Drivers side click/clunk problem, help please, video inside

[guysy]

I've developed a new problem with the 182... since ive had the car its been fine but since having it I noticed a very slight sound when moving off, whatever it is has developed into a clunk when turning corners or over bumps and is increasing now..

I've just jacked the car up and tried the top to bottom left to right test on the wheel, top to bottom is fine, so that rules out the lower ball joint i guess, left to right there was a noise which you can hear in the video but it sounded like it was in the middle of the car and definitely not the outer track rod.

To be honest i wasn't sure how to test, because the wheel moved a lot left to right because i was jacked up one side, i think i need to get it on some ramps for someone to have a look but the noise was inside where the steering rack was, its only on 53k i was hoping for it to be a simple outer track rod :dead:

So far ive lowered the car in Sportlines (so im wondering if the tracking is heavily out, causing a problem), and the thing im wondering if its put more strain on things is changing the dog bone (meaning i had to tension the engine back slightly to get the bolt into place), Renault revised it and its caused vibrations and no good at all so im going to change it back until i get a powerflex kit.

Quite pissed off because my exhaust is also blowing and my door half fell of the other day after the hinge pin worked its way loose.

Can someone give me any advice please? vids will be up in a min.

 

[guysy]

After some reading im thinking possibly inner tie rod? or steering rack mounts?... and im wondering because the new dog bone is so tight, and i haven't adjusted any other mounts, if i revert back the nocking might go because nothing is under strain... i don't want to adjust my other mounts to suit the dog bone because its making my exhaust stick too far out.

And now i think about it that noise in the videos doesnt really sound like it would make a clunk so maybe its normal... and the problems elsewhere?

 

[guysy]

Taken it for a drive, trying to figure out what it is, i can feel the clunk through the pedals, its mainly when im turning i.e reversing out of a bay etc, over bumps...

Any advice on what ive given please? tomorrow, im changing the dog bone back to the old one because after i changed it i realised it was fine anyway, then im going to try and diagnose the problem, if i cant its going to a garage to get it up on the ramps monday and see if a mechanic can tell, didnt want this at xmas time i need the car, it obviously drives fine its just a clunk but i dont want it getting worse or possibly breaking off, whatever it is.

 

[Bluebeard]

Should have bought my Racing Blue!

 

[guysy]

Haha yeah maybe

 

[MartinR]

to me that looks like a strut top mount problem. jack it up grab the suspension strut and try and move it about or watch it as you move the wheel about like in you're video , if its very wobbly/lose i would say the rubber on top of the strut has gone/broke away! personaly i would not drive it!

 

[guysy]

I was thinking this, but everything looked fine when changing the springs over, im wondering if the wheel alignment was slightly out before lowering, and then really out after lowering, combined with the stiff dog bone mount causing whatever it is to clunk... ill have to go through the motions of fault finding..

Probably Dog bone > wheel alignment check> outer track rod> wheel alignment.... see if it solves it, otherwise the revised top mount washer ill need to try.

When i move the wheel in the video, is that fairly normal anyone?

 

[MartinR]

I was thinking this, but everything looked fine when changing the springs over, im wondering if the wheel alignment was slightly out before lowering, and then really out after lowering, combined with the stiff dog bone mount causing whatever it is to clunk... ill have to go through the motions of fault finding..

Probably Dog bone > wheel alignment check> outer track rod> wheel alignment.... see if it solves it, otherwise the revised top mount washer ill need to try.

When i move the wheel in the video, is that fairly normal anyone?

not normal at all mate the wheel should not move about like that. it shall have nothing to do with the dog bone mount.

check all suspension mountings/bolts ,ball joints,track rod ends wishbone bushes....... everything.

who done you're springs? was the the strut assembly re-assembled correctly?? be careful if you do drive it but i would'nt

 

[guysy]

Yeah, your right about the dog bone, im just over thinking things,

I changed the springs, ive changed springs over before on other cars, everything was right and ive just been outside and the top mounts are tight.

I will have a check tomorrow and get someone to see if the top mounts are moving badly, i still think its a joint of some sort the noise thats being made, either the inner tie rod or the outer track rod.

Edit: watching the video with the wheel off the ground, its supposed to have some movement in it isnt it? its not supposed to be rock solid? i take it rockers your saying that is way to much play?

