Ding Ding, Coilovers round 2

[p@blo]

Just had a look, are KAM more expensive than Josh?

Is there any benfit in buying the 2`s or is it not worth it for a road car?

Whats the difference between the 1`s and 2`s apart from the price?

Sportline 2 is an invert cartridge up front. The strut casing limits side loading on the shaft via the guide seal assembly, hence the smaller dia shaft/piston for the sportline 2.

Would've thought the sportline 1 would be plenty adequate.

 

[Guy]

Sportline 2 is an invert cartridge up front. The strut casing limits side loading on the shaft via the guide seal assembly, hence the smaller dia shaft/piston for the sportline 2.

Would've thought the sportline 1 would be plenty adequate.

isnt the smaller diameter on the sportline 1?

 

[mark123]

I thought the sportline 2 had a larger diameter strut up front, the benefit being more oil can take more abuse. That is what the power station guy said to me anyway.

I notice that the sportline 1 kit that is 1k does not have the rear coil over it is just an adjustable platform and separate damper.

I have sportline 1s with the rear coilover, they were 1150 in the group buy many years ago.

 

[Mr R.]

Sportline 1 is full coilovers.

 

[p@blo]

isnt the smaller diameter on the sportline 1?

Nope. The cartridge on the sportline 2 is smaller dia & is braced against sideways loading via the strut casing that it sits in.

Haven't measured but i'd imagine theres an equivalent vol of fluid in the smaller reservoir as the shaft is also smaller dia.

Are you confusing the cartridge casing on the sportline 2 with the piston shaft on the sportline 1?

 

[Ph1 Tom]

I'd chance the BCs personally.

 

[mark123]

Sportline 1 is full coilovers.

Are you sure, have you actually spoken to them?

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?680916-AST-Sportline-1-Coilovers-%A3995

The Cooksport website is a shambles I would be phoning and getting confirmation before I spent any money with them.

 

[shiftspark]

I think Mark is right, as mine are a separate spring at the rear.

 

[mark123]

Nope. The cartridge on the sportline 2 is smaller dia & is braced against sideways loading via the strut casing that it sits in.

Haven't measured but i'd imagine theres an equivalent vol of fluid in the smaller reservoir as the shaft is also smaller dia.

Are you confusing the cartridge casing on the sportline 2 with the piston shaft on the sportline 1?

Looking at http://www.astsuspensionuk.com/ it says sportline one is 22mm strut and sportline 2 is 45mm.

I could be wrong about the rear coilover but I think the web based info is contradictory so I would be getting confirmation from a human being before I spent 1k.

 

[Mr R.]

On the cooksports site is says full coilovers with height and damping adjustment.

 

[Mr R.]

Are you sure, have you actually spoken to them?

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?680916-AST-Sportline-1-Coilovers-%A3995

The Cooksport website is a shambles I would be phoning and getting confirmation before I spent any money with them.

On the cooksports site is says full coilovers and shows a picture as well.

 

[Mr R.]

On the cooksports site is says full coilovers and shows a picture as well.

I did phone Josh but he hasnt returned my call.

Ill try again today.

 

[p@blo]

Looking at http://www.astsuspensionuk.com/ it says sportline one is 22mm strut and sportline 2 is 45mm.

But the sportline 2 uses an invert cartridge. The cartridge casing may be 45mm, but the piston rod inside it certainly isn't. At a guess I'd say it was closer to the shaft dia of the rear units.

 

[Chip-mk1]

I think Mark is right, as mine are a separate spring at the rear.

My Sportline 1 are coilover at the rear.


I believe there are 3 options:
cheaper: Sportline 1 fronts with spring platform rear (this is the 995 deal)
middle: Sportline 1 coilover front and rear (approx 1400)
dearer: Sportline 2 coilover front and rear (approx 1600)

 

[Guy]

Think the rear spring was a potential venture to introduce a 600 quidish kit. I checked by pm before I ordered the 995 deal.

quote from inbox:
Difference between Sportline 1 and Sportline 2 is the front dampers. The sportline 2 is an inverted damper.

