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Clio F1 R27
I've owned a 172 Cup for 3.5 years, a 172 Sport for 9 months and I now have an R27.
I think that qualifies me for a unbiased opinion.
The 197 is a far superior car in so many ways. The handling is in a different league, there is hardly any understeer and the turnin response blows the 1*2 away. The chassis is so predictable and solid and it is just as quick as the previous models.
The 197 is much better made, it's more solid and refined. The seats are better positioned and it is more comfortable on long journeys. It feels like a complete car, whereas the 1*2's have so many flaws and need constant attention.
You can be a holigan in the 197 or a grandad. The 1*2's are tiring to drive in traffic and in the wet, whereas the 197 is so smooth and drives with ease.
Until you have owned both models, I don't you can really say which one is better.
I remember putting a thread on this site last April regarding my experiences of driving a 197 and how I loved my 172's but accepted that the 197 was better overall. I got completely slated by so many 1*2 owners.
On the looks....My R27 has had more attention in the one month I've owned it than I did in 4.5 years of 172 ownership!
Anyone that say's it's slower is full of shite. It is just as quick (even quicker round a track) and until you own one then stop talking about something that isn't true!
I think that qualifies me for a unbiased opinion.
The 197 is a far superior car in so many ways. The handling is in a different league, there is hardly any understeer and the turnin response blows the 1*2 away. The chassis is so predictable and solid and it is just as quick as the previous models.
The 197 is much better made, it's more solid and refined. The seats are better positioned and it is more comfortable on long journeys. It feels like a complete car, whereas the 1*2's have so many flaws and need constant attention.
You can be a holigan in the 197 or a grandad. The 1*2's are tiring to drive in traffic and in the wet, whereas the 197 is so smooth and drives with ease.
Until you have owned both models, I don't you can really say which one is better.
I remember putting a thread on this site last April regarding my experiences of driving a 197 and how I loved my 172's but accepted that the 197 was better overall. I got completely slated by so many 1*2 owners.
On the looks....My R27 has had more attention in the one month I've owned it than I did in 4.5 years of 172 ownership!
Anyone that say's it's slower is full of shite. It is just as quick (even quicker round a track) and until you own one then stop talking about something that isn't true!
Clio F1 R27
It's still a better car which has been proven in enough tv, magazine reviews and series races.
completely agree, I'll be looking at R27's next I think, but then I've just given mine a new lease of life with ITB's and new super duper coilovers. Will be able to show you pesky 197 boys the way now, got left for dead on the Renault Sport Bolton meet though, they handles SOOOOOO much better it's almost unbelievable!
Don't you have a car from the 80's (valver)?
+1.
Mr Burns
ClioSport Club Member
Swift Sport
A Flamin' Red one
Ditto. When I see a nice example of a 197 I take notice but they just seem a little too large and tame looking. When I started thinking about buying a 172 the chief mechanic at my local Renault garage who happened to walk past and comment on wone I was looking at on the forecourt said that the 197 has lost that rawness and fling into the corner fun. Now, I've not driven a 197 so I can't personally comment but I'd say his opinion was a good one.
Gaz_
ClioSport Club Member
Extreme mode
Must be true if a Renault mechanic says so......
Clio 182 FF Cup
Just purchased a 182, was seriously looking at the R27, but decided that for ~£5k less I could get a mint 182 and couldn’t justify the extra cash for the R27. The reason being, I test drove the R27, thought it was superb, but in comparison to the 182 its less muscular, you have to rev the nuts of it to make any real progress, where as with the 182 usually going up to 4k rpm with half throttle is easily enough to leave standard road cars well behind, this is more like the normal driving I would rather, yes you will be going very slightly faster in a 197 if you’re going 100%, but if you’re just driving reasonably normally the 182 doesn’t punish you as much for being in 3rd rather than 2nd - it’s easier to drive moderately fast. The reason for this is Renaults famous power figures, if the 182 tells white lies about its power then the 197 took acting classes, this tied to the extra weight really hampers acceleration, unless you have 5500rpm dialled in, but then everyone knows your flat out.