Tomorrow i will check it all out

 

[guysy]

After viewing the video in post 12, im thinking drive shaft ? :dead: bloody hell

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?595355-HELP!-Steering-quot-Clunk-quot&highlight=clunk

If i get my wheel at the right point and wiggle it it sounds the same but less clicky, rough price for a new drive shaft? and opinions please?

 

[guysy]

Anyone got any advice for me? im going to get the wheel off, check every things tight and use a pry bar like ive seen in a video to see if i can find a click in the outer track rod soon.

 

[Jon.G]

After viewing the video in post 12, im thinking drive shaft ? :dead: bloody hell

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?595355-HELP!-Steering-quot-Clunk-quot&highlight=clunk

If i get my wheel at the right point and wiggle it it sounds the same but less clicky, rough price for a new drive shaft? and opinions please?

I never updated it, but I was looking at this problem on my car yesterday. We were able to replicate the noise by having the car on a ramp and shaking the wheel, when you grip the tie rod, you feel all the play. I'm booked in to get them changed just after Christmas.

Looking at your second video, yours moves ALOT more than mine. Dangerously more. I'm not 100% but yours looks like more of the inner tierod, as everything moves on yours. Just the outer seemed to move on mine.

Its not the driveshaft though, I thought it was as my CV boot split and pissed grease everywhere.

EDIT: here is another video of the tie rods, which sounds EXACTLY the same as in my video.

Yours does sound slightly different though.

 

[guysy]

Cheers for the reply, the wheel did move a lot 9-3 position, but it was jacked up funny because im on a sloped drive, going over to my grandads flat drive to inspect and ill take some new videos.

 

[guysy]

Today i got the drivers wheel off and felt for movement, you can see in the video there is play from left to right, not any top to bottom

after that, i felt there was quite a click in the outer track rod, very clicky so i think thats my problem, and i didnt have the wheel off the other side but i felt the track rod and its also very clicky... so i will be replacing both... and having the wheels aligned to check if that solves it

I took the drivers track rod away from the hub, gave the inner tie a good push and pull and i couldnt feel any movement...

Disc test:

Clicky ball joint, definitely needs replacing?

Inner tie rod test, it looks like theres some movement but i couldnt feel any its just the rod going up and down as well...

So overall im still wondering... both track rods definitely need replacing imo, the drivers i could click a fair bit... if the problem still stays ill have to try some top mount washers?

 

[Dan1587]

In post 2, the second video, there is defiantly something wrong!

Might be worth getting the joints you've found changed then have another look!

 

[guysy]

Yep, I think theres just a lot of play in them so they need replacing and will be, my wheel alignment is probably way out... before/lowering/fucked track rods... so ill sort that first then go from there

To top it off my cat to mid silencer clamp was very loose and blowing, i went to tighten it and it snapped! nightmare!!! another is on the way

 

[Jon.G]

Did you have both wheels off the ground when you tried today.

Your original video you can see the movement in the tie rod pretty well. Doesn't seem like your really moving the disc tbh, We had to move my wheel side to side (9 + 3) quite aggressively to move the tie rod.

If you sit in your car, with the key in the barrel (no engine on) and move the wheel from side to side can you replicate the knocking. (wheels on the ground)

 

[guysy]

Nope i didnt, just one wheel off the ground... i have a video with the wheel on and it does show some fair movement, but all the wheel nuts where loose because i wasnt thinking...

I havent tried with the key in, engine off, i will tomorrow. But with the engine on going full lock to lock i can sometimes get it to make the noise... i guess i need to try like you say with just the key in, engine off.

How much would i be looking at to change the inner tie? id do it myself but last time i found out you need a special tool.

 

[Jon.G]

No idea on inner tie. I've heard its a Renault only job due to the tool, but I believe Fred made his own.

I can replicate the knock so easy with the engine off and the car sitting on the drive. Happens every time I put steering lock on.

 

[guysy]

And yours is both outer track rods mate?

Cheers.

 

[Jon.G]

Just the drivers side where it makes the noise. But I'm getting both replaced as if it does go, I'd have to do tracking again anyway.

 

[guysy]

Yep, i will do the same, and have the tracking done in one go, then if it hasnt fixed the problem ill have to look elsewhere.

