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Remap sorted but need more advice



  Renault clio 172
Hi again thanks for all advice on my last post( I'm booking up at rs tuning next week for remap which is great because there only 70 miles away and the have a great reputation) anyway the question is before my remap should I
(a) leave my car stock apart from a pipercross panel filter, or
(b) fit a magnex cat back system and a pipercross viper induction, which I already have off other 172's so would fit right on no bother might sound like a daft question but I've checked my cover and my premium goes up 147 quid if I declare them.
so I guess the question is would fitting them mods make a big difference after remap compared to stock + panel filter bearing in mind my cover nearly goes up 150 quid, because if its like 2-3bhp after map difference I don't think it's worth it hope you guys can shed some light many thanks in advance.
 
  Renault clio 172
Anyone any ideas as I don't really want to book my remap until I find out what u guys think the difference would be after remap with and without mods, thanks
 

DaveDreads

aka Philomena Cunk aka Barry Shitpeas
ClioSport Club Member
If it's a generic map then fitting mods or leaving them off won't make any difference to the car's running,
you can optimise the air in, air out with filter, exhaust, inlets etc, but you can still remap a standard car no problem.

If you were to get a live map on some rollers, then having all the mods fitted would be a must,
as the map would be for how the car's performing on the day,
fitting mods after would alter how the car's performing so the map would no longer be optimised for your car.

So is it a generic remap, or a live map on a rolling road?
 
  Renault clio 172
Cheers m8 the map is live with rollers befor and after from (rs tuning Leeds) so what your saying I would get better results from the map with the mods in place then just stock, if so how much better ( bhp) wise? Thanks again
 

Advikaz

ClioSport Club Member
Won't be huge gains to be had to be fair.

But naturally enabling the vehicle to breath easier & then mapping will help.
 
  182/RS2/ Turbo/Mk1
Finish doing all the mods you want first, then map it, pointless mapping it then changing it as the map will then be wrong.
So if you are going to get an exhaust do it first.
 

imprezaworks

ClioSport Club Member
  Mk5 Golf GTI :)
Pretty much what i was going to suggest. You will notice not a great deal if you get the mapping done now
 
  182/RS2/ Turbo/Mk1
If you want a reasonable gain now on the standard setup, just do an rs tuner map, it will be 80% of the gains of any custom map anyway, and isnt even going to cost you 100 quid realistically.

Then do all your mods, and when you have finished, take it somewhere like Rs Tuning for a custom map.
 
  Renault clio 172
Yes m8 it runs very well I've had 3 172's and this one is the best my far the engine feels very strong and pulls realy well it's 51 plate and it only has 69,000 miles with full dealership service history and lots and lots of reseats of work I'm only the second owner from new and the person that had it befor me was a middle aged female teacher, to be honest you can tell that it's been kept to the highest standard and its never been thrashed, that why I'm willing to put a bit money into this one coz its a good one which are very hard to find these days IMO.
 
  182/RS2/ Turbo/Mk1
Im nowhere near you mate, so no point me offering to help.
Its REALLY easy to DIY it though, just buy a secondhand one, get an unlock code and a map from Henk, then sell it on once you are finished to get all but the licence money back.
Will cost you about 80 quid all in.
 

imprezaworks

ClioSport Club Member
  Mk5 Golf GTI :)
Thats what i am looking at doing (rs tuner map). Quick one though and sorry to hi-jack the thread. Currently ive go a decatted rs192 and a new style k-tec induction kit, still a wise choice to try the rs tuner? Or go down the route of live mapping?
 
  182/RS2/ Turbo/Mk1
TBH based on the recent thread with results of the induction kit, its all of about 2% gains at best, so not really likely to be far out on an rs tuner map, 2% difference in fuelling is naff all really.

Its more things like cams that really throw it out.

Dont get me wrong, it wont be "perfect" but im sure it will be close enough.
 
  182/RS2/ Turbo/Mk1
Yes mate, will suit your car better than the standard map I am sure.

Use a wideband though to check it. (or take it to rollers)
 
  Renault clio 172
Thanks for all the help people I think from what I've learned at the moment it would be pointless me getting a custom map think I'm going to get the rs tuner, then when I get all my mods do them all at once then get a custom map, like I said I've already got induction and cat back system but I want the rs2 inlet manifold as well that way once all installed and after a custom map I think I should see a good gain hoping for around 20-25bhp ish I hope anyway
 
  182/RS2/ Turbo/Mk1
Love the rs2 on my mrs car with 197 cams, drives mint.
Sadly I don't think they are available currently though :(

This is my mrs one, I think she has done a really good job of it :)

5ec7a29c.jpg
 
  182/RS2/ Turbo/Mk1
She did the rs2 install and all the tidying up in the bay first of all.