Rear is coilover unit on both. We can spec the sportline 1 for complete track use, however if this is the case.. the sportline 2 is more suitable. The sportline 1 is still more than capable though (same kit as Tony Hunter races with).

 

[Chip-mk1]

If you are right that the 995 deal is full coilover, thats well over 400 quid less than KAM racing, which just doesnt sound likely as they are normally fairly well priced.

http://www.kamracing.co.uk/car-tuni...vers-renault-clio-mk2-rs-172-172-cup-182.html

 

[p@blo]

If you are right that the 995 deal is full coilover, thats well over 400 quid less than KAM racing, which just doesnt sound likely as they are normally fairly well priced.

http://www.kamracing.co.uk/car-tuni...vers-renault-clio-mk2-rs-172-172-cup-182.html

Isn't that pretty much what some folk ended up paying for Spax? :nono:

 

[Mr R.]

Spax road kit was £750

 

[Chip-mk1]

Spax road kit was £750

IIRC the full coilover ones were about 650 ish bought online, or more like 900 if bought from a trader on here who was selling them.

I think that spax have now stopped people discounting them by more than about 10% though so they are back upto around 800 quid even buying online now.

So yes as p@blo says if you were going to be prepared to pay the enormous markup that some people were making you were paying damn near entry level AST money for a set of shonky old spax shocks.

And I think that is where people have somehow ended up on the ridiculous illusion that spax are in someway vaguely a comparable product.

They arent at all, if you were going to compare them to anything it would need to be the Gaz IMHO, they are roughly equivalent products although the Gaz come with fantastic customer service and the Spax it would appear just come with a company that keeps shrugging their shoulders and going bankrupt everytime they get a lot of warranty claims!

 

[Mr R.]

Cheers Chip thats why I got out and hoping to move onto a better product.

Just lost on what to go for now.

 

[p@blo]

Yup, were £800-900.

April 2012:

Spax won't rust!! They're fully stainless steel and powder coated!! also currently £799.99 (£100 off)

'Shock'ing...

:rasp:

 

[Mr R.]

Bull s**t they do rust, as shown in the pictures of mine.

I also payed in cash.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Cheers Chip thats why I got out and hoping to move onto a better product.

Just lost on what to go for now.

If you really can get the AST1 for 995 like someone mentions in this thread for the full coilover then it seems silly looking at anything else, although personally I dont see how anyone can do them at that price when they are normally hundreds more than that, I thought that was the price with non coilover rears.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Bull s**t they do rust, as shown in the pictures of mine.

I also payed in cash.

When unscupulous people are trying to mug enthusiasts for lots of hard earned cash they will say whatever they need to in order to get a sale sadly.


They are stainless but they are a very poor grade and do indeed rust, although far more of a problem is the way the seals just let go so commonly, a few people seem to have got lucky but the quality control standards there must be awful judging by the number of people who also havent.

 

[Mr R.]

The only part on them which is stainless steel is the adjusting threads on the front shock.
The powder coating flakes off as theres no prep work or prima before the powder coating is done so its coated onto smooth bare metal.

Utter crap.

Live and learn I was lucky enough to sell them on and get some of my money back.
Hence this thread, now I want to buy the right product this time.

 

[Bobby.]

What ever happened to the production of the AST's with non coilover rears for £600?

They would sell like hot cakes I reckon.

 

[Guy]

If you really can get the AST1 for 995 like someone mentions in this thread for the full coilover then it seems silly looking at anything else, although personally I dont see how anyone can do them at that price when they are normally hundreds more than that, I thought that was the price with non coilover rears.

Wasn't it just a really well negotiated discount on the old sportline 1s?

 

[Chip-mk1]

What ever happened to the production of the AST's with non coilover rears for £600?

They would sell like hot cakes I reckon.

I just dont see how you could possibly sell them for that the fronts cost far more than that on their own.

