A few questions - ITB related

[.Joe]

Hi there,

1.i'm currently looking to change my radiator for a slightly smaller one, i've heard the polo rads are supposed to fit, does any one have a partnumber for this?
2. i've been looking for a oil filter relocation kit as i cant justify having to remove the bumper everytime i need need to change the oil.
3. Jenvey filter and backplate - where would the best place be to purchase these?

Many thanks

Joe

 

[16v_paddy]

Filter & backplate from Jenvey http://www.jenvey.co.uk/

I'm a bit stumped as to why you'd need to remove the bumper to change the oil filter tbh :S but the parts to relocate it are readily available from rallydesign http://www.rallydesign.co.uk/index.php?cPath=340

 

[.Joe]

Filter & backplate from Jenvey http://www.jenvey.co.uk/

I'm a bit stumped as to why you'd need to remove the bumper to change the oil filter tbh :S but the parts to relocate it are readily available from rallydesign http://www.rallydesign.co.uk/index.php?cPath=340

Cheers for those links, ive got Itb's fitted and there is next to no room to get to the filter so thought about relocating it to an easier place, more or less to be lazy.

 

[16v_paddy]

Having itb's on mine makes it easier to get at the filter but it's a mk1 with F7 engine, filter in the same place as an F4. Must just be a mk2 problem then lol!

 

[.Joe]

its more radiator is too big, and generally convinience.

 

[Ph1 Tom]

Hi there,

1.i'm currently looking to change my radiator for a slightly smaller one, i've heard the polo rads are supposed to fit, does any one have a partnumber for this?
2. i've been looking for a oil filter relocation kit as i cant justify having to remove the bumper everytime i need need to change the oil.

Many thanks

Joe

1. If you look through my build thread you'll find the details on the radiator, its a Scirocco/Gold/Toledo item, http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?682060-ITB-d-Road-amp-Track-Ph1-Titanium-172/page10 I'm running 1 x 12" fans but it would be better with 2 x 10" or 2 x 11". The standard radiator and fan combo means the fan covers almost the entire area, whereas the new radiator its only about 55%.

2. I don't need to remove the bumper to change the filter, then again although I've got the same ITBs I've got the longer, angled trumpets and the different radiator. I've got plenty of access though.

 

[Mar172]

What's the polo rad setup like driving the car daily ? I have the Ktec itbs ready to fit but was thinking more on he lines of a nice custom alloy rad

 

[Ph1 Tom]

What's the polo rad setup like driving the car daily ? I have the Ktec itbs ready to fit but was thinking more on he lines of a nice custom alloy rad

Polo rad is smaller than mine so can't comment although a few people have had issues with it getting too hot but the one I've got is bigger and works fine. Like I said its just making sure you cover more area of the rad with fans for traffic. The single 12" fan does the job in traffic on the hottest days but only just, 2 x 10 or 2 x 11" would be much better.

 

[LiamR172]

What's the polo rad setup like driving the car daily ? I have the Ktec itbs ready to fit but was thinking more on he lines of a nice custom alloy rad

My car has been absolutely spotless with the polo rad. Had no overheating issues at all.

Also I have plenty room to get to the filter with it.

 

[Fraser.J.]

Ye but you live in Inverness, where it's barely above 5 degrees at the best of times [emoji6]

 

[SharkyUK]

Personally I think the VW Polo rad is crap - here's what happened last weekend. Admittedly I got stuck in a freak traffic jam on an unseasonally hot day in South Wales (25 degrees). I couldn't get out the stream of traffic and had to abandon the car as plumes of steam suddenly erupted from the engine bay! It didn't help the traffic congestion...

I've got a custom rad setup on order / being fabricated and can't wait to get it fitted. Bear in mind I'm running a forged setup, high-compression build and it generates a LOT of heat. The VW Polo rad just does not cut it in this case. Especially not on my Trophy where I use it on road as well as for the odd track day here and there

 

[LiamR172]

Ye but you live in Inverness, where it's barely above 5 degrees at the best of times [emoji6]

Lol, true! Also not as much traffic to be stick in compared to bigger cities.

 

[LiamR172]

Personally I think the VW Polo rad is crap - here's what happened last weekend. Admittedly I got stuck in a freak traffic jam on an unseasonally hot day in South Wales (25 degrees). I couldn't get out the stream of traffic and had to abandon the car as plumes of steam suddenly erupted from the engine bay! It didn't help the traffic congestion...

