uprated cams

[kevin.s]

just wondering who has had this done and wether you thought it was worth the money. its somthing im going to be looking into soon but im not sure wether the money its going to cost would be worth the amount of gain i would get from it.

i also understand that there are a few options like piper regrids and catcams as well as others but i dont know what to go for as i have heard good and bad about them all.

also, what sort of gains do you get from cams and how much would i be looking at spending for the cams, fitting, mapping ans any other bits that i may need?
cheers all.

 

[Tom@JMS]

Minefield.

If you are sticking with standard management you need to budget for at least £1700.00 upwards all in for a good quality set, fitted, mapped etc (it's effectively a full cambelt service + the cams themselves + proper mapping).

There are some questionable quality regrind type cams floating about that you can save some cash on. Don't expect more than 155ft/lbs 185bhp.

 

[LowLife.]

For that money you would be better with the JMS system surely? Instead of cams?

 

[kevin.s]

£1700 i thought id be looking more at £1200 at the most . maybe thats a no then as for not much more i could get itb`s.
think meybee ill get some coil overs and maybe a carbon bonnet instead lol.

 

[Russ_16v]

Brakes and suspension mate, will make soooo much more a difference than anything engine wise.


Though cams are good, id wait until your due a cambelt change to do them if you are going that way.

Id go itb's but im biased lol (to be fair iv always wanted itbs)

 

[Scott™]

I wouldnt bother with cams without standalone tbh!

 

[sideways danny]

Doing testing ASAP on this. Want to get cat 421s working as well as possible on standard ecu. Better with standalone though, as said already.

Don't bother with 428s. Not found a setup they really compliment at all yet.

 

[Fred@BTM]

^i disagree, i've done 190+bhp several times using the oe inlet (albeit matched) and so far 212bhp IIRC on bodies, for a "mild" cam they do well!

my new ones are going for mapping next week hopefully, fingers crossed it does 200berries!

 

[Meek_racing]

200 on standard setup or matched inlet, exhaust etc? How many gold coins would these berries cost?

 

[Russ_16v]

^i disagree, i've done 190+bhp several times using the oe inlet (albeit matched) and so far 212bhp IIRC on bodies, for a "mild" cam they do well!

my new ones are going for mapping next week hopefully, fingers crossed it does 200berries!

Runs and idles bloody well too!

 

[Fred@BTM]

200 on standard setup or matched inlet, exhaust etc? How many gold coins would these berries cost?

matched inlets with a yozza decat system (182) my cams, few bits and some leeds magic, fingers crossed

 

[Meek_racing]

Hmmm... well you know i'm half and half about ITB's or the JMS setup, give me a shout when you have the figures and costs as this might be another one to consider

Are these very wild cams or ok for daily use?

 

[Fred@BTM]

i'll take you out in the car when its done

i did more torque and 9bhp less when compared to a stock 172 on ITB's (same rollers) on stock matched inlets with 428 cams

 

[Meek_racing]

Good stuff, just let me know when and i'll pop over!

 

[franx]

it's possible.

171,6 at the WHEELS , throw an equation of 15% transmission-loss on there and you'll get a very healthy power. More likely is 12% loss though

 

[Greeny.]

£1700 i thought id be looking more at £1200 at the most . maybe thats a no then as for not much more i could get itb`s.
think meybee ill get some coil overs and maybe a carbon bonnet instead lol.

More like 2.5k for a decent ITB kit fitted by a decent company, unless u can do it all yourself of course.

 

[Tom@JMS]

As said; minefield.

 

[franx]

i stepped through the minefield and won a lot of unharmed strong horse-legs

 

[Andyman]

Do some research on the different cams the different profiles, what they give you low down, mid range etc and match them up to what your wanting from your car.

You might get some cams that give you a good paper result for the boys down the pub but if youve got 1.1's beating you till you come on cam the car will probably feel less driveable. All depends what you want.

 

[Tom@JMS]

The problem is Andy that there are very few people out there that will actually do the research, and even less that actually understand how a cam profile & it's numbers relate to changes in the cars performance.

 

[kevin.s]

well it doent look like im going to get much more out of it with out spending silly money so i think i may go for some coilies and a remap instead.
not sure wether to go for an rs tuner or go and get it done properly. both would cost about the same to me as i would need to buy a laptop too if i were to get an rs tuner but i know i would get a bit more out of a proper map.
what do you recon? is it worth a proper map with just a panel filter, decat and strait through system or would there be nothing in it?

