New Renaults are Gash. Discuss

[Turkish]

So youve had a sh*t experience grow up and get over it. Yes its unfortunate and yes you arent alone but not all of us have had problems with the product or dealers. If you want we can all post up here and fill the forum with "my cars great and so is my dealer" posts, but i would have thought it would be more constructive to use bandwidth on helping the poor sods who have had bad experience by offering help and advice.

I work in the motortrade and i can tell you that ALL manufacturers WITHOUT exception have issues with build, design and staff quality. At the end of the day cars are designed built PDId sold and serviced by humans all of whom do make mistakes from time to time.

 

[007]

Every car maker has problems with build quality. Its just a pity the French have more than most.

I am a member of a lot of forums and there are complaints on every forum. I would never buy a new car anyway but if I did French would be bottom of the list below Fiat.

Our Golf at work has been the least reliable out of the company cars - Mondeo, Focus, Astra & Golf. Our all time least reliable company car is a Xantia - it just fell apart over the 3 years. Was in the garage every single month - worst thing is it was that reps 2nd Xantia and the 1st wasnt much better!

Our last Laguna was fine after the first 2 months but for those 2 months everything went wrong. I nearly crashed when the powersteering failed while in a car park LOL. It suggests that there is no quality control as once all the faults from new were fixed it was fine for the 3 years.

 

[Swervin_Mervin]

Quote: Originally posted by Loony on 21 December 2004
So youve had a sh*t experience grow up and get over it. Yes its unfortunate and yes you arent alone but not all of us have had problems with the product or dealers. If you want we can all post up here and fill the forum with "my cars great and so is my dealer" posts, but i would have thought it would be more constructive to use bandwidth on helping the poor sods who have had bad experience by offering help and advice.I work in the motortrade and i can tell you that ALL manufacturers WITHOUT exception have issues with build, design and staff quality. At the end of the day cars are designed built PDId sold and serviced by humans all of whom do make mistakes from time to time.


I dont need to grow up. I wanted to get a feel for why everyone puts themselves through the hardship of modern renault ownership. I get the iompression most do it out of fierce loyalty.

As for ALL makes having problems, does that include those that finish top of the JD power surveys? If so what the hell are they doing better than renault to finish so highly.

Forgive me, but Im just trying to get my head round the mentality of someone that would buy a new car, safe in the knowledge that it will probably half its time in the garage being fixed.

 

[Lee]

You cant get a better new car for the money that does/did what the 172/Cup/182 do.

And I think weve covered that its not just Renaults. The thing with Clios is Renault shift a hell of a lot of the things, so there are always going to be what looks like a large amount that have problems because theres a lot of them out there.

I dont question why people buy old beaters?

I have no brand loyalty, I buy the car I want. Simple as that.

 

[fizzy_drink]

I dont want to upset anyone, but we get what we pay for dont we?





(Omar hides under his desk)



PS If your car had "serious" trouble, you can always contact your finance company, and they can help resolve issues with Renault (I know someone who got a few thousand pounds back from Renault by writing to RFS).

 

[Turkish]

I think you must be living in a fairy tale land where german and japanese cars dont suffer any issues and every dealership that sells them is free from fault. Ill say this slowly so it sinks in I WORK IN THE MOTORTRADE AND NO MANUFACTURER IS FREE FROM FAULT. Im on my second brand new renault and this one so far along with the dealer has been faultless as was the last one (i had for 2 & 1/2 years and 27k miles) so explain to me where me being safe in the knowledge it will spend half of its time in the garage being fixed comes from ?

 

[Lee]

Come to think of it, its beyond me why anyone would want to spend the same amount they spent on the actual car just keeping it on the road each year. Some might say enthusiast, others might say idiot.

Personally I dont care as long as the owner is happy with what they chose to do. Who are we to pass judgment anyway?

At least we get everything done under warranty, and I doubt Ill have the car long enough for that to run out.

 

[Turkish]

ive just walked back from my car and im sorry to tell you that my brand new 182 doesnt have rust in the rear 1/4s over the arches, doesnt have a leaky sunroof, doesnt have a seized torsion bar, doesnt have worn seats, carpets, balljoints, gearshift links, shagged bulkhead heatsheild to repair. im must be a fool if only i hadnt spent as much i too could enjoy the delights and financial benefits a 10 year old car can give me.