Even KW Variant 1 which arent as good as AST 1 sell for nearer the 800 mark with no coilover rear.


Where was this 600 quid front coilovers thing mentioned? It just doesnt sound realistic at all.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Right, have been doing some digging, and it would appear there are some VERY confused people in this thread with regards to the cheaper option ASTs.


As I mentioned before, there are 3 options, and it looks like I was right on the pricing.

995 from cooksport = AST1 coilover front and non coilover rear
1400 ish = AST1 coilover front and rear
1600 ish = AST2 coilvoer front and rear


A 4th option that was discussed but as far as I am aware hasnt happened is:
600 = AST non coilover front and rear (ie just an upgraded standard shock and spring package)

Here is the post from Josh about it:
www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?680916-AST-Sportline-1-Coilovers-%A3995

We have just managed to confirm a price on the new style AST sportline 1 kit. (£995)

I completely understand that the majority of Clio owners do not want to spend thousands on the best suspension available. I am currently looking at completing our range of AST kits for the Clio 2 model to cater for all price brackets and applications.

With this in mind we have changed the rear coilover unit to the standard spring location. Although this is not really a disadvantage, it does reduce the cost of the kit to manufacture thus lower the retail price.

Please remember that we are using all fantastic quality parts made in Holland (not cheap rubbish) and as much as we would like to supply a coilover kit for £400.. they would just be crap quality, so we are not going to.

I am also currently waiting for prices back on an AST standard replacement damper. This will involve a fixed spring platform and adjustable damping rates (probably). This will be using the same "Shim stack" that is in other AST products. These will be coming in at around £600.


Is this something that anyone is interested in? Or at least a step in the right direction?

Any feedback would be great

Thanks
Josh

Bold = the 995 kit
Italics = the 600 kit

 

[Mr R.]

Thanks Chip.

So would the AST be the coilovers of your choice?

 

[Paprika123]

Josh confirmed in another post that they ended up just doing the full coilover rear for 995...

 

[Chip-mk1]

Josh confirmed in another post that they ended up just doing the full coilover rear for 995...

Awesome value if true, do you have a link to that post?

Edit, found it:

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/show...overs-%A3995&p=9740611&viewfull=1#post9740611


No brainer then IMHO, if you can get the full coilover kit for 995 it would be nuts to buy anything else.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Thanks Chip.

So would the AST be the coilovers of your choice?

Yes, Ive just bought some in fact.

They are a bit harsh in terms of ride if you are doing a lot of road miles though.

 

[MicKPM]

The AST product range on the whole is a cracking bit of engineering and its properly finished. If you want to spend £1400 then do it but they will be punished like any coilover on a road car. This is why I personally went the BCR route as it was £770 vs £990/1400

 

[Paprika123]

http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?685149-Ast-price-for-172-cup

 

[Guy]

Awesome value if true, do you have a link to that post?


No brainer then IMHO, if you can get the full coilover kit for 995 it would be nuts to buy anything else.

exactly my thoughts! I made sure it was te rear coilover before I ordered. Only thing is the waiting time. Ordered on 27th and no news yet.

 

[Chip-mk1]

exactly my thoughts! I made sure it was te rear coilover before I ordered. Only thing is the waiting time. Ordered on 27th and no news yet.

doesnt really matter if you have to wait till xmas if it saves you over 400 quid, lol.

 

[Bobby.]

Ahh yes that was it, replacement dampers, not coilovers, I thought AST's for 600 nicker was too good to be true, lol.

I guess the £995 kit is the one to have then!

 

[Chip-mk1]

Ahh yes that was it, replacement dampers, not coilovers, I thought AST's for 600 nicker was too good to be true, lol.

I guess the £995 kit is the one to have then!

TBH that is still "too good to be true" when you are used to the price being 1400+ for example the came thing.

Difference is that quite surprisingly it actually IS true it would appear, lol.

 

[ilovewilly]

Here's to hoping you make some money on this set :cheers: