer]

I can't remember the actuall running pressures of the fuel rail sensor working properly.

I still have your old pump(from the other DCI) and a rail that I know works sat in my garage , as I got a recon one when I changed my engine lol

 

[Squeak]

I can't remember the actuall running pressures of the fuel rail sensor working properly.

I still have your old pump(from the other DCI) and a rail that I know works sat in my garage , as I got a recon one when I changed my engine lol

I forgot I sold you that pump! I think I need to double check what the problem is before buying things but I am pretty sure the injector is at fault. If it turns out to be the pump I might drop you a message lol

 

[Dr HMS Derv Destroyer]

You can have the pump and rail for postage costs if needs be
Its not like I'm going to need it when I'm taking the DCI engine out for something bigger soon.

I do have a set of spare injectors too but haven't a clue if theyre fucked or not as I haven't had them tested

 

[Squeak]

You can have the pump and rail for postage costs if needs be
Its not like I'm going to need it when I'm taking the DCI engine out for something bigger soon.

I do have a set of spare injectors too but haven't a clue if theyre f**ked or not as I haven't had them tested

Are the fuel pumps the same across the 65 80 and 100 then? I know the injectors on the 100 are not the same.

If you don't mind mate that would be blinding. Is there a way to test the pump on the bench?

Cheers

 

[AlexW]

No, but its really easy to pop the end of the pump off and check for wear inside.

If you need a hand at any point, I have a fair bit of experiance with this after f**king around with it on my Clio and I have a decent diagnostic machine.

 

[Dr HMS Derv Destroyer]

Are the fuel pumps the same across the 65 80 and 100 then? I know the injectors on the 100 are not the same.

If you don't mind mate that would be blinding. Is there a way to test the pump on the bench?

Cheers

pumps all the same, injectors on the 80/100 are different to the 65
its a good pump, you gave me it and i ran it for 6 months without any problems . defo got no swarf in and i ran two filters for safteys sakes

PM you adress and i'll get it sent out ASAP after i finish work this weekend. sort postage out after i send it as i cant remember how much it costs for the weight unless you can rememeber? lol
( will do recorded aswell, otherwise royal mail will f**k up no doubt )

No, but its really easy to pop the end of the pump off and check for wear inside.

If you need a hand at any point, I have a fair bit of experiance with this after f**king around with it on my Clio and I have a decent diagnostic machine.

bearing in mind when you take the end off, watch for the roller pins lol

 

[AlexW]

Yeah, Had so many apart now

 

[lemonnobby]

Roller pins. how hard are they to take apart

 

[Squeak]

No, but its really easy to pop the end of the pump off and check for wear inside.

If you need a hand at any point, I have a fair bit of experiance with this after f**king around with it on my Clio and I have a decent diagnostic machine.

that would be blinding mate where abouts in Essex are you? I live in Thundersley but am always between there and dagenham.

pumps all the same, injectors on the 80/100 are different to the 65
its a good pump, you gave me it and i ran it for 6 months without any problems . defo got no swarf in and i ran two filters for safteys sakes

PM you adress and i'll get it sent out ASAP after i finish work this weekend. sort postage out after i send it as i cant remember how much it costs for the weight unless you can rememeber? lol
( will do recorded aswell, otherwise royal mail will f**k up no doubt )

bearing in mind when you take the end off, watch for the roller pins lol

that is brilliant thanks very much mate I appreciate that pm on the way.

Also removed the dodgy injector again yesterday to get the number off of it and found that I can buy remanufactured injectors for around £132 and then to get them coded on top.

also I have somewhere locally that says they can remanufactured them and no need to recode them for £105+ vat.

going to check the pump out first though

 

[AlexW]

I'm in Great Dunmow (north of Chelmsford from where you are), Will happily pop down for diesel money!

I can re-code injectors too, providing you get the number off the injector.

Colchester fuel injection are very good, but they aren't cheap, circa £130 + VAT IIRC from when I had mine done.

But, check out how much new ones are, I got mine from eBay, genuine renault, were quite cheap, same goes for the pump.

If you want a hand removing the pump, and pulling it apart, give me a shout, Can do the timing belt on these super quick now.

 

[Squeak]

I'm in Great Dunmow (north of Chelmsford from where you are), Will happily pop down for diesel money!

I can re-code injectors too, providing you get the number off the injector.

Colchester fuel injection are very good, but they aren't cheap, circa £130 + VAT IIRC from when I had mine done.

But, check out how much new ones are, I got mine from eBay, genuine renault, were quite cheap, same goes for the pump.

If you want a hand removing the pump, and pulling it apart, give me a shout, Can do the timing belt on these super quick now.

That's not too far.

That's good to know. Im not definitely getting the injectors remanufactured if I do see 4 injectors new for like £400 I will probably do that coz I can at least sell on the 2-3 good ones.

I did have a quick look on ebay but they didn't have the right code I think they were for the 65hp model.

Thanks for the offer ill do a bit more investigation. If I can get 4 new injectors then happy days I will at least know I wont have any problems with them for a while it will prob just be the pump lol

 

[AlexW]

Check the pump before you fit new injectors, Don't want a fucked pump f**king up for new injectors!

 

[Squeak]

definitely will do!

 

[Dr HMS Derv Destroyer]

recon pump is about 250 + surcharge ( excahnge for old pump, you sen old one back after fitting the recon )

thats what i have on mine now, a recon pump but didnt send your one back.

 

[Squeak]

That's not too bad then I thought they were a lot more money than that

how comes you never sent it back?

 

[KangooRS]

dont tell me pump lol. I'm sure it isn't as when I cleaned all the crap out of the injectors it was a lot better for about a month.


How can I check that the fuel rail sensor is running correctly?






I literally removed the leak off pipe work, run a pipe from each injector into a separate bottle and then put my finger over the nipple on the pump to prevent air going back into the system

i take it that's correct?

You will need to blank off the leak off return on the pump and run the engine up to at least 2500rpm for approx 1 min to get a true reading.

 

[Squeak]

big thanks to HMS-Derv-Destroyer for sending me out his spare pump and injector rail thingy.

Ended up getting the number 3 injector reconditioned and the car has been running like a dream since. Only thing I have noticed is that im struggling to get above 54mpg and most of my commute to work (25 miles of it) is 70mph.

 

[Squeak]

Encase anyone has the same problem I ended up refurbing all 4 injectors. 1 went and about 2-3 weeks later so did the other 3