What's the perfect amount of power for a ph1/2 Clio?

[Muzzman]

A while back I had a Lotus Elise with a JDM Integra Type R engine and gearbox, I did all the other adviseable mods like AP Racing brakes, 2 way Ohlins (changed to Nitrons as they failed), buckets harnesses etc. In that spec it was 220hp and the best car I've ever had, loved the thing on road and track. Then I made the huge mistake of getting it Supercharged and charge cooled at huge cost (14k fitted Inc a few other bits and bobs) It ruined the car for me, it was so fast round the track, it was 340hp and weighed 812kg it obliterated everything, it was set up so well that when you lost it it just tried to kill you, it was also too fast for the road. In the hands of a racing driver it was astounding, in my hands not so.

I get frustrated with the Clio on track on the straights and was thinking of the 230hp turbo conversion but I'm also very worried about spoiling the car as above, especially so in a FWD car, what is the perfect amount of power for these cars, I'd probably stay away from the 280hp for the above reason. Turbo charging seems the most cost effective but is it a good solution for track driving, or are ITB's, Cams the way to go.

I'm just going to keep the Clio for years now and have no intension of selling it, I'm just looking for thevperfect mix of balance and power

 

[Ph1 Tom]

I made the mistake of going forced induction on my old Fiesta. Before that it was 200bhp/tonne N/A. Not a lot and yes it was frustrating on the straights but overall it was a good fun car. Then I went turbo, only a little bit more power but masses more torque and it ruined the car in all honesty. It made a better road car but on track the N/A engine was so much better.

I'm in the same boat as you with what to do with the Clio. I was really leaning towards the 230bhp Engine Dynamics kit but after my experience with the Fiesta I'm tempted to get my head ported and polished, set of decent cams, 182 manifold and cat then at a later date get some bodies.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Around 300bhp I reckon is about the optimum if you have decent control over it and a diff and decent handling.

 

[Muzzman]

Difficult one isn't it. Let me know what you decide

Part of me just thinks you have to take these cars for what they are and just put all your effort into learning to pedal them the best you can, I know I can improve. But then it's just so frustrating on tracks with long straights I would like just that bit more uumph so I don't spend the whole time up someone chuff on the bends then they pull away then I'm up there chuff and so it continues, to point I back off and let them get ahead.

I made the mistake of going forced induction on my old Fiesta. Before that it was 200bhp/tonne N/A. Not a lot and yes it was frustrating on the straights but overall it was a good fun car. Then I went turbo, only a little bit more power but masses more torque and it ruined the car in all honesty. It made a better road car but on track the N/A engine was so much better.

I'm in the same boat as you with what to do with the Clio. I was really leaning towards the 230bhp Engine Dynamics kit but after my experience with the Fiesta I'm tempted to get my head ported and polished, set of decent cams, 182 manifold and cat then at a later date get some bodies.

 

[T.Trophy]

I don't think it's really the power you run that spoils a turbo car on track it's the amount of boost you run and the way the power is delivered.

 

[Chip-mk1]

I don't think it's really the power you run that spoils a turbo car on track it's the amount of boost you run and the way the power is delivered.

Agreed so long as you can accurately select the amount of power you want with the throttle at any given moment the fact the engine could make more is irrelevant.

 

[Daniel]

Agreed so long as you can accurately select the amount of power you want with the throttle at any given moment the fact the engine could make more is irrelevant.

So you have internet in your indian cell?

 

[Chip-mk1]

So you have internet in your indian cell?

Yeah man, hotel room is lovely, aircon is properly cold and the wifi is fast.

Feck me is it hot and humid out though, and thats at 5am!

 

[Tony Hunter]

I would suggest that you visit less tracks with long straights then.

Go for Brands, Mallory, Cadwell, Silverstone National (just), Anglesey.

 

[Chip-mk1]

I made the mistake of going forced induction on my old Fiesta. Before that it was 200bhp/tonne N/A. Not a lot and yes it was frustrating on the straights but overall it was a good fun car. Then I went turbo, only a little bit more power but masses more torque and it ruined the car in all honesty. It made a better road car but on track the N/A engine was so much better.

Thats because you didnt have it mapped correctly, 99% of turbo fwd cars are utter utter rubbish on track and most people havent ever experienced one done properly, but it doesnt have to be that way.

Here is the torque delivery of mine at half throttle for example:

 

[Tony Hunter]

Yes Chip, yours is very good, I can vouch for that.

Had a curry yet?

 

[Cupman29]

I made the mistake of going forced induction on my old Fiesta. Before that it was 200bhp/tonne N/A. Not a lot and yes it was frustrating on the straights but overall it was a good fun car. Then I went turbo, only a little bit more power but masses more torque and it ruined the car in all honesty. It made a better road car but on track the N/A engine was so much better.

I'm in the same boat as you with what to do with the Clio. I was really leaning towards the 230bhp Engine Dynamics kit but after my experience with the Fiesta I'm tempted to get my head ported and polished, set of decent cams, 182 manifold and cat then at a later date get some bodies.

Touring cars are forced induction and are probably the best track cars you can get out with single seaters so turbos don't ruin a car but as chip says the mapping certainly could.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Yes Chip, yours is very good, I can vouch for that.

Thanks mate

Had a curry yet?

Nope been in india 24 hours and only had fish and chips and a dominoes pizza so far, lol

Went for an amusing drive with a lad from the hotel though, saw a copper knocked over by two lads on a motorbike and as he got back up they just rode off, he tried to chase on foot and lobbed his big stick thing at them and they just cleared off, lol

 

[Alex Conway]

I would suggest that you visit less tracks with long straights then.

Go for Brands, Mallory, Cadwell, Silverstone National (just), Anglesey.

A 270 bhp r26 got past me on the back straight at Mallory, shame as he was barely any faster on the bends when he had r888 and I had proper road tyres. It made me bitter.

 

[Tony Hunter]

Should have given him a nudge, the end.

 

[Alex Conway]

Should have given him a nudge, the end.

Bloody love it! It was only a track day!

 

[Tony Hunter]

Bloody love it! It was only a track day!

And

 

[Chip-mk1]

Rubbing = racing
Tapping = trackdaying

 

[Wick]

FLOL at the nudge!

OP. Based on the random number generator in my head 200bhp/T NA would do me nicely.

Be that loads of power mods or moderate power mods and a diet for the car.

 

[ventura]

My car is running N/A 218bhp with itbs and cams. Havnt tracked it yet and doing brands on wednesday. The one thing i think i need to change is to put a Cup gearbox in the car as the standard 172 box ratios are to long to get the best out of the power band.

 

[Chip-mk1]

My car is running N/A 218bhp with itbs and cams. Havnt tracked it yet and doing brands on wednesday. The one thing i think i need to change is to put a Cup gearbox in the car as the standard 172 box ratios are to long to get the best out of the power band.

You know that the ratios in the cup are EXACTLY the same "power band" as the Ph1 and all other p2 including 182?

The diff ratio is different on all ph2 boxes (cup or not) which helps in some places, but when you change gear at the shift point in one gear you will be at EXACTLY the same rpm as on your current box when you get into the next gear.