 

[Andyman]

Dont right cams off altogether. My old pretty mild spec Piper regrinds matched with a few other mods left a RS Focus and a R32 Golf standing on a quater mile the latter of which had repeated runs against me with the same outcome

 

[sideways danny]

Do some research on the different cams the different profiles, what they give you low down, mid range etc and match them up to what your wanting from your car.

You might get some cams that give you a good paper result for the boys down the pub but if youve got 1.1's beating you till you come on cam the car will probably feel less driveable. All depends what you want.

That's what I most dislike about 428s. All the gains are right up the revs. They can work but you need to wring the Hell out of the engine. 421s are man cams

 

[mike1pow]

421s are man cams

Quote of the day right there!

 

[mmario]

5503423
PAC-E19862
CTRE006
99024

HMmm:evil:

 

[Stu_182]

Do some research on the different cams the different profiles, what they give you low down, mid range etc and match them up to what your wanting from your car.

You might get some cams that give you a good paper result for the boys down the pub but if youve got 1.1's beating you till you come on cam the car will probably feel less driveable. All depends what you want.

If you do track days cams will be a good mod as you will be sitting at high revs all the time it just means on road you have to rev the t*ts off it to get it flying. I can't speek for experience n a Clio but I had a cammed saxo and on road my friends ctr would pull away from me and lookd like a faster car but flat out o-100mph they were equal.

 

[Stu_182]

*can't edit

My saxo ran the equivalent of catcam 428s

 

[maupineda]

I have E&D cams and they do give more grunt from 2k all the way to the cut-off. Just don't get cought below there as you will be left behind, but may catch up later, just get above 2.2k, mine is faster that most 172's by a noticeable margin. Car is more agressive and the and midrange is also more solid, and that is with my cat left in place. Past 4K, oh!!! it shifts!!!!

I would go for 421's, C&B, Shricks or E&D. All these have similar specs overall.

 

[mattypy282]

how come nobody has mentioned engine dynamics they clain 210bhp with breather mods all in for £900

 

[theduck]

Kev, I reckon we can get something better than cams together on your budget

 

[Jamesstone]

how come nobody has mentioned engine dynamics they clain 210bhp with breather mods all in for £900

LOL :clown:

just look in the project threads to see the money you need just to break 200hp on an f4r

 

[b33fy172]

As above in reality I think from 428s your looking at around 180-190bhp Some lucky ones get just over I believe, I got 183bhp but the way the car drives now is fantastic so much quicker through the midrange all the way to the redline!

 

[franx]

lol i was just Google-ing to find out how wheelpower measures up to flywheelpower and found this link; it's good for pub-talk haha, made me happy anyway..

http://www.pumaracing.co.uk/coastdwn.htm

it seems mine is making 201,7 with the above mentioned C&B cams, matched inlets, exhaust manifold+decat + modified airintake (made 171,6 wheelpower, Fastchip RR result)

So, if your engine is a good 'un , nice and loose, high power is possible with cams and mods to match these

 

[sideways danny]

FLOLOL!!!!! no way. believe the rolling road you were on was a single roller wasn't it?

 

[franx]

yep, single one.

In Goes.

 

[sideways danny]

reduce the losses for a single roller. More like 18-20bhp

 

[franx]

still gets me up in the high 190 , do'nt rain down on my parade her haha

 

[Andyman]

That's what I most dislike about 428s. All the gains are right up the revs. They can work but you need to wring the Hell out of the engine. 421s are man cams

If 428's are mild and 421's are more lary then surely the 421's would have a bigger trade off gain vs loss ?

Im hoping to get these new 428's mapped shortly but it currently pulls in 4th from 1500 rpm right up to 60+ without any bogging down

 

[Silent_Scone]

428s are a massive waste of cash man, like Danny said it takes a fair chunk down low and gives you a smidge back up right by the limiter. If I had my time again 421s are the way forward.

 

[Andyman]

428s are a massive waste of cash man, like Danny said it takes a fair chunk down low and gives you a smidge back up right by the limiter. If I had my time again 421s are the way forward.

Out of interest, is yours flat till about 4.5k then when it comes on cam kicks in with the power?