Help understanding wheel alignment/tracking/wear

[Ally]

OK, I've just had new tyres fitted after the last tyres did this:

This was the front driver's side. The front passenger side was similar but not quite as bad.
Wear is on the inner edge.
Remaining tread was still above the legal requirement.
Car is on standard suspension.

I'm still trying to get my head around alignment/tracking/etc, but if I had to guess at it I'd say there's too much negative camber, but my suspension isn't adjustable for camber so I'm stumped :S

Any suggestions?

Cheers
Ally

 

[f0xy]

ditto to this, im running -0.5 camber on the fronts, and ive just taken these off :O

 

[Big Bob]

if your camber isn't adjustable then my guess is you have too much toe out where the wheels point away from each other.

i take it that the car hasn't been in a bad accident as camber could be off due to bent body.

 

[Ali]

ditto to this, im running -0.5 camber on the fronts, and ive just taken these off :O

-0.5 would not do that mate! The Vee runs more than that with less effect.

Ally although the car didn't look to be running camber, i'd imagine it would be a good few degree out on the neg side. - 9/10 cars are easily adjusted for camber correction.

 

[Ally]

This goes from bad to f**king worse...

My replacements are from the dodgy batch of Goodyear F1s made in Thailand, gonna have to get them replaced again...

b****cks

 

[f0xy]

aye ali....didnt think it could....just someone mentioned it to me! i was thinking what was mentioned above maybe? the toe is completely fookered?

problem is, if i want it tracking, i have to take the wings off and drive it to the garage as they cant track it as it is

 

[Big Bob]

aye ali....didnt think it could....just someone mentioned it to me! i was thinking what was mentioned above maybe? the toe is completely fookered?

problem is, if i want it tracking, i have to take the wings off and drive it to the garage as they cant track it as it is

wings off why ? ..........

 

[Fred@BTM]

because his is too low like mine

i do mine myself now

thats excessive toe thats caused that

 

[Big Bob]

surely you could just take the wheel off to adjust or adjust it on a ramp.

 

[Fred@BTM]

nope, its getting the equipment to fit the car thats the problem when they're seriously low

 

[Big Bob]

i got ya now cant get the equip on to measure thats the pob i thought that you meant the adjustment.

 

[Fred@BTM]

adjustment is the easy part! i had to remove my rear bmper to do mine

 

[Big Bob]

that would be just a bit too much hassle for me i think.

 

[Fred@BTM]

LOL yeah hence why i now do it myself with my sepcial tool

 

[Ali]

We've got the equipment to do Very low cars, racecars etc! So it's not a problem!

 

[Fred@BTM]

fishing line!

 

[stan*]

If its been seriosuly lowered this will induce neg camber, hence the wear shown.

Wear due to toe/tracking is seen across the width of the tread due to scrubbing, often described as feathering.

 

[Djw John]

Yeah looks like toe out issue causing that, from above would look sorta like

\ /
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[stan*]

if your camber isn't adjustable then my guess is you have too much toe out where the wheels point away from each other.

i take it that the car hasn't been in a bad accident as camber could be off due to bent body.

It would be more likely to be out due to worn suspension joints/bushes, but as I said its more likely down to lowering.

 

[Ally]

Yeah looks like toe out issue causing that, from above would look sorta like

\ /
| |

Cheers John

I've got it limited down to being either too much toe-out or too much neg camber, will get it looked at after I've got my tyre issue sorted out.

Cheers
Ally

 

[stan*]

does it tend to pull from side to side or feel twitchy??

 

[Ally]

does it tend to pull from side to side or feel twitchy??

It was feeling a bit twitchy which leads me to suspect too much toe-out. Am I thinking correctly? Seems to go straight ahead though without pulling to any side though.

 

[stan*]

The wear your experiencing is down to negative camber...as I said a few posts ago.
wear due to tracking kinda picks/scratches the WHOLE surface, due to the way the tyre scrubs across the road....this isnt what we have here.

IF it was EXCESSIVE toe causing that, you would be experiencing adverse handling effects.

 

[phoenix1]

tracking just use two straight edges against the wheel rim/tyre and measure front and back of the rim/tyre with a tape measure . the difference is your toe. laser tracking is only as accurate as the guy fitting the gear at best + - 0.50mm
most motor sport teams use a fixture that mounts of the stub axles front and back with a string that runs from front to back then measure with a ruler to the rim.

 

[Ally]

The wear your experiencing is down to negative camber...as I said a few posts ago.
wear due to tracking kinda picks/scratches the WHOLE surface, due to the way the tyre scrubs across the road....this isnt what we have here.

IF it was EXCESSIVE toe causing that, you would be experiencing adverse handling effects.

Cheers, I understand where you're coming from, but you also seem to think my car's lowered - it's not, it's on standard suspension. Hence why I'm concerned if it's down to negative camber as it's not adjustable. AFAIK there's no way of adjustign the camber on standard SEAT suspension like you get with coilovers, etc. I had a -1.5 deg camber set up on my 172 and never experienced tyre wear anything like this...

 

[stan*]

ok, i must have got the wrong end of the stick when someone mentioned yours being lowered...(i think!).

Is your suspension in general in good order? worn ball joints/bushes will lead to your geometry being all over the shop.

 

[Ally]

(was stupid busy yesterday and unable to get back online)

Stan, I wish it was lowered LOL (actually it sits quite nicely but a set of Eibach Pro's wouldn't go amiss). The suspension seems to be in OK condition: car is almost 2 years old, 25k miles, I've only owned it for 4 weeks though. From what I gather it was previously used mostly on A-roads around Torquay and m'way journeys, so there shouldn't be excessive wear. I was driving it last night again at higher speeds and it does tend to wander around a bit, but there's no unusual noises or damper leaks. Visually and mechanically it seems OK (tried wrenching the wheel around but no play).

I'm waiting to get my new tyres replaced (ended up with the dodgy non E marked Goodyears F1s, the illegal ones, bloody typical of my luck...) then I'll get the car inspected and set up by a garage I trust. They'll soon tell me if there's more to it than my first impressions.

Cheers
Ally