The one thing that the 197's really show the earlier cars is build quality, but if this is top of your list go buy something German, I understand its important, but I would rather a car that’s pure and focussed with a few rattles than a moderately quick unless being spanked Astra sized tourer – I wanted a hot hatch after all.
Renault either need to turbo-charge the new Clio or put it on a diet, Evo mag agrees:
About the 197: "A good car but not a great one - To be honest I was expecting better from Renaultsport"
On the 182: "Not only has Renault raised the power, it's also raised the Clio's game - I think it's the best hot hatch ever built"
Why spend the extra money? I simply couldn't justify it.
The one thing that the 197's really show the earlier cars is build quality, but if this is top of your list go buy something German, I understand its important, but I would rather a car that’s pure and focussed with a few rattles than a moderately quick unless being spanked Astra sized tourer – I wanted a hot hatch after all.
Renault either need to turbo-charge the new Clio or put it on a diet, Evo mag agrees:
About the 197: "A good car but not a great one - To be honest I was expecting better from Renaultsport"
On the 182: "Not only has Renault raised the power, it's also raised the Clio's game - I think it's the best hot hatch ever built"
Why spend the extra money? I simply couldn't justify it.
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Former R27 & Mk1 V6 owner
197 for me, makes the Ph2 range look very dated IMO. Also, I find it much nicer to drive, it's the same performance in a straight line despite being heavier/bigger/safer/whatever and yet manages to be better in the bends in most peoples eyes - and I suppose that Evo thing against the Trophy proved it because it was getting higher mid corner speeds. Apparently that matters - but really, who GAF about corner speeds acheived by a racing driver on a track?
All I know is, it's the same speed in a straight line and to me it feels much more composed and planted in the corners - which I prefer, and I know some people prefer the twitchy, light rear feeling of the 1*2, that's fine, it's not for me to tell people what to like or drive
All I know is, it's the same speed in a straight line and to me it feels much more composed and planted in the corners - which I prefer, and I know some people prefer the twitchy, light rear feeling of the 1*2, that's fine, it's not for me to tell people what to like or drive
ForceIndia
ClioSport Club Member
Gentlemans spec 200
Interesting that on renaultsport there's a few people looking to trade 197's in for trophy's/182's. Main complaint (there words) "having to rev the tits off it just to keep up with normal cars".
ForceIndia
ClioSport Club Member
Gentlemans spec 200
Same speed when ragging it. Part throttle, the 182's are quicker. 197 feels underengined. IMO.197 for me, makes the Ph2 range look very dated IMO. Also, I find it much nicer to drive, it's the same performance in a straight line despite being heavier/bigger/safer/whatever and yet manages to be better in the bends in most peoples eyes - and I suppose that Evo thing against the Trophy proved it because it was getting higher mid corner speeds. Apparently that matters - but really, who GAF about corner speeds acheived by a racing driver on a track?
All I know is, it's the same speed in a straight line and to me it feels much more composed and planted in the corners - which I prefer, and I know some people prefer the twitchy, light rear feeling of the 1*2, that's fine, it's not for me to tell people what to like or drive
Former R27 & Mk1 V6 owner
Part throttle? WTF? As if it matters how fast it is when you're not trying to go quickly.
As for the people on the RS forum, good luck to them. This whole thread is just here to cause an argument anyway, and you know it
There should just be a sticky at the top "182 or 197? - Make your own f**king mind up"no no no lol i guessed that most would say 1*2 because its what they own, and theres less people on here who have driven both to the extent where they can fairly compare the two.
Part throttle? WTF? As if it matters how fast it is when you're not trying to go quickly.
As for the people on the RS forum, good luck to them. This whole thread is just here to cause an argument anyway, and you know it
Former R27 & Mk1 V6 owner
I apologise I haven't owned a 1*2 (in the strictest sense heh) anyway, so I'm probably not as well advised to comment as a lot of the 197 owners on here who made the upgrade () from a 1*2. I love driving mine though, I loved it on The 'Ring as well, and I'd recommend it to anyone who asked me
All of my mates who have driven it have loved it as well, and they're mainly coming from hot hatches (Corsa VXR, CTR, MCS, Astra Coupe Turbo), so it can't be that bad, even my mum likes it hehe
I haven't owned a 1*2 (in the strictest sense heh) anyway, so I'm probably not as well advised to comment as a lot of the 197 owners on here who made the upgrade () from a 1*2. I love driving mine though, I loved it on The 'Ring as well, and I'd recommend it to anyone who asked me All of my mates who have driven it have loved it as well, and they're mainly coming from hot hatches (Corsa VXR, CTR, MCS, Astra Coupe Turbo), so it can't be that bad, even my mum likes it hehe
ForceIndia
ClioSport Club Member
Gentlemans spec 200
With the exception of the mini, none of them are great cars. Hell, the CTR is probably the only hot hatch with less steering feel! Trophy's already down as an all time great. Hasn't been any version of the 197 (yet) that will.I apologise
All of my mates who have driven it have loved it as well, and they're mainly coming from hot hatches (Corsa VXR, CTR, MCS, Astra Coupe Turbo), so it can't be that bad, even my mum likes it hehe
what on earth is 1*2.
182 and 172
lol, are they really that similar they they can be grouped together when talking about a new car?
instead of saying 182 and 172 all the time, when referring to both its custom to say 1*2, guess this thread is based on looks mostly
riz
ClioSport Club Member
Jaguar XFR
If the 197 gave better MPG i would probably buy one, looks wise there very nice/aggressive. Driving is a totally different experience from the 182 i still feel it is a very very competent drive but maybe not as raw as the 182. I dont know if it is any different but in the 1*2 when cornering very fast it never felt too clever but otherwise fantastic. All the magazines love the 197 tbh but they never really rated the 182 (except Evo) so hard to assertain an unbiased opinion.
Former R27 & Mk1 V6 owner
Your dedication to the Trophy is admirable it must be said, but this thread was 'which would you rather own' - which I answered with reasons (which I did state were just my opinions). Obviously they all think (my friends with the cars referred to above) their cars are better than the Trophy, otherwise they'd all have bought one as they all spent Trophy money or more on them. They're not great cars - in your opinion, or the opinion of some others - but I bet it's not hard to find a lot people that would tell you any of those is better than the Trophy.
Not that I mentioned the Trophy anywhere in my reply. You just decided to add that their opinions didn't matter because they didn't own a Trophy, which you think is an all time great. Do you think only people who own Trophys are qualified to say whether a car is good or not or something?
Simply arguing with everyone that would rather own a 197 isn't going to make them think "Oh god Warren's right! I better get out there and buy a Trophy right now!" - it just makes you look seriously defensive heh. If it's that good, how come you want to sell it to spend most of the money on a Ph1 172 and a load of mods/respray etc? (Your plans might of changed since that thread I read/replied to with the RB PH1 172 on the wheels you wanted PSing into anthracite - so this might not be accurate any more)
As Riz says, the only mag (and I know it's wrong to base anything on what the mags say - as they have adverts etc as well to think about) that loves the 182 is Evo - yet they all seem to really like the 197. You're obviously not a fan of the CTR either - when an awful lot of people would rank that above the Trophy - are they wrong? You say the Trophy is an all time great - who says? Aside from Evo again... I prefer the 197 so to me, the R27 is an 'all time great' above the Trophy which I would still rank very highly indeed as anyone would be hard pressed to say it's a bad hot hatch. Am I 'wrong' to like the R27 more?
If most of the ice cream lovers world voted chocolate was the 'all time great' ice cream flavour, but in my opinion Banana was nicer - would my opinion be wrong?
I'm not saying you're wrong for liking the Trophy the best dude, that's fair, it's a great car - just it's not necessary to argue it all the time. And everytime someone says they prefer the 197, you don't need to tell them all your reasons for thinking they're wrong, because you're not going to change their mind. Just let it slide, accept opinions differ and chill out
You're going to give yourself an ulcer at this rate!
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