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thoughts on PAS - would you loose it for a track car?

B

ben_p

Car  C63 AMG, F430 & 172
Have the option to loose the PAS on my track car and use a 1.2 rack, would save weight (and money)

worth it? Car will never see the road BTW
 
I've been wondering the same thing.... though mine would definitely see road - still interested in the answer though :D
 
If it's for track only, then yes. Definitely. Better steering feel, lighter and losing the pump also frees up some power (~ 6-7hp iirc)
 
I have kept the standard 182 rack and it's fine to use. Only moved it around my drive tho :(

Daz on here has just kept the standard rack on his cup and he said it's fine. So save your money and keep the rack, I have pics in my project thread. Also I actually heard you can only expect up to 5 bhp after removing ac & pas

Do you have a progress thread ben? You always seem to build pretty epic track cars
 
Absolutely!! I've done it to my mk1, and used a 1.2 rack. Paddy has done the same, and his car performed brilliantly on track on saturday. Infact the only mechanical failure out of 5 clios at Bedford on saturday was a PAS pump
 
It seems to be quite the craze at the mement! Quite a few people ditching the pas. Such a myth about it been unbearingly difficult to use after it's gone
 
As long as you're moving, you won't have any trouble at all with the steering being heavy. Parking might be interesting, but you'd just learn to compensate.

My 306 didn't have PAS and it was absolutely fine.
 
you can block up the PAS rack like chrispy has done, check his project thread.

i will soon have my car on track again so i will let you know how i find it, on the road its not alot of hassle, parking etc is fun though :dead: once your going though its fine, so much more steering feel and you feel more involved!
 
There's far more than just a few bhp on offer from removing the power steering...here's mine, before and after power curve...

100_4400.jpg


As said above, is quite a challenge when parking. Had to run my Cup as a daily for two weeks recently, harness and bucket seat were more of a pain in the a*se than the steering...but I found myself always looking for the easy parking spots LOL.

Feel as said is massively improved, feels like you have the front wheel tyre tread in the palms of your hands. Helps using gloves so you don't have to grip the wheel so tightly and can focus on the feel coming through. On track the increased weight is no problem at all, although slower hairpins/tighter turns can require a fair bit of effort.

I didn't do mine through choice...I killed the old rack with an off-track excursion so thought f*** it, why not.

Knowing what I know now, I'd do it all again. Well worth it.
 
Would you Non-PAS guys recommend doing this for a car that's going to be 50-50 track/road? .... bearing in mind that the only 2 tracks near here are fairly short, sprinty and twisty ... :s

I love the idea of the simplicity, have arms like an orangutan, but I'm wary of making the car into something that I have to fight the car all the time...

For example... how does it compare to an old mini with a small steering wheel and huge-offset wheels? (we've all done that.. .right?) :D
 
Every car i''ve driven without PAS has felt better when driving, but parking is a b**ch, assume 1*2s are the same?
 
PHP: 
[quote="ben_p, post: 7589698"]think running the wet rack dry is ok?[/QUOTE]

You need to keep fluid in a power steering rack as that is what lubricates it. My track cup has no pas and i've retained the standard rack, just filled with fluid and linked 2 ports.
 
My mk1 is exclusively a road car, and i find it to be a MASSIVE improvement since i removed the PAS. Parking isn't hard, just learn to drive without dead steering
 
Would you Non-PAS guys recommend doing this for a car that's going to be 50-50 track/road? .... bearing in mind that the only 2 tracks near here are fairly short, sprinty and twisty ... :s

I love the idea of the simplicity, have arms like an orangutan, but I'm wary of making the car into something that I have to fight the car all the time...

For example... how does it compare to an old mini with a small steering wheel and huge-offset wheels? (we've all done that.. .right?)
Click to expand...

Its a bit heavy when your trying to park up but nothing that serious, plus if you've got buckets your sat closer to the wheel usually so it takes less effort as your arms aren't stretched out. If that makes sense??
 
my track car doesn't have PAS (its knackering after 10laps) but my race car is having PAS!

plus the 1.2 16V/DCI rack isn't very strong, i ruined a NEW (not recon) NEW rack in 1 day at bedford - it simply wasn't designed to be on a track car with sticky tyres and heroic driving LOL

think about it, a 1.2/dci rack is for a shopping trolly clio
 
Cheers Fred... That's reason enough for me to keep it.

It's probably not legal for me to do it here in Sweden anyway. :banghead:
 
We can switch ours on and off,don´t think either of us has ever switched it off yet to race,too much like hard work.
 
hmmm.

I can get cup brackets but cant find a cup PAS line so would need to source on of those.

might just risk it and loop the rack to keep it wet. can always add a pump later in life then i suppose!
 
hmmm.

I can get cup brackets but cant find a cup PAS line so would need to source on of those.

might just risk it and loop the rack to keep it wet. can always add a pump later in life then i suppose!
 
Fred@BTM said:
my track car doesn't have PAS (its knackering after 10laps) but my race car is having PAS!

plus the 1.2 16V/DCI rack isn't very strong, i ruined a NEW (not recon) NEW rack in 1 day at bedford - it simply wasn't designed to be on a track car with sticky tyres and heroic driving LOL

think about it, a 1.2/dci rack is for a shopping trolly clio
Click to expand...

So at least the standard 172/182 rack should be stronger, so hopefully mine will stay alive with my pas removed
 
Mine was removed with the Vag conversion and certainly works your arms at slow speeds!.... speaking to flan about this but wondered if anyone else had any ideas on getting PAS back into the Cup / Vag mongrol of mine and would it be worth the hassle? ta
 
i removed my pas rack for a dci rack recently, and refitted the pas rack the following day. absolutely hated it. it felt quicker without the pas pump, picked up quicker and seem to rev more freely, but it was too much hard work to drive. it actually felt like driving a car that just had broken power steering.
 
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