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1.2 16v Poor Economy 30mpg on petrol or LPG



  '01 Clio 1.2 16v LPG
Hi all, thanks in advance for your help.

I have a 2001 1.2 16v Clio which has a Prinns LPG conversion. It runs okay on both petrol and LPG, I think it is a bit down on power top end when on petrol, but fine on LPG. However it only returns 30mpg. Doesn't matter if I am doing 70mph on the motorway, 50mph on a single carriageway or town driving at rush hour or if I use petrol or LPG.

I have searched the forum and many people are saying that the coolant temp sensor could be at fault, or a lambda sensor. I have had my usual garage check these out, and the coolant sensor reads fine, as does the precat lambda, but they said the post cat lambda is giving unusual readings. They have said this is unlikely to be the cause of the poor economy, is that correct?

Unfortunately they are EXTREMELY anti LPG, as such, they have advised me that the LPG system is faulty and interfering with the readings from the lambda sensor :S or the valves have burnt out, and I am loosing compression through the exhaust valves.

After some help really on where to start? Just so you all know the car is serviced every 10k miles by me with 5w30 fully synthetic oil, just had new air filter, spark plugs and coil pack. The cat does have a metallic rattle from inside it, but there were no issues with the emissions at MOT nor is there any management lights on the dash. The car is running on Continental EcoContact tyres all round which are only 1000 miles old and set at 34 front and 32 back.

Could the post lambda sensor be causing the issue?

Should I test or change the coolant temp sensor anyway?

Anything else it could be?
 
  Clio
How many miles are on the engine ? From the little I know the the post cat lambda DOES effect the fuel trim and hence economy but I'm sure ill get corrected lol
 
  '01 Clio 1.2 16v LPG
Thanks for your response Spot. The engine has got 120k on the clock. It has full service history, and starts, stop, idles and in general runs very well!
 
  Moogun B95
I'm inclined to agree with the last post, with Gas being a nightmare to correctly setup the lambda feedback, and usually its dogged onto the petrol lambda sensors.. I would suspect the feedback to the petrol ecu is not correct.
 
How would this help!! Having said that, don't think I have, sorry!! If you tell me what you would like photos of I can see what I can do!

Just I had a 1.2 16v on LPG. See of its my old one. Can't be that many about.

Sorry it's probably unhelpful
 
  '01 Clio 1.2 16v LPG
Tracking is fine, just done a couple of months back.

Had a compression test done and it is showing 130psi on cylinders 1 to 3, but struggling to make 100psi on cylinder 4.

I am surprised as the car runs fairly well, no issues starting or idling or pulling really, just the poor economy. Does this sound correct? I am thinking now to strip the head and repair the valve seats, skimming at the same time. Is there anything else I should check first before starting this work?
 
  '01 Clio 1.2 16v LPG
Just I had a 1.2 16v on LPG. See of its my old one. Can't be that many about.

Sorry it's probably unhelpful

I will see if I can take a photo tomorrow. It is in blue and was bought from Andover. Vehicle was converted to Prinns by the local Prins specialist nearby.
 
  '01 Clio 1.2 16v LPG
I will see if I can take a photo tomorrow. It is in blue and was bought from Andover. Vehicle was converted to Prinns by the local Prins specialist nearby.

Maybe not "tomorrow" as promised but see photo below!! Private registration though, and not the best photo, lost the one at the front...
2014-03-02171837_zps22b26f0a.jpg
 
  '01 Clio 1.2 16v LPG
Tracking is fine, just done a couple of months back.

Had a compression test done and it is showing 130psi on cylinders 1 to 3, but struggling to make 100psi on cylinder 4.

I am surprised as the car runs fairly well, no issues starting or idling or pulling really, just the poor economy. Does this sound correct? I am thinking now to strip the head and repair the valve seats, skimming at the same time. Is there anything else I should check first before starting this work?

Another update for you all, gone a bit quiet as I have been installing a Prins kit on my other car a Sportage, running excellent now!

I took the leap and bought a compression testing kit myself as something was niggling at me about the garages results. Anyway findings below:

Cylinder Dry Wet
1 146 159
2 148 152
3 140 140
4 148 160

So, first things first, there is NOT poor compression on any of the cylinders, at least not to the degree the garage suggested. They only did a dry test and said that cylinder 4 wouldn't get above 100psi. Any thoughts on the figures, I think they are all okay?!

Apart from being annoyed, I am a little stumped now, I assume we return back to the CAT &/or lambda sensors being at fault? I haven't done a vacuum test, but with the rattling CAT I think it is goosed anyway.

Look forward to hearing your thoughts...
 
  '01 Clio 1.2 16v LPG
Just a little update for you if you are interested. I have had the cat and both pre and post lambda sensors changed (genuine 2nd hand units) and done about 300miles. Early indications shown that the car is doing 45MPG now on petrol.


I have not run it on LPG yet as I have discovered a number of minor problems with the install, so planning on fixing them first.


Will update once this is done and I am running on LPG.


Cheers all for your help.
 


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