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Gotta say thanks to Rich as his the one who suggested to use the swissvax onyx and menzerna stuff, cheers for all the info fella much appreciated on abit of an off note was reading one of your replys to a thread and you said to try the sonus drying towel, thought id get one and give it a try and my god its so much better than a chammie (sp) makes drying the car a 5min job and leaves no scratchs, i actully didnt mind drying the car for once lol