Urgent help needed

[clean16v]

This morning i got a court summons in the post for speeding on the motorway. I was doing in the 120 region, when i got pulled, the guy said he will say i was doing 96mph if i dont take it to court. got summons today and i want to take it to court. I basically have 2 arguments. 1) he cant prove i was speeding, he said he did a point to point speed check and it came back as 96? 2) i was in a rush to see my dad, he was alone in his pizza shop and he phoned to say it was busy, we have had trouble there in the past and i did not want anything to happen when he was alone. Which argument should i take? do i stand a chance? 3 more points wont mean i lose my license as im on my second one but i just dont want them! it would mean i have 9 points on my second licence in less then 2 years of driving!

Thankyou ion advance

 

[Dust]

I would say Option 1. If they cannot prove it then ......SwEeT!

 

[steve_rt]

option 2 wont work, i tried something similar when i was done by a gatso (45 in a 30) and they politely told me to f**k off (not in so many words mind!!!)

about him saying hell put down you were doing 96 - he CANT have any proof of that if he saw you going at 120, and i suppose if he changed his story now then he would get laughed out of court? maybe a bit of a sh*tty thing to do seeing as he was trying to let you keep your license but you might be able to get him on that?!

 

[clean16v]

well i say they cant prove it because it was just him in the car, he didnt have a video, or one of them silly things that say average speed BUT a police officers word against a young lad in a fast car who has previous speeding offences(well, one previous)?

 

[Viv172]

No proof, no case!!! If you start saying you were in a hurry then you are just admiting that you were speeding

 

[clean16v]

i like what im hearing! so just walk into court and say prove it? In his statement he was kinda covering his back by saying my radio was switched off to recieve only, he had his speedo calibrated before and after, he did a point to point speed check??? what the feck is one of those?

 

[steve_rt]

did you ask for proof at the time (actually, that would have sounded stupid i spose if you were doing over a ton!) - you sure you didnt see anything in the car that could have been tracking your speed?

if youre sure then i would challenge it.

look here - they give some info if you need it http://www.ukspeedtraps.co.uk/fight.htmhttp://www.ukspeedtraps.co.uk/fight.htm

 

[Viv172]

A friend of mine was followed and pulled doing 120 but was told by the copper that he had no proof and unless my friend admitted it, nothing would be done. He didnt, the copper said slow down from now on, that was it.

 

[clean16v]

the other web-site doesnt help much but anyway, im pretty sure that he didnt have any gadgets in the car to say what speed i was doing, and if he did he would have said in his statement. Thing is it is a dedicated traffic cop so maybe his point to point check is enough evidence?

 

[steve_rt]

oh right, not a normal plodder then! i can only guess, but it would probably be that he might have timed you from one visual marker to another (roadsign?), and then confirmed it by driving at 96mph and logging it.

but that still doesnt give any actual photographic proof that you were doing it, and since you WERENT doing 96 in any case then his case is toss!

 

[clean16v]

so i have a case? WOOHOO! that is well sweet, just to make sure everyone knows though, i DO NOT usually travel at these sort of speeds, infact my car felt a little slow that day so i thought i would cane it to work on the clear motorway late at night.

 

[steve_rt]

lol! clean, thats what i think, but i reckon you should speak to someone with legal / speed policing knoledge of this to make sure you arent gonna go to court and look like an arrogant p*ick and then get a harsh fine! there might be sommit both of us have missed?

jyst read the link i gave you, yeah it aint much good but they might have contacts there you could try for help?

 

[clean16v]

i will obviously look to get legal advice BUT everyone i have spoken to says i have a caseas he cant prove anything. Thankyou very much to everyone who replied, and if anyone esle has anything else to say.........

 

[Rich 19_16v]

Can I ask a quick question?

When you were stopped, did you basically agree to this 96mph deal, because if you did then you may well find that your own admission of guilt at the time will seriously hamper any attempt to get away with it now.

 

[clean16v]

no, i just kept quiet, and did not say a lot. i didnt agree, dis-agree or anything. i THINK he said how quick were you going and i said, i dont know. Even if i did, is it not his word against mine? Also, in his statement today he said the only thing i said was i was in a rush to get to work and said nothing else. is this bad?

 

[BRUN]

can you do a point to point with only one copper ?....

im pretty sure there has to be 2 of em doin it, it might only take one to actually do it, but i thought they had to have 2 of em

 

[clean16v]

this is what i mean, with there only being one copper, no video/photographic evidence or any other gadgets the odds are stacking in my favour!