I've got a custom rad setup on order / being fabricated and can't wait to get it fitted. Bear in mind I'm running a forged setup, high-compression build and it generates a LOT of heat. The VW Polo rad just does not cut it in this case. Especially not on my Trophy where I use it on road as well as for the odd track day here and there

Seeing as your car gets a lot hotter it's not really fair to say the polo rad is crap is it? Haha.

 

[.Joe]

Cheers for all the input, I've got a polo rad on order, but I can't for the life of me work out how the fans going to fit, I spent a few hours checking the forum but no one has explained

 

[LiamR172]

What fan are you going to use?

 

[.Joe]

I'm not actually sure, I've only seen ones that are bolted through the rad

 

[SharkyUK]

Seeing as your car gets a lot hotter it's not really fair to say the polo rad is crap is it? Haha.

LOL! Yep, it is perfectly fair to say it!

If it were a pure track car then it would not be so much an issue. Or if it didn't get used much. Or if there was no other traffic to get caught up in. If you're regularly in standing or slow-moving traffic then I'd look for a better solution I'm not biased. Just don't want to see potentially a grand or two's (or more) worth of engine ruined for the sake of a few hundred quid's worth (if that) of decent radiator setup.

 

[AlexW]

Run two fans if required, perhaps one on a seperate circuit so its a switch on the dash. This is how my mates Ph1 on ITBs is.

As for oil filter, you could do as Jay has done, or just remove the filter/trumpets when wanting to change the oil filter. You may require a oil cooler if you use your car properly and get the oil hot, two birds, one stone.

 

[LiamR172]

What sort of benifit is there from an oil cooler? Obviously cools the oil down but why would you need that over the normal?

 

[16v_paddy]

I've got a custom rad setup on order / being fabricated and can't wait to get it fitted. Bear in mind I'm running a forged setup, high-compression build and it generates a LOT of heat. The VW Polo rad just does not cut it in this case.

It's the same with mk1's of the high comp itb'd variety, the VAG (not sure if it's a polo 1 though) rads people use don't seem to cope very well, they're fine with standard comp though. Just 1 of those annoying extra expenses when going for the silly spec engines

 

[Ph1 Tom]

I've had mine stuck in traffic with ambient over 30 degrees and no steam. But it's a scirocco rad not a polo rad. The polo rad is much smaller, just looking at the dimensions you can see it's not sufficient.

Using the car properly requires an oil cooler, the oil will get to the point where the chains will shear. Having the filter on the sandwich plate moves it away from the block slightly.

 

[16v_paddy]

What sort of benifit is there from an oil cooler? Obviously cools the oil down but why would you need that over the normal?

If the oil gets too hot it basically gets too thin to do it's job properly so could potentially munch the engine. With a cooler and good quality oil you can essentially just forget about it, not have to worry & just keep hammering the car.
I did just that on my 1st ever trackday, paranoid as fcuk about the oil temp going too high, constantly watching the gauge. Temp was fine so just kept going & going right up to the point I completely cooked the brakes

 

[LiamR172]

Would it be worth it on a daily driver that gets abused now and then?

How much effort is involved in fitting a cooler?

 

[16v_paddy]

I'd say yes as it's a case of fit & forget and be left with a problem that you'll never have to worry or think about again. As long as you fit a sandwich plate with a thermostat that is

 

[.Joe]

Mr postman made a brilliant delivery this morning,

Shall be adding an oil cooler in the near future

This is the space I have to work with at the moment, once the aircon pumps gone should be much more room

 

[masekwm]

The difference is that the car abov has the slam panel removed the smaller radiator gives loads more room, but you'd also need to remove the slam panel and fit bonnet catchs to get the same space.

 

[LiamR172]

Well then... get rid of your slam panel and get some aero catches!

And also get that bay tidied up!

 

[Ph1 Tom]

Mr postman made a brilliant delivery this morning,

Shall be adding an oil cooler in the near future

This is the space I have to work with at the moment, once the aircon pumps gone should be much more room

Be careful with that type of hose, those fittings are for a different push-on hose, I got caught out buying a cheaper supposedly socketless hose. I've lost an engine to the hose you have (or it looks like you have), even with double clamping it on the hose take-offs.