 

[Swervin_Mervin]

Loony, I asked what the other manufactueres do to finish top of the surveys then, if they have problems as well?

And I know someone that used to work for Renault and said theyre the sh*ttest in terms of build quality hed ever worked for. And it isnt just the Clios. Its all of em. Meganes, Vel Satis, and Lagunas.

And Renault might shift a lot of clios but that isnt why it looks like more have problems, its because more have problems. Do you see the same return rates for other small cars?

 

[Turkish]

Quote: Originally posted by Swervin_Mervin on 21 December 2004

Loony, I asked what the other manufactueres do to finish top of the surveys then, if they have problems as well?

And I know someone that used to work for Renault and said theyre the sh*ttest in terms of build quality hed ever worked for. And it isnt just the Clios. Its all of em. Meganes, Vel Satis, and Lagunas.

And Renault might shift a lot of clios but that isnt why it looks like more have problems, its because more have problems. Do you see the same return rates for other small cars?




Speak to someone who works for a certain italian supercar maker with a prancing horse as a logo and ask what their build quality is like. The reply will more than likely be "f**king appaling"

JD power surveys top results go to the manufacturers with least problems dont kid yourself that they suffer from NONE.

 

[Swervin_Mervin]

Quote: Originally posted by Loony on 21 December 2004
ive just walked back from my car and im sorry to tell you that my brand new 182 doesnt have rust in the rear 1/4s over the arches, doesnt have a leaky sunroof, doesnt have a seized torsion bar, doesnt have worn seats, carpets, balljoints, gearshift links, shagged bulkhead heatsheild to repair. im must be a fool if only i hadnt spent as much i too could enjoy the delights and financial benefits a 10 year old car can give me.


neither has mine mate, so ner.

 

[Swervin_Mervin]

Quote: Originally posted by Loony on 21 December 2004

Quote: Originally posted by Swervin_Mervin on 21 December 2004Loony, I asked what the other manufactueres do to finish top of the surveys then, if they have problems as well?

And I know someone that used to work for Renault and said theyre the sh*ttest in terms of build quality hed ever worked for. And it isnt just the Clios. Its all of em. Meganes, Vel Satis, and Lagunas.

And Renault might shift a lot of clios but that isnt why it looks like more have problems, its because more have problems. Do you see the same return rates for other small cars?
Speak to someone who works for a certain italian supercar maker with a prancing horse as a logo and ask what their build quality is like. The reply will more than likely be "f**king appaling"JD power surveys top results go to the manufacturers with least problems dont kid yourself that they suffer from NONE.

I dont expect NO problems mate, but they ust be doing something considerably better than Renault. Why cant renault do the same?

 

[fizzy_drink]

My 182 had no real trouble in its first 12k. It was then sold.

My megane had some worrying trouble, but was all sorted (now at 18.5k)
1)J link on steering broken twice now
2)Front suspension noises and pull to left
3)Water in storage compartments
4)Exhaust fell off


My 96 N reg 1.2 Versailles has 180k on it, and broke down only few times (only once in the first 3 years):
1) Fuel relay switch - warranty @ 20k
2) Timer belt went @ 65k - £500 job
3) Filter/Carb problem, cant remember what it was @ 170k
4) Corroded ignition cable, changed in 30 mins @ 160k

Guess youll get a mixed bag with any manufacturer, but I agree that Renault could do with a bit more attention to detail, after my megane experience.

 

[chris182]

I owned a megane from new for 5 years, 62,000 miles and all it ever had was a new water pump, under warranty.
As has been said, no make, or model is perfect.
M8 owns a polo, 5 years old and falling apart, 40,000 miles and covered in rust.
Another mate ordered a new golf in black, had to wait ages because of the colour, and when it came it was navy blue, dealer couldnt give a toss, just said take it or leave it.
This is the same VW dealer that i went to for info on a new golf when i bought the megane, over 5 years later im still waiting for a return call.

