Starting issues again!

[RobBrodie]

Afternoon!
I'm having starting issues again which i could really do with some help on

Had the same issue a week or 2 ago, to get the car home i bumped it and broke down on the way home with what i'm pretty sure was a flat battery due to the fuse on the starter motor/alternator cable at the battery terminal blowing and the car running out of charge. once i replaced the cable the car started and ran fine until today
I now have the same issue again, so i cut out the fuse and clamped the cable into the terminal with out the fuse and it started fine, drove the car 10-15 miles home and now it wont start
Here's a video of it not starting! - the squeak/buzz is the throttle body


when i had this problem originally i thought it was the starter motor so replaced it, but that didn't cure it so i think we can rule the starter out

Could it be (bare in mind i'm no mechanic) related to my clutch release bearing/fly wheel? the clutch really creaks when depressing and releasing, would that cause too much friction/resistance for the starter to turn the car over? this might not even be related as i said, i'm no mechanic!

i left the car for a while and then tried starting it again and it fired up, so i am baffled!

anyone had this issue before?

 

[bloke]

if no eml then first port of call is crank sensor.

 

[RobBrodie]

i have got a management light, i had diagnostics on it and it said pre-cat sensor, i replaced that friday, it went out for a bit and is now on again, it came on whilst driving this morning

 

[theburns1]

Sounds like there isn't enough power to turn the car over, which would mean battery is dead, if new or charged have you tested the alternator? Defiantly no power there

 

[RobBrodie]

Sounds like there isn't enough power to turn the car over, which would mean battery is dead, if new or charged have you tested the alternator? Defiantly no power there

cheers for the reply!
we did check everything once i replaced the power cable last week, alternator was making 14.7v (if i remember correctly) and that was true at the battery and every other place i checked

i agree with you it sounds like not enough power but if that was the case i dont understand why it has started after the video was taken

i'm thinking this cant be the crank sensor as the car isn't turning over? am i right to think that?

i'm really confused!

 

[RobBrodie]

I dont know what peoples opinions are on the below diagram?

the car has been run like it for well over a year so i dont know why it would cause problems now but does anyone think it would create a problem?

 

[bloke]

sorry, didn't watch the video, ignore crank sensor.

you've got power going to exciter on the starter so as long as battery is good then look at starter and main feed to it.

 

[RobBrodie]

sorry, didn't watch the video, ignore crank sensor.

you've got power going to exciter on the starter so as long as battery is good then look at starter and main feed to it.

no problem,
the starter is a week old so im hoping its not that, granted it could be the battery so i will test that again tomorrow

just tried starting the car roughly 10 times, the car fired up 3/10 and 7/10 done nothing so i am really baffled - such an tedious issue!

 

[theburns1]

So battery is OK, alternator is OK, starter motor is new.......... Tough one. Maybe ignition, immobiliser?

Basically if you have power to the starter and the starters working, it will turn over. The alarm type bleep makes me think maybe immobiliser

 

[RobBrodie]

So battery is OK, alternator is OK, starter motor is new.......... Tough one. Maybe ignition, immobiliser?

Basically if you have power to the starter and the starters working, it will turn over. The alarm type bleep makes me think maybe immobiliser

exactly my thoughts, when i started/tried starting it a while ago there was no hint of immobilizer (that beep/squeak is the throttle body) and there was no immobilizer light - i will try the battery in the key just for a piece of mind

i'm going to leave it and test the battery tomorrow, it could be that i suppose

thanks for your help buddy!

edit: sparks/leads/coil pack are all brand new and replaced 4 months ish ago

 

[theburns1]

Plugs, leads ect won't stop it from turning over. Beeping is coming from the throttle body!? You sure? I'm only a old time mechanic and even Clio's are new technology for me, I don't know why that would be beeping unless tps have gone and stops it from turning over, doubt it though

 

[theburns1]

Just had a quick look and seems like it could be the stepper motor on the tb, read a couple of threads of different manufactory saying car won't start and a bleeping coming from tb. You got a mate with a Clio that you could try his tb, worth a go

 

[bloke]

so seven out of ten times it didn't even crank over?

 

[RobBrodie]

Just had a quick look and seems like it could be the stepper motor on the tb, read a couple of threads of different manufactory saying car won't start and a bleeping coming from tb. You got a mate with a Clio that you could try his tb, worth a go

it's definitely the throttle body making that noise, i wouldnt say its a beeping, but more of a buzz, i will have a look tomorrow and see if it starts when its not making that noise
i replaced the throttle body in may i think, as it threw up a ECU light on the dash and stuck the car in limp mode, i assumed it wasn't that preventing it from starting just beacuse i had none of those symptoms

so seven out of ten times it didn't even crank over?

yeah that's right buddy, just got the click as per the above video

seems like the starter shifts across and engages but doesn't turn

 

[bloke]

starter then. was it a new one? got the heat shield on?

 

[loggyboy]

Check your earths, wth any undiagnosable elec issue its wise to start there. First check battery to chasis. Un bolt and re bolt. Then check chassis to gearbox, (behind ns front wheel, links to front gearbox mount.) Then the rear gearbox earth. Which is tucked away under ecu and connects just above driveshaft.

 

[RobBrodie]

starter then. was it a new one? got the heat shield on?

Yeah it was a new one, no heatshield (on the to do list). But can rule the starter out as I had this same problem a couple of weeks ago, I replaced the starter but it made no difference at all, I cured it by replacing the starter and alternator power cable due to the blown fuse but I have cut that out now and still getting the issue

Check your earths...

Yeah that seems to be a fairly common thing I have found, will take a look at them tomorrow too

Thanks for all your help guys

 

[bloke]

as it is my money is on the starter getting heat soaked. did it have the heatshield on with the other starter?

also what make starter?

 

[RobBrodie]

as it is my money is on the starter getting heat soaked. did it have the heatshield on with the other starter?

also what make starter?

Hmmm I was kind of worried that was the case, but Im still not convinced just because it's the same symptoms as before that weren't resolved with a new starter, I'll get a heatshield on it anyway
The make is the one that I can never remember! Red and black packaging with a red and black logo haha

 

[theburns1]

If your having same issues with a new starter, then its not the starter. If it won't start only when the cars ran (hot) then its heat soak.

It's simple, there is something stoping your starter from engaging. Earth or immobiliser is my bet. Who fitted starter motor

 

[RobBrodie]

I had this exact issue the other day, I replaced the starter motor and it made no difference at all, so I'm next to certain it's not that - although point taken I will get a heatshield on it. Fitted by myself and a mate who's a mechanic

I'm going to check over the earth's and check the battery now and go from there, need to check the wiring to the starter really but can't get under the car

 

[bloke]

I'm going to check over the earth's and check the battery now and go from there, need to check the wiring to the starter really but can't get under the car

go in from drivers side wheel arch.