Gearbox failure

[Henry]

Not great timing but my gearbox appears to have failed today and I’m hoping for a little advice.

I was reversing at the time and the car just cut out. I noticed that the clock had reset itself and wonder if there was an electrical interruption as it failed.

Anyway, it’s now stuck in gear (presumably reverse) but the gearlever is free to move around into reverse, first and second although it won’t go fully home into third, fourth or fifth.

I’ve had a good look at the linkage mechanism and am as sure as I can be that it’s an internal problem. Don’t know a great deal about gearboxes but I’m guessing that the selectors have failed – can anyone confirm?

Also – is this DIYable and how much might it otherwise cost if an indie specialist were to remove, repair/replace and refit?

Not at all impressed with it TBH!

Thanks

 

[JR]

will it drive ?

 

[Gaz_]

so the engine cut out?

 

[SBV116]

That doesnt really make sense, if the gearbox is shafted it shoudl still start/run fine with your foot on the clutch!

 

[Henry]

the engine did cut out and i couldn't restart it initially as it took me a couple of goes to twig that it was locked in gear.

it will start with the clutch depressed but is immobile as it stalls as soon as you let the clutch out. now i think about it, it must actually be stuck in one of the higher forward gears.

it's all very strange as the gearlever is free to move as described - it's just that it's actually locked in gear. it's as if the connection between the gearbox internals and the selector mechanism on the outside of the box has gone

 

[SBV116]

Right, so the clutch seems to be working ok, as it wouldnt start at all, when you move the lever around if you look on the top off the box can you see if the linkages are moving?

 

[Henry]

i've actually been underneath it to have a good look whilst someone shifts the lever through the gears and the linkage and the rod coming from the box are moving normally (although it won't fully engage 3rd, 4th or 5th) - the odd thing is that reverse, 1st and 2nd do actually appear to be selectable, yet it's locked in another gear

it won't let me pull away and i don't want to risk damaging the clutch by feathering it; i'm guessing it's stuck in 5th or 4th

thanks for the help by the way

 

[SBV116]

Weird one then fella, And very difficult to diagnose without looking, but it seems you have an internal fault of some sort in the box! Bugger!

 

[Henry]

^ i think so too; i've read a bit about the fact that they're weak and haven't been at all impressed with the shift action but i was rather hoping it would have lasted me more than 6 months!

 

[bmh.01]

They're not weak they just don't like abuse simple as. It could probably be repaired but you won't know whats wrong with it until you split the box. If you can't do it yourself it'll probably be cheaper to get a new box in it.

 

[Gaz_]

Exactly. Its all about mechanical sympathy imo. I've done approx 60k in Reanultsport clios and not had any gearbox problems. Infact i've never had a broken gearbox in any car, and they've all been driven pretty hard imo..

 

[Henry]

i've been careful to drive around the gearbox, having been aware of its reputation from the outset. i've no way of knowing how its previous owners treated it though - just unlucky i guess

 

[JR]

Could be worth speaking to gloucester road gear boxes or mr clutch does gear boxes iirc.

 

[DrR]

I'm the new gearbox king, it's fucked. Looking at about 1k bill

 

[Henry]

^ i've caught bits of your story - real nightmare!
what was the diagnosed failure on yours; similar symptoms? and how does your £1k breakdown?
.
Justin - thanks for that; have made a mental note

 

[DrR]

Mine never failed though, just crunched loads and it pissed me off as it was embaressing to drive.

Gearbox from Renaul refurbed is £575ish at trade price!!!! Might as well fit a new clutch, £100ish and rest is labour.

 

[Henry]

thanks

 

[lemonnobby]

Sounds very internal to me, if it was me i would build the revs and slip the clutch to see if it does move. You never know if it might come out of gear.

 

[SBV116]

Exactly. Its all about mechanical sympathy imo. I've done approx 60k in Reanultsport clios and not had any gearbox problems. Infact i've never had a broken gearbox in any car, and they've all been driven pretty hard imo..

What does that say about me then? And i think you drive harder than me!:rasp:

 

[Fred@BTM]

i bet 5th gear has popped off, happened to a car that i looked after, exact same symptons

 

[Gaz_]

Exactly. Its all about mechanical sympathy imo. I've done approx 60k in Reanultsport clios and not had any gearbox problems. Infact i've never had a broken gearbox in any car, and they've all been driven pretty hard imo..

What does that say about me then? And i think you drive harder than me!:rasp:

sympathy

 

[DrR]

Treat it like a woman firm but gentle.