 

[guysy]

Ok here is the vid of me testing side to side, at this point i only had 3 bolts in thats where slackened on the floor as usual, the locking nut was out... so im not so sure if its showing the movement of whats wrong alone or the lose nuts adding to it...

It looks like the wheel is moving but not the disc so much, might need to try this again with nuts tightened up tomorrow, although in the first vid i posted you can see the movement and somone said thats too much.

Way to much movement for just a track rod end?

Thanks.

 

[Dan1587]

Is your steering racks secure? Like u said earlier it looked like it had massive amounts of play!
Your clicky ballpoints need replacing anyway so do that first then see what happens, it looks like inner tie rods to me.

 

[Fred@BTM]

that's knakcered!

 

[guysy]

Why did this have to happen now! All the work shops are going to be closed for xmas and holidays etc

I can replace outer tracks but if the inner needs doing one or both sides whats the point!!

Its gone from fine to clicking within 4 days, I'll have to try the side to side test soon with the nuts tight and see if theres still that play.

 

[guysy]

Well i got the front end off the ground, and tested both wheels, the passengers side's outer track rod is also SHOT! passengers i can feel is the track rod end alone because the inner rod doesnt move.

The drivers track rod end is also shot, and i think there is also some slight play in the inner rod because that is moving also.

But the main play is in the outer track rod ends, the inner on the drivers will be done if there's still play after i do the ends.

Really should have spotted this earlier but i had no noises before a few days ago.

EDIT: estimate for inner tie rod to be changed at a garage because i dont have the tool?

 

[guysy]

Heres the videos, just for anyone searching in the future so they can see... mine are really bad! somehow in the last 4 days theye decided to show themselves to me, and im glad ive caught them, absolutely fucked both sides.

Like i say passangers as far as i can tell at the moment is just the track rod, but i think after i do the drivers it will need the inner replaced some time soon after, even though theres not a massive amount of play in the inner tie.

Ive tried the top to bottom test on both and theres not much or any movement in either, seeing at the track ends are so bad, should i change both ball joints? or just give every thing a test when ive done the ends tomorrow.

Fucked!!

 

[MartinR]

bloody hell guysy i have never seen any with that much play before lol hope you sort it bud!

 

[markfishy]

Just read this thread,before going to bed,
Full credit for all the efforts.
The lower ball joint is quite tricky to check . I have a favorite pry bar which is flat and narrow. you need to try to prise the ball joint downwards away from the wishbone, should be no movement, but it will flex twist.
The track rod end, check by pushing up while friend moves hub side to side. as you relieve pressure you will feel/ see movement come back,
Same test works for inner rod end joint. This time try to push finger into the rubber gaiter and feel for the ball. move hub again and try to determine movement betwen ball and socket.
Inner joint is not for home work.
hope this helps if not call me to book car in,
regards mark 01279 431628

 

[guysy]

Just read this Mark, cheers for the help, if there is movement after the outer rods i will be giving you a call very soon, seeing you are in Harlow is top news for me, again ill give you a call soon if needs be.

Thanks.

 

[guysy]

So to finish this thread up, i think i found the cause of the clunk.... the passengers side outer track rod had excessive play in the joint, so much so that once upon a time the bolt was tight connecting to the hub, but the extra play ment the bolt had about 1mm play :S, so i am fairly sure that was the cause of the clunk, it made the same sound tensioning it up and down...

The passnegers side was changed and it reduced the play massively, however i can feel some very slight play in the inner tie.

The drivers side which was the worst improved with the new track rod, however with that out i could still get a fair bit of play with the inner tie, after the new rod was connected up and the wheel on i could still move the wheel side to side a bit..

Wheel alignment has been carried out so the car is back on the road, the small play on the drivers side will just mean i take it easy when driving until the inners are changed.

Rough estimate for both inner ties to be replaced??

 

[Jon.G]

Good to hear it. Renault only job on the inner ties as it requires a special tool. Fred made one, buts he's quite far from you.

 

[guysy]

I was watching a you tube video the other day, completely different car but it was a shoe horn tool i think he called it with a extension to undo it... What type of tool is needed?

I know its worthless me paying for the tool if i could even get it, but other specialist mechanics are going to have this tool aren't they? not just Renault only?

 

[markfishy]

Can do it guysy very approx £200,
regards mark