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RARB, needed with track spec coilovers?



Seems a bit of a grey area regarding a RARB when a 1*2 is set up on decent track spec suspension, some say it helps others say due to the stiff nature of track spec coilovers and springs it wont do much at all. Got AST's on mine with 450lb front and 600lb rear springs and just wondering peoples thoughts?

I've ran the coilovers with it detached at one end on track as it was wet and the car felt great, but I'll give it a go hooked up in the dry on track and see but If its not doing much I can sell to offset costs.
 

bashracing

ClioSport Club Member
I would say you have too much rear spring bias anyway and adding a rarb would push it to being too tail happy,
I would run a 525-550 front spring with a 600 rear and wouldn't bother with a rear arb but fit a PMS axle strengthening kit instead
 
I would say you have too much rear spring bias anyway and adding a rarb would push it to being too tail happy,
I would run a 525-550 front spring with a 600 rear and wouldn't bother with a rear arb but fit a PMS axle strengthening kit instead
Yeah oversteer was the main worry, might sell the ARB and get some FK 550 springs then.:up:
 

massiveCoRbyn

ClioSport Club Member
  Several
I can see the argument. With the rear beam being stiff (relative to the ARB) and with stiff spring rates, the effectiveness of the ARB will be limited. My personal feeling (I was an engineer once upon a time, albeit not so much in the ride and handling area) is that I would rather use a softer spring with an ARB than a stiffer spring with no ARB. The primary function of the spring/damper is to control bump/rebound, not to prevent roll. By fitting an ARB (ideally an adjustable one), you can run a softer spring, giving you better ride control (to help maintain contact patch), while the ARB reduces body roll.

The Clio complicates it a bit further, as the beam itself obviously impacts roll stiffness, so you can also modify that with the above-mentioned stiffening kit. However, by doing that in conjunction with stiff springs, you are effectively "fixing" the roll stiffness and potentially compromising the ride stiffness. That set-up might work well in the dry, but could be too stiff in the wet and you could be left with something that is no fun to drive half the time. By running an adjustable ARB, you give yourself a means of fine tuning the roll control without having a dramatic impact on ride. Using the spring to control roll could mean you compromise ride quality. Of course, if the car is mostly used on track, where the surface tends to be pretty smooth, ride control becomes less important as you can get away with pretty stiff springs. If the car is used on the road, you have to make much bigger compromises and a stiff spring definitely isn't the one you want to make. Ultimately, if you look at pro-built competition cars, they usually run an ARB, as it gives further tuning options, so that's a pretty good sign of what the preferential approach is.

I don't have huge experience with Clio tuning, so someone who has tried out all the options could possibly advise better. Saying that, what works for them might not work for you. Some people like a car that feels loose, others don't. A FWD car with a skittish rear end can be really fast but, if you're not confident with it, there's no sense going for it, as you won't enjoy driving it. As with everything in ride/handling, there are a million different answers and any one of them could be justified as correct, so I'm sure some will have a different opinion to me 😂
 
  dan's cast offs.
not that bad to fit it all, worst part is cleaning the old beam up before you get it all done.
 
  Clio 172
I would say you have too much rear spring bias anyway and adding a rarb would push it to being too tail happy,
I would run a 525-550 front spring with a 600 rear and wouldn't bother with a rear arb but fit a PMS axle strengthening kit instead
This is what I have.
 

Simon@ASTUK

ClioSport Trader
  BMW E30 M3
Be wary of going too stiff on the rear. Depending on your driving style and how you like the car to behave you may get adverse results. For example, if you are very lively with the car you will experience a flat slide on the limit rather than a progressive lean and bump. The inside wheel won't lift to the extent of a standard car. However before that, and more so if you aren't the the wildest of drivers you are likely to experience push on understeer.

It's common for people to fit them and then remove them as they lose the behaviours you would expect from a Clio.
 
Be wary of going too stiff on the rear. Depending on your driving style and how you like the car to behave you may get adverse results. For example, if you are very lively with the car you will experience a flat slide on the limit rather than a progressive lean and bump. The inside wheel won't lift to the extent of a standard car. However before that, and more so if you aren't the the wildest of drivers you are likely to experience push on understeer.

It's common for people to fit them and then remove them as they lose the behaviours you would expect from a Clio.
Car felt great at Aintree in the wet with the current spring rates, i just softened the damping to 4 clicks from soft rear and 3 from soft on the front and detached the arb. It felt very neutral through the corners. Also managed to match my personal best lap time set on OE dampers and lowering springs set in optimal dry conditions with fresher tyres.

You'd think if it was going to show any of the above behaviours they would have shown up in the wet pushing on? I'll see how it feels at Oulton next week and take it from there for next year.
 

JamesBryan

ClioSport Club Member
Car felt great at Aintree in the wet with the current spring rates, i just softened the damping to 4 clicks from soft rear and 3 from soft on the front and detached the arb. It felt very neutral through the corners. Also managed to match my personal best lap time set on OE dampers and lowering springs set in optimal dry conditions with fresher tyres.

You'd think if it was going to show any of the above behaviours they would have shown up in the wet pushing on? I'll see how it feels at Oulton next week and take it from there for next year.

I'm sure some of the 182's in the 750mc series run whitelines and they run 750lb front springs and 450lb rear.
 
I did have the 750mc spax suspension but I now have the AST suspension with the above spring rates :wink:


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Ahh get you mate, lol.

Think AST supply their coilovers for the 1*2 always with the rear springs stiffer as I have the road spec springs as well which are 3kg front and 5kg rear.
 


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