172 vs 197

[mad in general]

Last night I went for a drive with a neighbour (new driving buddies). He has a 197, myself in the 172.

Both cars are standard and I was pleasantly surprised that there was literally nothing between the two, Both at higher speeds and up through the gears.

I have never had a duel with an equivalent car so can you tell me, Does it sound like my car will be making decent power? Should there be a difference between these two cars?

Cheers
Dave

 

[Addicted]

The 197 is faster, but heavier, so it sounds about right.

When I had a play with my friends 197 I was actually out-accelerating him, but unless you know the power of each cars it sounds about right.

 

[ABOO]

Only blink and you miss it difference between all range IMO. 0.5 of a second in real world is nothing...

 

[mad in general]

Well I am glad to hear it. I must admit I was expecting there to be a noticeable difference between us.

When the opportunity arose we were both WOT through 2nd and 3rd gears and it was neck and neck. Pretty chuffed.
Although we were far from driving at the limit I did notice that he could corner a bit quicker than I was comfortable with. Maybe car maybe driver.

 

[Knuckles]

There isn't much difference in bhp per tonne between the RS clios (inc v6 iirc) so I wouldn't expect either to pull away.

Mk3s are known to be able to take corners better than mk2s.

i was surprised when I pulled away from a 182 a while back but he had a passanger and could've had a weak engine

 

[Chip-mk1]

The mk3 suspension setup on the front is better, but they are heavier, so the effect is lost a bit cause of that, main thing letting the handling of a 172 down versus a 197 normally these days is play in the suspension and steering components on the older car, with it all refreshed the handling difference is pretty minimal as the extra weight you have to carry cancels out some of the gains from the better design.
If you have a look at laptimes for both cars, there isnt a huge amount in it really.

 

[Knuckles]

How much heavier is a mk3 than a mk2?

Could you get a mk3 down to mk2 weight?

Edit

172: 1021kg
197: 1240kg

yeah, you're not going to lose 220kg easily are you lol

 

[Tin cup]

Does the mk3 have a spare wheel

 

[Martin.]

Is a 172 actually that light?

​

 

[Matt W]

Does the mk3 have a spare wheel

​Nope!

 

[Chip-mk1]

Is a 172 actually that light?

​

They vary between the different versions but they are all in the 1000-1100 region

182 cheats by not including a spare wheel of course, weight you can easily lose from any 172 anyway.

 

[Martin.]

I'd be interested to know what a 182 actually weighs and whether it matches the claimed figures.

 

[Dave..]

I'd be interested to know what a 182 actually weighs and whether it matches the claimed figures.

Standard 182 with a quarter of a tank weighs 1150kg

 

[Poopensharten]

Down to the size of the drivers coconuts AFAIK

 

[Gally]

30mpg vs 20mpg.

 

[cliosport197iow]

How much heavier is a mk3 than a mk2?

Could you get a mk3 down to mk2 weight?

Edit

172: 1021kg
197: 1240kg

yeah, you're not going to lose 220kg easily are you lol

Remove the rear seats!!!

 

[LiamR172]

The 197 is faster, but heavier, so it sounds about right.

Maybe more powerfull but its not 'faster'.

All depends whos on the loud pedal first and whos got bigger balls as danny says.

Its hard to say, your car is faster than his when you are racing along an open road.

Too many things to take into account.

 

[Knuckles]

Remove the rear seats!!!

Lol. Working on it.

​if all goes to plan I'll put a thread up

 

[Munson]

197 is way faster and looks about a hundred times better.

 

[plymcl172]

so many factors in 'my car is faster than yours' to take in. Traffic, roads, who put their foot down first, who has the bigger balls etc. the list goes on

 

[Chip-mk1]

197 is way faster

You clearly havent driven both?
Or there was something wrong with the 172 you drove.

Practically nothing in it.

and looks about a hundred times better.

Certainly looks a lot more modern, although "better" is a subjective term.

 

[Knuckles]

Hook, line and sinker?

 

[Chip-mk1]

Nah, just playing the game

I know he is trolling, but someone finding this thread on a search might not, so its better if its accurate IMHO

 

[Kyle 86]

197 is way faster and looks about a hundred times better.

Are u joking?? 197's are the slowest clios made. A PH1 172 or PH2 cup would flop a 197

 

[Knuckles]

Fairy nuff

 

[Munson]

I was actually trolling, but using a valid opinion as bait

I have driven both. I owned a 182 for five years and had an extensive test drive in a 197. I think, in my hands at least, the 197 is the faster car across ground. The handling is more confidence inspiring and it has significantly more grip.

 

[Chip-mk1]

I was actually trolling, but using a valid opinion as bait

I have driven both. I owned a 182 for five years and had an extensive test drive in a 197. I think, in my hands at least, the 197 is the faster car across ground. The handling is more confidence inspiring and it has significantly more grip.

Yes the 197 is more idiotproof handling wise, so probably really suited you

 

[Munson]

I am many things sir, but an idiot is not one of them.

AFAIK.

 

[Kyle 86]

197 does handle a bit better. & they have much better sized steering wheels lol, i like all the clios

 

[Chip-mk1]

I was actually trolling

I am many things sir, but an idiot is not one of them.

Well if you care if you get thought of one, dont troll like one is probably the answer, we know nothing about you other than what you post after all...

 

[Munson]

I don't care though TBF but thanks

 

[Chip-mk1]

I don't care

Strange that you took the time to post about it then.

Still "nowt so queer as folk" i suppose.

 

[Munson]

Indeed. I'm not going to be counter trolled into justifying why I think the 197 is faster. I already explained why I think it is, and fairly sure you agree to some extent.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Indeed. I'm not going to be counter trolled

might be too late to make that decision, who knows...

into justifying why I think the 197 is faster. I already explained why I think it is, and fairly sure you agree to some extent.

As I said, I think the 197 is even more idiotproof handling wise than the 172, so its easier to drive fast, but I dont actually think it is faster as such, I think someone who knows what they are doing will make similar progress in both cars, but that someone who isnt a very experience trackday driver would probably be quicker in the 197.
A bit like a 4000bhp evo compared to a 200bhp caterham for example. Similar lap times in the hands of someone who knows what they are doing, but an idiot/inexperienced driver will be way quicker in the evo.

 

[Munson]

I agree. Which is why I stated that the 197 would be faster in my hands, not yours. I'm not a very good driver.

 

[rdoxenham]

I had a play with a 197/200 (forgive my ignorance, I'm not sure which it was) at Silverstone. My 172 Cup was marginally quicker, hardly anything in it on the straights. My engine with the exception of the exhaust is standard, the other car was too. Mine has been stripped though, not sure how much difference that will make. I'm no racing driver!

 

[Matthew]

Aren't the 197's known for making no-where near the 197hp, an issue that was resolved in the 200?

I remember a RR day where a 197 made 178hp.

 

[Chip-mk1]

Aren't the 197's known for making no-where near the 197hp, an issue that was resolved in the 200?

I remember a RR day where a 197 made 178hp.

Well even renault only claimed 194bhp iirc (the 197 is in ps not bhp), but yes as standard its rare for one to make over about 185 from what I have seen.

Much like you wont see a 182 make the numbers generally either, and even a lot of 172s fell short as standard.

 

[Šįk]

Flol @ Roy being 'counter trolled'.

PSJ.

 

[Matthew]

I don't know how Renault get away with the climed power figures.

VW don't quote 200hp for the GTI and they the make 180hp.

​Its a sham.