 

[Henry]

i bet 5th gear has popped off, happened to a car that i looked after, exact same symptons

i'm assuming something must have failed to have allowed one of the gears to slip - is it just a case of 'popping it back on again' or would the box need a rebuild?

 

[Dan 172]

I recently had a new box in mine, done at Renault.

IMO they do seem to be weak, I treated mine well and it's done most of it miles on the motorway. But it still failed at 40k, 4 years old.

Your looking around £400 to remove and replace the box and then what ever you pay for the box.

 

[SBV116]

I recently had a new box in mine, done at Renault.

IMO they do seem to be weak, I treated mine well and it's done most of it miles on the motorway. But it still failed at 40k, 4 years old.

Your looking around £400 to remove and replace the box and then what ever you pay for the box.

If you only payed £400 at renault labour that was cheap!!

 

[Ad]

there seems to be a spate of box failures at the moment, but traditionally its not something that has been an issue with 1*2s. Granted they are aging now.

 

[lemonnobby]

if 5th has popped mate you need to just put a new bolt in as they come lose and pop out. there is a black casing on the end which comes off in there is 5th gear. havent seen that for a long time though.

 

[Henry]

^thanks for that

G'Road Gearboxes took it away today; they've said they'll remove the end cover to see what they can see before deciding whether or not the box needs to come out

 

[lemonnobby]

Glad to see you getting something done. let me know how you get on. did you get that other problem fixed?

 

[Henry]

still got that other thing to sort; Renault Tech have apparently advised that it's not detrimental so that's helping for the moment!

i'll post details once this gearbox thing is sorted - might also be useful to those using search

 

[JR]

Glad you are getting it sorted Henry, how much did GRD Gboxes quote ?

 

[Henry]

^cheers; looking at between £100-200ish if it's an end cover off job or £700+ for a reconditioned box, fitted. obviously not the best time of year for it and it's doubly inconvenient as i start a new job week after next and need the car for it.

i'll give it this chance but, given some of the other bother i've got/had with it, i'll have to seriously consider getting rid if it keeps on like this.

shame, as i really want to like this car

 

[lemonnobby]

shame to hear that mate. if there is anything you want give me a shout

 

[Henry]

^thanks for the kind offer chap – appreciated. if it behaves itself for a little while, i could be doing with a spare key - can you pick those up on the cheap in exchange for a little something?

anyway, the gearbox; i’ve been told that 5th gear has friction welded itself to the shaft; they suspect that the box has been run low on oil at some point. this does make some sense as one of the problems i’ve identified with this car is a noisy diff (which had quietened with an oil additive).

excluding VAT, a reconditioned box is £465 and labour, £250. total cost (including VAT and some sundries) is over £900. i’ve been told that the clutch isn’t even half worn so that seems to be the only silver lining.

hopefully it’ll be improved as i get it back. the little f*ck*r!

thanks to all for the replies

 

[ben_p]

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=258911

i wrote that guide

 

[Henry]

ta - i had a little look at that

if i had a longer period of spare time available before this job, i'd have considered the DIY approach - :dapprove:

just out of interest, the cheapest used box i could find over the x-mas break was £400 (although they must be around for far less than that) - so certainly possible to do for much less. second hand is a big gamble though, in my experience (!).

 

[Dan 172]

Mike at Rentech had a gearbox for sale of his 172, I was going to have it.

He may still have it???

He quoted me alot cheaper than £900 mind, with a new clutch fitted.

I would definately put a new clutch on though, as if it goes thats £400-£500 please, at specialist.

 

[Dan 172]

I recently had a new box in mine, done at Renault.

IMO they do seem to be weak, I treated mine well and it's done most of it miles on the motorway. But it still failed at 40k, 4 years old.

Your looking around £400 to remove and replace the box and then what ever you pay for the box.

If you only payed £400 at renault labour that was cheap!!

I think it was about £440+VAT from Renault for removal and fitting.

Most other garage quoted me around £350-£400.

 

[Henry]

aye - cheers for the thought but the deed is done now; picking it up tomorrow

this place (Gloucester Road Gearboxes) are charging £300 labour but then i guess that may be at a reduced rate as i've had one of their boxes too - ?

book time for removal is 7 hours according to the search function - ?

 

[Dan 172]

Yep, I think 7 hours is about right.

I only went to Renault as, there are at the bottom of my road and I got Renault Uk to contribute to the costs.

I got a refurbed box, new clutch and one drive shaft for £700, with a years warranty on the box.

Whats your reg start with mate? I always see a few Cups out and about.