Timing Belt = Dead

[paulOr]

Im hoping someone can help me here, i really need it
In january, i was driving when my car came to grinding hault, and wouldnt start again, i thought it had ran out of petrol, so i walked to a petrol station and got petrol, filled it up and tryed to start, still nothing, so i tryed bump starting it down a massive hill, and still nothing.

I got it toed back to my house and we worked out it was the Timing Belt that has gone, after speaking to some friends, they said the cylinder head needs replaced in it, ( cant remember the technical side to it, but it will be damaged because of way the engine stops or some crap )

So i searched for a new clyinder head and finally found one in Englandshire.
It got send up to me a week ago and me and my father have been looking for a good garage to put it into to get it sorted. My mums friends hubby is a machanic and he just popped round 10mins ago to have a look. This is what he said:

If your driving it and it cuts out on you, the piston fires into the cylinder head and bends the valves, also the chances are the pistons will be broken, have a hole in them. ( cant remember if it was pistons he said tbh, the thing that goes into the head anyway ) He said i would need either a new engine completly or just a new car.

When he went away, my dad said to me, he knows loads of people whos timing belts have gone on them, and nothing like this has ever happened, its a case of getting a new head and a new belt, and your done. brand new.

So can anyone shed any light on this, i really dont know that much about cars engines, im a computer guy any advise would be great! what do you think has happened, what do i need to do?

Its a Clio Grande 3 Door 1.2engine 8 valve (w reg) mk2 phase 1

 

[philmots]

Mechanic bloke is correct.

 

[s4lkk]

especially as you tried to start it after the belt had gone! just throw a second hand engine in it (with a new timing belt)

 

[Christopher]

that'll be fooked old boy

 

[edde]

Just get a second hand engine and drop it in much less effort than doing the head.

The mechanics rignt piston damge is likly depends how abd it is might just be little nicks and you cna get away but for the effort just get a whole new engine and drop it in.

 

[LegoHead]

cheap engine for these can be had for 100 quid. easy to fit i imagine, due to amount of room to work.

 

[kortas]

pull the old head off it yourself and check the pistons for obvious signs of damage, tbh buying a haynes manual and fittin a new belt and head yourself is like assembling lego, the hardest bit is getting the belt on, SERIOUSLY. dead easy on an 8v lump however the 172 lump i will leave to renault to service for me

 

[edde]

pull the old head off it yourself and check the pistons for obvious signs of damage, tbh buying a haynes manual and fittin a new belt and head yourself is like assembling lego, the hardest bit is getting the belt on, SERIOUSLY. dead easy on an 8v lump however the 172 lump i will leave to renault to service for me

Err the valves will most likly be smashed or badly damaged just wascking a new belt on isn't going to fix them.

 

[kortas]

pull the old head off it yourself and check the pistons for obvious signs of damage, tbh buying a haynes manual and fittin a new belt and head yourself is like assembling lego, the hardest bit is getting the belt on, SERIOUSLY. dead easy on an 8v lump however the 172 lump i will leave to renault to service for me

Err the valves will most likly be smashed or badly damaged just wascking a new belt on isn't going to fix them.

read what i posted again and it might make sense to you? i never said re use the old head

 

[edde]

Err the valves will most likly be smashed or badly damaged just wascking a new belt on isn't going to fix them.

read what i posted again and it might make sense to you? i never said re use the old head

Arr right sorry half asleep here

 

[benji&eka]

probably not damaged pistons on that engine, defo bent most of the valves
i'd charge £500-£800 (so long as damage is valves only) to whip the head off pop in some valves ect ect and put it back on the road

 

[paulOr]

mixed responces then heh, i bough a second hand head from a dealer, i asked for a 2000 model, and the head has a 97 stamp on it, that wont work will it ?

 

[davebem]

mixed responces then heh, i bough a second hand head from a dealer, i asked for a 2000 model, and the head has a 97 stamp on it, that wont work will it ?

Possibly will be ok, as the D7F engine was used in the earlier mk1s from about 1996. The year on the head could just be the date the tooling was made.

 

[Sib]

This happend to my escort, was a 1.6 on a N reg.

Cost me £350 to have a 1.8 gti engine fitted inc purchase from ford parts.

Engine was also from newer car with less miles.

This is your chance to blag a 1.6 lump in it

 

[MR_PEA]

i agree rip of the head and have a good look at it..
should be easy.
unbolt exaust, unbolt manifold, remove any cables/ wires from head path.
unbolt rocker cover, unbolt head, & remove.....
should take 2-5 hours depending on your expirence with cars,

 

[ditz]

mechanic bloke is nowhere near correct, to tell you that is just saying he does not want to do the job
ive done a couple of snapped belts on 8v clio's no 16v's admittedly but they are both interference engines
each one i've done has bent exhauxt valves first one i did had bent 3 second only had bent 2
whipped the head off fitted the valves whacked it back on and it was fine,, never seen a damaged piston yet from a snapped belt.

 

[paulOr]

thats dits, thats cheared me up a lot, however. does it matter that i tryed to jump start it a s**t load, then got it toed home and tryed to jump start it for about 5 miles on the way home? would that effect it even more.

Because i heard that ones its dead its dead., it wont move again, so once the engine cuts out, the damage is done, no more can be done because the engine isnt starting and nothing is moving?

anyone able to clear that bit up for me?

 

[benji&eka]

damage is already done, the pistons will have pushed the valves out of the way when the belt failed. no point keep turning it over though

 

[ditz]

the first second the belt failed the piston will have pushed the valves shut and bent the rest out of the way so continually trying to start it would do no further damage at all, worst ive seen is a cracked valve guide which does not even need a new head just the valves it bent and a set of guides, be very very surprised if its done anything to the pistons

 

[paulOr]

Hey good news! we have stripped the engine down, and apart from the obv damage to clyinder head, everything else is fine! Im so happy.

Ordering new head gasket tomorro along with a timing belt, and the guys coming back on saturday to fit it.

There was one little complication though, the new cylinder head i bought, is different from the one in the car. However, everything meets up and fits perfect though. The one i bought it a 97 one and mines is 2000 so it looks a little different, but is really the same

Thanks for all your help, you have saved me from getting ripped off major style, im glad i done my research first

 

[ditz]

dont know enough about the engines to say if the head will work but i wouldn't mind betting the valves are the same, and i bet thats all its done

 

[G_F]

i have never seen a damaged piston yet from a snapped belt.

I haven't either and ive seen a few, three of the c***s mine.

Its not 100% that valves will get bent either, a lads on Retro went and all he needed to do was replace the belt iirc

 

[Martin_172]

mine snapped last month, was no piston damage just bent valves. i payed £200 for another 1.2 16v engine with 50k on the clock (compaired to mine with 140k lol) belt snapped wednesday, i took engine out other car on the thursday night, mine out friday night and new one in on the satarday.