Then a year or so later the aux belt slipped under the Cambelt at which point it had to be rebuilt.
I built the bottom end up with new rings etc and a set of arp bolts, she rebuilt the cylinder head with supertech valves, then we fitted the head on with arp stud and nuts and the 197 cams in it and a 182 exhaust manifold and cat between us and then mike from Mwm timed the cams in with me as he's worked out the best way to time 197 cams in a 172 as they don't work well on standard marks.
So it's about 50 percent hers internally and 100 percent her work for all the external bits.
 
  Renault clio 172
So am I right in thinking you can not buy rs2's anymore chip if not is there some sort of equivalent you would recommend or not
 
  182/RS2/ Turbo/Mk1
You will need to contact James Stone about if he is making anymore or not, last I heard was production was paused.
 
  Renault clio 172
What sort of gain does the rs2 give chip (bhp) because iv looked into it a bit more and the kit is around £1200 quid so must be decent gain surely, what should my car be running with cat back, induction, rs2 and custom map roughly I'm hoping 190 bhp+ I hope that is what u think m8
 
  182/RS2/ Turbo/Mk1
Anywhere 185-192 seems to be most common these days since Mwm took over the mapping, it's not really a balls out difference in power though, it's just much nicer to drive as it pulls so well at 3krpm etc.
must confess not had ours on the rollers yet to find out, we mapped it on the road by just tweaking a basemap mike gave me.
 
  Renault clio 172
Cheers m8 that's what I was hoping for something around there because after I get that done I will probs leave it at that I think because from what little I know it starts to get crazy money to push them any higher power wise
 
  Renault clio 172
Chip I've noticed on your avatar that yours is turbo charged, just out of interest if you don't mind me asking that is, how much did that cost u.
 
  Renault clio 172
Right there m8 he seems really clued up and would probs do all work on his own which I wouldn't do we're to start lol
 
  182/RS2/ Turbo/Mk1
Actually mine was done by Mwm not me originally although I've done a lot to it since, it was a company demonstrator when jack worked there.
It was using an ecu they hadnt used before though and as they were trying to get it all done very quickly I helped out with mapping it as its one I use a lot, and I'd been involved in talking with mike all through the build anyway as we always chat about the more interesting projects we are working on. (We've mapped other cars together over the years too and go way back)
I really fell in love with the car when we were mapping it and then at a later date when I got the chance to I bought it.
You could DIY it for 2k ish to do the same thing if you use a few secondhand parts like mine was done with, or Mwm charge about 4k all in for the conversion using new parts. Tbh that's not a lot less than you would spend to do it yourself paying retail for parts, if you had to pay for mapping etc, so it's quite good value in that respect.
Mine is very tired now though and I am pulling the engine out and rebuilding it at some point over winter and will add a diff too at the same time.

If you only wanted lower boost on standard compression you could do it quite easily for 2k as there wouldn't be any difficult jobs like taking the head off and timing the belt etc which are things some people don't like doing on these engines.

Ive got a project thread on here, search for phase one turbo and you will find it.
 
  Renault clio 172
Cheers m8 will have a look at that thread, would defo want lower boost on standard compression, wow could be done for around 2k i was expecting double that a least, you learn something new every day I guess lol
 
  182/RS2/ Turbo/Mk1
Cheers m8 will have a look at that thread, would defo want lower boost on standard compression, wow could be done for around 2k i was expecting double that a least, you learn something new every day I guess lol

Basically you need (all prices approx only):
Manifold and downpipe (new, or save cash and find 2nd hand for less) = 400
Intercooler (2ndhand focus st is a good one) and pipework = 200
Management (budget new, or dearer 2nd hand) = 500
Turbo like nissan 200sx or focus rs or some saabs (2nd hand) = 150
Injectors (new) = 200
Oil feed and return including fitting for adapting the sump (new) = 150
Uprated fuel pump (new) = 100

And then some fiddly little bits like one way valves and wiring connectors etc and stuff like that and some mapping time at the end.
That'll see you at 220-230bhp quite happily, and similar amount of torque, If you use electronic boost control and a larger turbo you can see more power high in the rev range by upping the boost at high rpm but the CR will limit the torque you can make.

If you want to run more boost later on, you just need exactly the same as above but with a thicker head gasket to lower the CR, no other changes actually needed to the engine itself (other than mapping again of course) for 250-280bhp, and similar torque figure, although you will need an uprated clutch at that point (mine runs a helix paddle clutch).
Another option instead of the thicker head gasket, is a megane gasket and 197 cylinder head, thats how mine is done.


So basically 2K and a fair amount of work gets you a low pressure conversion at 220-230bhp, or add 1K more to see 250-280bhp
 


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