 

[Swervin_Mervin]

Quote: Originally posted by omar on 21 December 2004
My 182 had no real trouble in its first 12k. It was then sold.My megane had some worrying trouble, but was all sorted (now at 18.5k)
1)J link on steering broken twice now
2)Front suspension noises and pull to left
3)Water in storage compartments
4)Exhaust fell off
My 96 N reg 1.2 Versailles has 180k on it, and broke down only few times (only once in the first 3 years):
1) Fuel relay switch - warranty @ 20k
2) Timer belt went @ 65k - £500 job
3) Filter/Carb problem, cant remember what it was @ 170k
4) Corroded ignition cable, changed in 30 mins @ 160kGuess youll get a mixed bag with any manufacturer, but I agree that Renault could do with a bit more attention to detail, after my megane experience.


Has anyone had a Megane that doesnt leak? Many of the problems Renaults suffer from dont just seem to be poor build on the line, but utterly poor design of elements in the first place. Why should a customer then ahve to bring the car back in for a know fault that has affected thousands of others as well?

 

[Turkish]

Quote: Originally posted by Swervin_Mervin on 21 December 2004


Many of the problems Renaults suffer from dont just seem to be poor build on the line, but utterly poor design of elements in the first place. Why should a customer then ahve to bring the car back in for a know fault that has affected thousands of others as well?



speak to a mini owner and ask them about the dozens of faults on them that dont get sorted and ask them why they paid a sh*tload more than a car of the same size with less spec as standard.

 

[chris182]

Quote: Originally posted by Swervin_Mervin on 21 December 2004
Quote: Originally posted by omar on 21 December 2004My 182 had no real trouble in its first 12k. It was then sold.My megane had some worrying trouble, but was all sorted (now at 18.5k)
1)J link on steering broken twice now
2)Front suspension noises and pull to left
3)Water in storage compartments
4)Exhaust fell off
My 96 N reg 1.2 Versailles has 180k on it, and broke down only few times (only once in the first 3 years):
1) Fuel relay switch - warranty @ 20k
2) Timer belt went @ 65k - £500 job
3) Filter/Carb problem, cant remember what it was @ 170k
4) Corroded ignition cable, changed in 30 mins @ 160kGuess youll get a mixed bag with any manufacturer, but I agree that Renault could do with a bit more attention to detail, after my megane experience.


Has anyone had a Megane that doesnt leak? Many of the problems Renaults suffer from dont just seem to be poor build on the line, but utterly poor design of elements in the first place. Why should a customer then ahve to bring the car back in for a know fault that has affected thousands of others as well?


Mine didnt, unless you count the water pump

 

[Lee]

Civic Type R owners have their fair share of issues, but Honda keep that quiet.

I will say my old mans 96 P Celica 1.8ST has been faultless since the day he had it!!

 

[fizzy_drink]

I cant speak for others, but as soon as I showed the service team my soaking maps, they knew what it was straight away, therefore I agree that something could have been done to aviod it.

BUT, you dont know half of my dads Merc experience.

He had a 190E.... Holy sh*T, it was a trouble car alright.
Trim, mechanical, you name it, it went wrong! Sold after ten years... New air con about 3-4 times. Five new water pumps. Drivers door trim changed at least 3 times. Everything fell apart eventually (ps it was in Dubai, where its quite hot, but still, a shameful Merc indeed).

So its not just us Renault owners is it?!

 

[Lagerlout]

Swervin_Mervin, are you in the market for a new car?

 

[Swervin_Mervin]

Mercs are becoming reknowned for their lack of interest and poor build as well though.

Mr Lout, nope. But it has provided a reasonable discussion for the past few hours this thread dont you agree?

 

[Funkyjahooner]

Its been said many times but its true,you do get what you pay for.

I got my 182,my first Renault based on its performance and standard equipment and it has yet to dissapoint me.

I didnt buy it based on build quality,dealer reputations or posts on car forums.Had any of these been an issue id be driving something else.I could not and will not spend several thousand more just to be able to lay claim to it being "Better built" and the fact i get coffee and a mint when i pop into my dealer.Nothing can compete with the 182 for value and performace which is why i own one.

It would piss me off tenfold to buy a so called better quality car and find it has its problems like all cars do at some point.