Here's a photo of the correct stuff, you might not be able to see properly but its got a harder outer layer wrapped around.

This is the stuff, PITA to get the fittings onto, you need to use boiling water to soften the hose to get the fittings on http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Aeroquip-...ts_Vehicles_Automobila_ET&hash=item5662466287


I've got a fair bit more space with the longer trumpets and Scirocco rad, you'd be able to make the trumpets even longer on a Ph2. The angle of the DTH ITBs from the butterfly to the engine is better than the SF bodies on the MR23 manifold but the trumpet length and filter location is really compromised, hence I've done what you can see below, doesn't cost much but has many benefits.

£100 on them gets you more power, better torque, more space to work (negates the need for remote filter and having to remove bumpers), better airflow especially with the bonnet closed and so on. Such a worthwhile addition if you run the KTec DTH ITBs.

Here is a bit of data behind longer trumpets on the Clio http://www.emeraldm3d.com/articles/mar2012/

FYI Anyone who wants a radiator that fits with ITBs, is bigger than the polo rad (which is too small and thin) and is very cheap at £20-30 for a standard one and £110-£120 for an alloy version with a thicker core. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VW-GOLF-M...ts_SM&fits=Model:Scirocco&hash=item51c16c9a41

Alloy version http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ALUMINUM-...arts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item1c2ca0a390

 

[.Joe]

Be careful with that type of hose, those fittings are for a different push-on hose, I got caught out buying a cheaper supposedly socketless hose. I've lost an engine to the hose you have (or it looks like you have), even with double clamping it on the hose take-offs.

Here's a photo of the correct stuff, you might not be able to see properly but its got a harder outer layer wrapped around.

This is the stuff, PITA to get the fittings onto, you need to use boiling water to soften the hose to get the fittings on http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Aeroquip-...ts_Vehicles_Automobila_ET&hash=item5662466287


I've got a fair bit more space with the longer trumpets and Scirocco rad, you'd be able to make the trumpets even longer on a Ph2. The angle of the DTH ITBs from the butterfly to the engine is better than the SF bodies on the MR23 manifold but the trumpet length and filter location is really compromised, hence I've done what you can see below, doesn't cost much but has many benefits.

£100 on them gets you more power, better torque, more space to work (negates the need for remote filter and having to remove bumpers), better airflow especially with the bonnet closed and so on. Such a worthwhile addition if you run the KTec DTH ITBs.

Here is a bit of data behind longer trumpets on the Clio http://www.emeraldm3d.com/articles/mar2012/

FYI Anyone who wants a radiator that fits with ITBs, is bigger than the polo rad (which is too small and thin) and is very cheap at £20-30 for a standard one and £110-£120 for an alloy version with a thicker core. http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VW-GOLF-M...ts_SM&fits=Model:Scirocco&hash=item51c16c9a41

Alloy version http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ALUMINUM-...arts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item1c2ca0a390

For the hose I got myself the gates stuff with the harder outer layer and ditched the stuff that felt like heater hose, I used to run the same stuff on my old cooper, preferably I would of run braided with the aeroquips, but unfortunately funds don't allow for it,
The second radiator the measurements on that are similar to the rad I've ordered, just need to get myself a fan that fits on

I may be contacting you a bit later about the angle adapters

Cheers

Joe

 

[Ph1 Tom]

For the hose I got myself the gates stuff with the harder outer layer and ditched the stuff that felt like heater hose, I used to run the same stuff on my old cooper, preferably I would of run braided with the aeroquips, but unfortunately funds don't allow for it,
The second radiator the measurements on that are similar to the rad I've ordered, just need to get myself a fan that fits on

I may be contacting you a bit later about the angle adapters

Cheers

Joe

Hopefully the Gates stuff should be good, get some decent hose clamps (Jubilee, Norma etc.) on too just in case.

For a fan I would get 2x10" curved blade fans from eBay. That's about as much as you can fit, 2x10" straight blade fans won't fit, they'll be too big I think . One 12" does the job but I'd be happier with more cooling when it's hot and you're stuck in traffic.

 

[.Joe]

It's just taken me half an hour and two fag breaks to get one piece on, still got 3 connections shall take I while me thinks

 

[-J-]

Joe, get your engine cleaned up!

 

[.Joe]

Joe, get your engine cleaned up!

i have a few days booked off for a major clean up, its starting to look like a shamble in there.