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Iceman From April 2011 you now need a Nat A license to race in Britcar Production. You need to check if this new MSA rule will be different for the 24 Hour.........but I doubt it You may end up spending big money on a car and have no race....unless you are already going for 6 race...

What a nice response. To put my inputs here into perspective, I am always on the verge of getting a Clio 197/200 but the ability to get more power holds me back. That is why I follow these projects and developments. Correct me if im wrong, you had 200 Bhp (+16 Bhp) and a very much improved...

Kevo's 200Bhp Clio 197 with just Catcams and a remap from Rs Tuning was run on RS Tunings Dyno Dynamics. It made a gain of 16 Bhp over standard. I thought they had a top reputation. If I was looking for 200 Bhp isnt this a much easier option to get the power?

A while ago didnt Kevs 197 make a peak 200 Bhp and a good 150-165 FtLb from 3000-6500 Rpm with just the Cams and a simple remap of the stock ECU from RS Tuning? If so, where is the big power/torque advantage with this new ECU, Manifold, TB etc???

Welcome ....another hot air blower.

Come on then. Give us a ball park figure if you wanted to go down a similar route without the development costs. Just fitting the cams and having the ECU sitting on a bench in its box will be £2K.

Correct. Whilst there is a whole load of mutual hot air being blown up peoples rear ends on this project, you actually get very little Bhp for lots of £ and this is just another example.

Look at the mods and labour to achieve the +18 Bhp. Cams, ECU, Inlet, loom, linkage, calibration etc.

Like the project. Can't quite appreciate the value for money.

A good result, but worth it for the budget? Cost this out and at about £5K for +18 Bhp puts it into perspective. If this is for a track day biased car, the money invested has been wasted.

Any news on this manifold project or is it still under development?

Them pots are easy to come by with only 5 runners in the Class:D

Not worth it on a standard engine unless associated with additional engine mods that shift the overall power curve. You are already past peak power at the standard rev limit and going slightly beyond would, overall, not provide you with a significantly better acceleration regime. Optimum...

My last post also as we thread drift. The only reason I pressed on this was your wild and completely unfactual statement about torque being the only pre-requisite for speed between corners, max engine torque is where you need to be at and Bhp was complete s**t. You also kept this thread...

Correct. You are working peak power for maximum accleration between gears.

Top marks for persistency Stan. You either don’t have the breadth or depth of knowledge or you are just choosing to ignore the concept that has been put to you so many times now, and not just by me. Let’s keep it on topic and try once more. To quote directly from your own internet article...

How about some nice fruity data logged wheel sensors with angular velocities converted into chassis axis aligned vehicle acceleration values and thus proving acceleration close to peak power is greater than at peak torque? In the correct gear of course.

Yep and also not quite on a par with some nice factual smoothed longitudinal accelerometer data of acceleration values at peak power. Come clean Stan, you must be a Clio DCi man.

No point in trying to talk the torque on this one Stan....

Victory firmly rests with the power/acceleration corner I feel. You just can't beat the physics.

At least you now acknowledge the importance of gearing. This is the critical aspect of the whole argument here. Regarding my last statement, a road vehicle has the benefit of selectable and variable gearing (a gearbox) so you have the choice, at a given road speed between operating at peak...

Stan, we will end up going round in circles. Peak vehicle acceleration comes from peak power with correct gearing. I don't know many single gear ratio race or road vehicles or racers that short shift into the lower rpm torque curve for advantage. Best give it up.

Thing is Stan you are now using power/torque engine comparisons to expand the argument. All I am contesting here is your original statement that you cannot accelerate any faster once you are past peak torque and that ‘corner to corner power means s**t’ . Completely untrue. Without delving...

Mid range torque does provide ‘tractive effort’ but you are ignoring gearing Stan. Maximum tractive effort does not always equate to maximum acceleration because you also have a selection of ratios to choose from. If you chose to operate beyond peak torque in the regime where peak power leads...

Really? What an extreme view. Mid range torque provides traction but if you want to go fast from corner to corner, you need to be operating in a high power band.

Very true. You dont need any supspension modifications to go quicker with R888s. Once up to temperature, they give you more traction, reduce understeer and shorten braking distances.

I facied an in depth reply. The relevance is there if you look for it.

At the limit a tyre is actually working very well. That limit should not be right on the point of losing traction though. You need to be working with a small amount of tyre slip at high adhesion with a good upper margin. That is what you could call the ideal limit. ie working the tyre to...

15 deg ambient day. Brands Indy circuit. Stock Clio chassis/suspension. 2 sec per lap reduction on R888s compared to Exaltos

The top one must be better as its more shiny.