For the record my dealership has been fantastic throughout the sale and aftersales,doesnt matter which dealer it is because my point is there ARE good Renault dealers about,Oh and they do a smashing coffee and free newspapers to take home

If you want better build and better dealerships they you pays your money.I went to London last year to buy a Tiffany ring,fantastic service and experience ill never forget but boy i paid for it,i could of gone to Samuels and got a decent enough ring but without the service and experience.Everything has a price and its the same with cars...you pay for what you get.

 

[Swervin_Mervin]

Missed again. Take a look at what other small cars compete with Renault at the same price and check their service. Given Renault are THE worst it will probably be much better.

 

[Turkish]

I disagree, the perception of better build quality isnt correct, plus the cars that tend to have the supposed better build quality are often the most dull, uninspiring, boring to drive cars in their class. Id sooner have a fun car that MIGHT suffer a few niggles than a faultless one that bores the sh*t out of me to drive. Depends on if you view a car as a tool that needs only to perform its function to fulfill your needs or a hobby/interest and something that you get enjoyment out of.

 

[007]

Quote: Originally posted by Loony on 21 December 2004

I disagree, the perception of better build quality isnt correct, plus the cars that tend to have the supposed better build quality are often the most dull, uninspiring, boring to drive cars in their class. Id sooner have a fun car that MIGHT suffer a few niggles than a faultless one that bores the sh*t out of me to drive. Depends on if you view a car as a tool that needs only to perform its function to fulfill your needs or a hobby/interest and something that you get enjoyment out of.

I agree on the fun to drive but niggles bit - or I wouldnt be driving a 13 year old Fiesta LOL

 

[Lagerlout]

Quote: Originally posted by Swervin_Mervin on 21 December 2004

Mercs are becoming reknowned for their lack of interest and poor build as well though.

Mr Lout, nope. But it has provided a reasonable discussion for the past few hours this thread dont you agree?

Reasonable indeed!!

I just think you ought to go onto other forums and check the problems that other cars have. I think youll find that ultimately Renault are no worse than Peugeot, Citroen, Ford, Vauxhall, Fiat in terms of reliability or levels of service/quality of dealerships.

 

[Lee]

Ever owned a new Renault Swervin_Mervin?

 

[Funkyjahooner]

I have had 3 nightmare dealers in the past,a Ford,Citroen and Vauxhall.All 3 of these were worse than my current Renault dealer by a long long way.

 

[taylorski]

A mate of mine has a cooper s and experienced many samll problems, the thing is any car enthusiast will notice and be more critical of problems with their cars, no mater what the car.

 

[Swervin_Mervin]

Yes Lee thnks. Then I let my mum experience the joy. Its been in for warranty work since shes had it as well, including dying completely and not letting her get in to the boot.

Upon my purchase (from Bolton) the dealer kindly noted the faults I picked with it and said theyd be sorted on collection. They werent. The handbrake wasnt bolted to the floor properly and came off in my hand, an employee had left all of his personal details in the glovebox, the same employee had left hot rock burns in 3 of the 4 seats, it had half the tool kit, various coins and pens and other crap rolling about under the spare. A few months later they finally agreed to pay for repairing the seats after me being told on the day to bring it back when they werent dishing out the new reg cars to others. Then a few months later one of the oil seals went and leaked oil on the the clutch.

At the same time the dealer tried to rip me off for the £300 above book price he was giving me for my Xsara due to it supposedly have a few dodgy bulbs, no brakes and a leaky suspension strut. An independant MOT proved this to be horse-sh*t. Not surprising given Citroen Manchester had just carried out a major service on it and done a good job.

When the dci was in Manchester for the repairs to the clutch and oil seal they tried to get me to have new pads and discs as they claimed the pads were 80% worn and the discs were warped. Upon inspection the discs were fine but not trusting them I said dont bother, Ill do it. And if theyre 80% worn after 18k miles then Ive got a few thousand left on the 20% havent I. I bought some new ones anyway but as it turns out ehy were only 50% worn.

It was the dealership experience that was the most gauling though. And not being able to find a good one in the whole of Manchester and surrounding is very shameful for renault.

[Edited by Swervin_Mervin on 12/21/2004 5:53:29 PM]

[Edited by Swervin_Mervin on 12/21/2004 5:56:17 PM]

 

[specialK]

Quote: Originally posted by Swervin_Mervin on 21 December 2004

Quote: Originally posted by Loony on 21 December 2004


So youve had a sh*t experience grow up and get over it. Yes its unfortunate and yes you arent alone but not all of us have had problems with the product or dealers. If you want we can all post up here and fill the forum with "my cars great and so is my dealer" posts, but i would have thought it would be more constructive to use bandwidth on helping the poor sods who have had bad experience by offering help and advice.

I work in the motortrade and i can tell you that ALL manufacturers WITHOUT exception have issues with build, design and staff quality. At the end of the day cars are designed built PDId sold and serviced by humans all of whom do make mistakes from time to time.

I dont need to grow up. I wanted to get a feel for why everyone puts themselves through the hardship of modern renault ownership. I get the iompression most do it out of fierce loyalty.

As for ALL makes having problems, does that include those that finish top of the JD power surveys? If so what the hell are they doing better than renault to finish so highly.

Forgive me, but Im just trying to get my head round the mentality of someone that would buy a new car, safe in the knowledge that it will probably half its time in the garage being fixed.

excuse me but read my post about doing over 200k miles in Renault Clios in 3 years with only one of them being off the road for 2 days - then grow up like Loony says, old is not better, we have a 16v in the garage, and compared to a 172, 182 it is horrible to drive - and we have done probably about 1000 miles in it and it has broken down - so dont try and tell me its a hardship to own a new Renault.

 

[Lee]

So you had a particularly bad experience and now you are very bitter about it. Understandable.

Neither my 172 or 182 have ever been off the road for any faults. My old Rover 200Vi (6 months old) was in the shop for weeks at a time with an oil leak they couldnt find.

It doesnt matter how much trouble I have, I will always prefer to purchase a new car provided Im in a position to do so.

 

[Funkyjahooner]

Quote: Originally posted by Swervin_Mervin on 21 December 2004

Yes Lee thnks. Then I let my mum experience the joy. Its been in for warranty work since shes had it as well, including dying completely and not letting her get in to the boot.

Upon my purchase (from Bolton) the dealer kindly noted the faults I picked with it and said theyd be sorted on collection. They werent. The handbrake wasnt bolted to the floor properly and came off in my hand, an employee had left all of his personal details in the glovebox, the same employee had left hot rock burns in 3 of the 4 seats, it had half the tool kit, various coins and pens and other crap rolling about under the spare. A few months later they finally agreed to pay for repairing the seats after me being told on the day to bring it back when they werent dishing out the new reg cars to others. Then a few months later one of the oil seals went and leaked oil on the the clutch.

Very kind of you to "Let your Mum" have a Renault...

You were daft accepting a car under these conditions upon collection,Im assuming you took the car under these conditions because you said it was a few months later before they agreed to pay for the repairs.You should of rejected the car.

 

[Swervin_Mervin]

Kathy, why am I being childish? I thought it seemed like a reasonable area for discussion. And Im not bitter in the slightest. I just find it funny that so many people have problems and keep going back for more.

The 182 seems to be far worse thant he 172s have been. It always seemed like the 172s just went in for the 4k rattle.

Theres a couple of new 182 problem threads every day FFS!

And it is a hardship as I see it. If youre happy to pay that kind of money for such poor quality then its your choice, but saying you get what you pay for is exactly the attitude that results in them continuing to not give a toss customer service time. Why is that so hard for you all to see?

I know you 172/Cup/182 owners can be quite stout sometimes when it comes to defending your cars but come on!

 

[chris182]

Quote: Originally posted by Swervin_Mervin on 21 December 2004
Kathy, why am I being childish? I thought it seemed like a reasonable area for discussion. And Im not bitter in the slightest. I just find it funny that so many people have problems and keep going back for more.

The 182 seems to be far worse thant he 172s have been. It always seemed like the 172s just went in for the 4k rattle.

Theres a couple of new 182 problem threads every day FFS!

And it is a hardship as I see it. If youre happy to pay that kind of money for such poor quality then its your choice, but saying you get what you pay for is exactly the attitude that results in them continuing to not give a toss customer service time. Why is that so hard for you all to see?

I know you 172/Cup/182 owners can be quite stout sometimes when it comes to defending your cars but come on!


that kind of money so what else you going to buy, brand new with the toys and performance. Its not like theres a lot of choice is there?

 

[stu8v]

After 14 weeks without my 172 i got it back, the dealers did a poor job of refitting trim. ie it came off in my hand and i later found a slight dent in the bonnet. The standards are poor and attitudes stink this is not what i expect from a main dealer and Renault UK.

Everything is endless arguments to get problems solved, they only want to fob you off.

I will never buy another Renault.

After 6 years of owning a Lancia Integrale the 172 has given more trouble in 9 months than the Lancia did in the entire time i owned it.

Roll on next year and an EVO 6/7

 

[Funkyjahooner]

Why dont you try being a bit stout and defend your car instead of letting a dealer walk all over you by driving away in a car with the problems you have highlighted then waiting a few months for them to sort it.

Accepting you get what you pay for does not mean you have to stand for poor customer service or repairs or attitude.Being stout as you say has worked 100% of the time for me with every dealership i have had problems with.They can not give a toss as much as they like but if im right and can prove it i will make it my aim to force them to sort it by whatever means i have to.An example would be rejecting the car above you described.

In 1995 i rejected 2 brand spanking new Astra Sports because they were not right,it took several months of driving around in the first new one for the time being until the second came which i rejected for not having a standard alarm before taking new car number 3.By the same token i accepted i was getting what i paid for and loved car number 3 despite it being a top of the range Astra at that time and not a top of the range Bmw.

 

[Turkish]

Quote: Originally posted by chris182 on 21 December 2004
Quote: Originally posted by Swervin_Mervin on 21 December 2004Kathy, why am I being childish? I thought it seemed like a reasonable area for discussion. And Im not bitter in the slightest. I just find it funny that so many people have problems and keep going back for more.

The 182 seems to be far worse thant he 172s have been. It always seemed like the 172s just went in for the 4k rattle.

Theres a couple of new 182 problem threads every day FFS!

And it is a hardship as I see it. If youre happy to pay that kind of money for such poor quality then its your choice, but saying you get what you pay for is exactly the attitude that results in them continuing to not give a toss customer service time. Why is that so hard for you all to see?

I know you 172/Cup/182 owners can be quite stout sometimes when it comes to defending your cars but come on!


that kind of money so what else you going to buy, brand new with the toys and performance. Its not like theres a lot of choice is there?


a cooper s for example i worked out would be 18.5k for the same spec as a 172/182 comes with as standard. The car is slower, the boot pitiful the build quality is not better than a renault and in alot of cases its far worse and dealers wont even give discounts or do deals because they know they can sell them ten times over for image conscious saps who will happily pay screen price.

 

[Lee]

Mervin, you are commenting on things you know nothing about. How do you know the 172 didnt have as many problems when it was launched? Did you own one? You werent a member on here so didnt read about it. In fact I dont think CS was around in its current form then.

I had a 172 and it had exactly the same faults as my 182, none major, just niggly. The 172 covered 22500 miles in 15 months, was quarter miled lots and never once let me down or spent more than a day at a dealers. The 182 has been to Spa, the Nurburgring and has done 9.5k in 5 months without letting me down once.

You started this thread with the title New Renaults are Gash. Discuss. Whats the point in discussing it with a narrow minded person as yourself who has already stated that they are gash?

God its cold out there, hope your car starts later. )]

You didnt answer my question about why people feel its sensible to spend a few grand on a car then have to spend the same each year just keeping it on the road? I find that just plain stupid, but thats just my opinion.

 

[Turkish]

My 172 was great never had any problems with it. The only things that i replaced were tyres and brakes worn out through driving it hard. It was fun reliable and great VFM, there is nothing for the money that can touch it IMO. The dealers i have dealt with locally have both been spot on and always looked after me so i have nothing but good things to say about Renault. Im not saying they are perfect nor that its the best car you can buy. However your being totally close minded to the fact that owning a Renault can be an enjoyable and hassle free experience. I now have a 182 and im hoping it will be the same experience if so ill be more than happy with it.