Group N timing tool/trick?

[mark123]

I've seen this mentioned in a couple of threads recently.

So what is it?

I'm guessing a tool to advance the inlet cam a bit?

How far can you go and what are the gains?

 

[mwn11]

What ive read is that gets you abit more top end and mid and a little less at the bottom end.

 

[MicKPM]

Correct, it simply sets the inlet cam position to a slightly advanced position to give some gains though I've still not seen any figures from using this tool yet (I'm keen to buy one and offer it as an option for my timing belt service). You use this as oppsed to the standard camshaft locking tool when setting the timing.

 

[CraigIrl]

I take it it's for use on standard cams only.

 

[Aaron182]

Dont people advance 428 catcams aswell ?

 

[olliewebbuk]

Dont people advance 428 catcams aswell ?

To stop the lumpy idle, I believe.

 

[mark123]

So does the tool have a fixed amount of advance or is it adjustable?

Just wondering how much the advance is.

You won't improve the idle by advancing the cam timing - as a general rule advancing gives you more power up the rev range at the expense of lower revs e.g. poor idle.

 

[olliewebbuk]

It's fixed. See here: http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?597835-Semi-GR-N-camshaft-locking-tool.

 

[Andyrg@ ClioTurbo]

I removed my VVT pully and had a pully machined to fit, and have had a tool made to advance the inlet cam by 8degrees

 

[Cupman29]

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I removed my VVT pully and had a pully machined to fit, and have had a tool made to advance the inlet cam by 8degrees

Fancy including them with the block?

 

[Andyrg@ ClioTurbo]

LOL, not a chance I have my Original Tools out on hire ATM, but that one goes no were

 

[mark123]

It's fixed. See here: http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?597835-Semi-GR-N-camshaft-locking-tool.

Thanks

 

[Riley!]

please someone do a dyno of the results

 

[Cookson]

Awaits the "oooohh, but youre timing is out, this will f**k your engine"

 

[MicKPM]

The only worry I have is that if this "Group N" tool is used to advance say +8 degrees what happens when the dephaser pulley eventually starts to play up and introduces even more advance in the form of 'play'... do we get bent valves? Obviously its a risk you boys take if you do this to your own car but one I have to warranty if I do it hence me not jumping about to buy one just yet.

Mick

 

[Andrew Cooke]

My MK1 eyeball suggests ~25deg of advance, which sounds like an awful lot, does a group N use the dephaser?

 

[Andyman]

To stop the lumpy idle, I believe.

428's are not lumpy cams mate - Their probably smoother than standard lol

If you advance the inlet on a 428 you do get more power right the way through the rev range

 

[Riley!]

The only worry I have is that if this "Group N" tool is used to advance say +8 degrees what happens when the dephaser pulley eventually starts to play up and introduces even more advance in the form of 'play'... do we get bent valves? Obviously its a risk you boys take if you do this to your own car but one I have to warranty if I do it hence me not jumping about to buy one just yet.

Mick

do +7 to be on the safe side

 

[Cookson]

do +7 to be on the safe side

Or just take it to NWP and let them do the timing?

LOL

 

[Andyrg@ ClioTurbo]

The only worry I have is that if this "Group N" tool is used to advance say +8 degrees what happens when the dephaser pulley eventually starts to play up and introduces even more advance in the form of 'play'... do we get bent valves? Obviously its a risk you boys take if you do this to your own car but one I have to warranty if I do it hence me not jumping about to buy one just yet.

Mick

mick your right and i personally would not do thsi using a VVT pully

Andy

 

[Riley!]

Or just take it to NWP and let them do the timing?

LOL

I've heard doing the timing adjustment with a hammer works a treat for them

 

[Cookson]

I've heard doing the timing adjustment with a hammer works a treat for them

I think they refer to it as a "knocking stick", but yeah, seems to work fine for mine