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double clutching,
- Thread starter MOFO
- Start date
MRBILLYUK
ClioSport Club Member
FF Jeden Osiem Dwa
R26
That to me sounds like a pain in the ****. Try heel-toeing instead as the Clio's pedels seem to be just the right distance apart for it. Good guide here: http://motoringfile.com/2005/07/24/heel_and_toe_shifting_made_simple/
-Jaz.
-Jaz.
1. double clutching is something you (used to have to) do on downshifts with gearboxes that have weak synchromesh - like the JC5 in Clio Sports - or didn't have synchromesh at all - like trucks and race cars. You push the clutch in, move the gear lever to the neutral position half way to the next gear, let the clutch out and blip the throttle, then push the clutch back in and move the gear lever into the lower gear. What that releasing the clutch and blipping the throttle does is speed up the gearbox input shaft so its matching the speed that it has to be spinning at for the lower ratio you are going into. These days even trucks have good enough synchros to not need to do it, and racing car gearboxes are either strong enough, have synchro or have motorcycle-type dog clutch gearboxes. You shouldn't need to do it on any modern car unless its got a faulty gearbox. The need to double-clutch in trucks led to some really scary situations. You'd find yourself on a steep downhill with a heavy load, and the brakes'd start fading, so you try for a lower gear to use engine braking to help. But the truck'd speed up when you went into neutral and when you went for the lower gear it'd be going too fast and wouldn't go in. And the more tries you had the more it speeded up. That's why they have those warning signs telling trucks to select low gear now at the top of steep downgrades.
2. flat-shifting - leaving your foot flat to the floor on the accelerator - is something you do on upshifts. Its scary to do if you don't have rev limiter, but virtually all modern cars do. With your foot flat on the accelerator and the clutch in the revs rise, and that gives you are bit more acceleration when you let the clutch out again as the engine gets dragged down to the right revs for the higher gear. Its also called a racing change. Its something you only do when you're racing.
2. flat-shifting - leaving your foot flat to the floor on the accelerator - is something you do on upshifts. Its scary to do if you don't have rev limiter, but virtually all modern cars do. With your foot flat on the accelerator and the clutch in the revs rise, and that gives you are bit more acceleration when you let the clutch out again as the engine gets dragged down to the right revs for the higher gear. Its also called a racing change. Its something you only do when you're racing.
won't flat shifting kill ur gearbox/engine very quickly if done a lot, is it bad for the car?
MarkCup
ClioSport Club Member
Alan said:
Always, and not just when making progress either.
It's essential to prolong the life of your clutch + gearbox, and also helps to keep the car balanced when braking and entering a turn.
MarkCup
ClioSport Club Member
Heel & Toe down-changing - see donofkarma's post above ^^^
BMW M4; S1000 RR
Wow.
I didn't realise this was such a secret... Saying that, I laugh at my friends when they drive, killing cars the lot of them... Oh we'll brake round this corner, yup going fast enough in that gear, change gear, thud... Oh don't worry, it jerks every time...:sleepy:
Seriously though, I don't know anyone that would try this "flat-shifting". I have never heard of it and it's not something I've seen done by any professional driver.
Maybe people with Souped up civics, slipping the clutch on the 1st to 2nd change to stop all that power breaking the tyres loose... Yawn.
BTW, the Clio is one of the worst cars that I have driven for heel and toe. I guess you just get used to it though.
I didn't realise this was such a secret... Saying that, I laugh at my friends when they drive, killing cars the lot of them... Oh we'll brake round this corner, yup going fast enough in that gear, change gear, thud... Oh don't worry, it jerks every time...:sleepy:
Seriously though, I don't know anyone that would try this "flat-shifting". I have never heard of it and it's not something I've seen done by any professional driver.
Maybe people with Souped up civics, slipping the clutch on the 1st to 2nd change to stop all that power breaking the tyres loose... Yawn.
BTW, the Clio is one of the worst cars that I have driven for heel and toe. I guess you just get used to it though.
BMW M4; S1000 RR
Alan said:
i do it all the time.
my mum always knows when im coming back lol
182cup & 172 racecar
not nessesary on a road car
Tony Hunter said:
Correct, but it's a superb feeling when you're pressing hard on some lanes (not been on track) and when you release the clutch on the downshift, the car is perfectly balanced and not uspet by the sudden engine braking. It just feels 'right'. I can get it right maybe 1 in 5 times, but I'm getting better
BMW M4; S1000 RR
Not nessecary ???
Sure, if you like clutch shopping.
I know the effects certainly aren't as severe on a Clio (apart from maybe the modified ones on here with turbos or throttle bodies).
If you shift correctly your clutch lifespan will be 2 or maybe 3 times greater than if you just slam it into gear without rev matching.
Sure, if you like clutch shopping.
I know the effects certainly aren't as severe on a Clio (apart from maybe the modified ones on here with turbos or throttle bodies).
If you shift correctly your clutch lifespan will be 2 or maybe 3 times greater than if you just slam it into gear without rev matching.
i dont double de clutch as its not neccasary unless popping into first, the box copes fine with simple heel&toe.
And to note, i have never changed a clutch on any of my private cars. Both of my cars have clutches that are on their last legs and i've been driving it like so for the last, what, 30,000 miles on the clio and 20,000 on the subaru. And that includes several track days and driving like a bell end on the road.
And to note, i have never changed a clutch on any of my private cars. Both of my cars have clutches that are on their last legs and i've been driving it like so for the last, what, 30,000 miles on the clio and 20,000 on the subaru. And that includes several track days and driving like a bell end on the road.
Roy Munson said:Correct, but it's a superb feeling when you're pressing hard on some lanes (not been on track) and when you release the clutch on the downshift, the car is perfectly balanced and not uspet by the sudden engine braking. It just feels 'right'. I can get it right maybe 1 in 5 times, but I'm getting better
Ditto Roy.... When you get it right, it makes perfect sense.
A friend of mine evern said - "Your car is very smooth when you change down though the gears" I just smiled to myself. lol.
I also find I can do it well in my trainers, but really struggle in my shoes. lol.
it was ma mate that first showed me in his old style mini about blipping the throttle on the downshift
ever since a started learning a have down it
at low speeds it just makes the gear change smooth
and when going at it, it makes all the power come straight into play no need to wait for the revs to catch up with the road pace = instant power
ever since a started learning a have down it
at low speeds it just makes the gear change smooth
and when going at it, it makes all the power come straight into play no need to wait for the revs to catch up with the road pace = instant power
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