 

[Dust]

Quote: Originally posted by clean16v on 26 February 2003

no, i just kept quiet, and did not say a lot. i didnt agree, dis-agree or anything. i THINK he said how quick were you going and i said, i dont know. Even if i did, is it not his word against mine? Also, in his statement today he said the only thing i said was i was in a rush to get to work and said nothing else. is this bad?

Well its not good, but he has no case to prove and charge u, case dismissed under lack of evidence!

 

[clean16v]

WOOHOO! that is well sweet. the last thing i need now is these three points, my dad is selling his shop soon leaving me out of work with BIG bills to pay for insurance so it has not been a good week, and if i get let off it will set me up for a summer of cruising with my willy engine!

 

[Dust]

Well if all fails and ur fcuked, Buggsie ur Willy!! lol

 

[clean16v]

all yours if you have the $$$$ a willy engined clio with 26k dont come cheap thses days

Thanks for everyones help, very much apreciated!

 

[clean16v]

any other info still greatly appreciated

 

[Dust]

26k!!!! Awesome, just about run in!

Edited to say:- Let me know when ur selling!

 

[anthonyj207]

I got pulled by a copper in a van . When he finally caught me up (I saw the lights come on in the distance and slowed it right down!!! (It was dark, how was I to know it was a cop van driving up me arse???) Anyways, he reckoned on my speed quite spot on (about 90 on a deserted dual lane carriageway) and basically read me the full riot act, had a severe ticking off but we both knew he couldnt prove what speed I was doing. After being VERY apologetic (me that is not him! LOL), he let me go with a producer. Hope this helps...

 

[clean16v]

almost same happened with me! although it was a traffic cop, he guessed my speed almost spot on(he said around 120, was actually 126, but who am i to argue?) he gave me a producer and a court summons

 

[anthonyj207]

Wot speed is a definate no question about it instant ban??

 

[clean16v]

over 100, thats why he said i will say you were doing 96

 

[anthonyj207]

Oh!

But he couldnt prove this either way could he? I mean he was on his own, no test equipment (not sure about the calibration of the vehicle - have you asked for the certificates?)

 

[clean16v]

No i didnt but on his statement he said his car was calibrated before and after the incident so he probably has proof as he knows it is the first thing i would ask! although whether his was calibrated or not makes no difference as he did a point to point check on my car?

 

[anthonyj207]

I am wondering about BRUNs post about needing 2 coppers for the point to point? Is this true? Hopefully it requires two of em and therefore he has nothing on you

Best of luck tho, I hope it turns out ok for you!!

 

[willy wonka]

Ive been reading over the replies and I have to disagree.

Police are now what is called as professional witnesses, which means, if there is only one copper when your nicked you cant use the old its your word against mine or youve got not proof because a magistrate will ALWAYS accept the laws word over yours full stop.

By all means try it on but, youll end up with a fine three times as big as you would have, if you accept liability.

Ive know this because my old mans a copper.

 

[Tom]

i second the above

 

[RobFenn]

Sounds harsh

 

[Carlouk]

I got done at 102 in my good old punto sporting got a summons and had to to go to Wakefield magistrates court. Represented myself said I had no excuse to be going that fast but the conditions were dry, empty motorway etc. and explained that I needed my car for work. Got 6 points and £100 fine + £35 court costs!

 

[Twit]

Agree with above...

Police are professional witnesses and if it came to a you Vs Police argument you would come second!

I think as part of the Access to Justice Act there was a clause that said the prosecution does not have to divulge any information that could compromise the prosecution unless requested by the defence. What that means is that the summons wont say much! Dont rely on it, get some legal help!

If you go into Court and say I was in a hurry the prosecution will laugh at you, the magistrate will think you are a mailto:tw@t">tw@t and you will make things worse. When you go to court you are better off saying nothing, let you solicitor plea in mitigation and hope!!!

In the case, I think you would have been better advised accepting his offer of 96MPH and taking the three points. If you are found guilty of that in court the court may be a bit fed up that you have wasted their time and give you more than 3 points. If you have previous convictions and you go in front of a magistrate Id be near certain you will be looking a 6.

Harsh, yes but you were doing 120.... It could be worse!

Twit

 

[myky16]

ask to see every bit of paper work that you can go over and over it try to find any error and this can get you off! If you were feeling suicidal explain in court how he tryed to bribe you?

But the thing i carnt work out is why he wants to do you at 96? either a.) he wants you punished so why not 120? or b.)He wants to warn you so should have let you off?