Another 182 cam belt/timing tools thread

[woofdog]

Hello all,

yes i know there are millions of threads on this and I should only use the right tools and should really get a specialist bla bla bla. Im starting the job next week, I've done a few belt changes and head rebuilds on simpler renault engines but not the F4R. So are these tools all i need? I rang renault and they don't actually supply them. So ive found these:
mot 1496 - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/160478930481?_trksid=p2060778.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT
mot 1509 - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/161032831674?_trksid=p2060778.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

 

[Chrisgti6]

Renault do well them

 

[StuOwen86]

Speak to Adam @Renault Wolverhampton he should be able to sort you out. They are in the traders section (you need to upgrade your account to view that part of the forum though I think)

 

[woofdog]

So I've started this now.. I'm swapping out a noisy dephaser pulley and be silly not to do the cam belt while doing it! So Ive done a fair bit of research on this now.. I was going to pay out and get this done by a specialist and to be honest by the time you've bought the tools and belt kits etc, you won't save that much in the end.. but.. I do like a challenge..!! Im doing the job in my shed and taking my time. My shed:

So far I've stripped everything down to the Cam belt and pulleys, from here:

to here:

Probably didn't need to take the bumper off but just seemed easier for access. Now I'm waiting for the timing tools which I've ordered from Adams place above. (Thanks Stu.) Don't think Im going to be able to get back on it now till next week but any pointers appreciated. I know the cam pulleys are floating, Ive done a head gasket on a zetec engine so assuming will be like that ish.. Ive got all my bits from GSF:

Wish me luck!!!!!!!

 

[Dan@SJM]

A lot easier if you remove the slam panel too.

 

[levaz]

^^ what Dan said.

Also, when I did mine, I couldn't find it mentioned anywhere, but the crank pulley is held on by bolt tension alone.
When you come to loosen it off, I wrapped it in old rag (to avoid damaging the teeth), and gently tapped it round with a hammer and flat edge plasterers chisel.

And yes, similar to doing a Zetec Setup.

Just take your time and triple check everything, once the pulleys are back on (loose) get the tensioner set, then spin the belt over 3-4 times backwards.
Tighten the pulleys up, and turn over by hand, then recheck the cam tool slots straight in.

Have fun!

 

[woofdog]

Great tips thanks, especially on the crank pulley cheers!! My tools have turned up and I can see why they are expensive.. they are proper!! So hopefully have a window tomorrow to get the belts and pulleys swapped at least..

When you say spin the belt over backwards you mean with the cams locked right?? Lol. Whats this for..?
Also i just remembered i think the depahaser pulley has a massive hex nut on it .. yep

don't think i have a tool to slacken that off.. do you know the size by any chance?
Cant really see from my rubbish pic but some kind person has nicely rounded the ex cam nut on every damn corner so that will be fun to slacken off!!!

 

[woofdog]

I think its 14mm

 

[quattro]

The hex nut shouldn't be too tight, its only a cover with a seal, there is a fastener underneath that holds the dephaser on.

 

[woofdog]

Had a quick look this afternoon, i've got cylinder 1 at tdc and the cams don't line up for the horse shoe cam locking tool... Im assuming the timing must be slightly out..?? (it did stall on me a few times on idle.. but no lack in bhp at all...

 

[levaz]

Get the crank locked up, then spin the camshafts to time.
The slot should be just below centre (they're not centred on the camshafts)

The reason for spinning the pulleys backwards with the belt on (but the pulleys slack and cams/crank locked) is to neutralise any tension in the belt and even it out.
I tried it skipping this step, and everytime i'd turned the engine over it was 1/2 a tooth out on timing

 

[woofdog]

Hi Levaz,
thanks for the heads up.. so obviously the crank pulley is floating too... Thats why the markings i was looking at (kind of like a keyway on the crank cog) did not relate to the to timing!! Confused me a bit but got it now.. Hopefully !!

 

[levaz]

Yea, hence post above about wrapping it in rag and tapping with a chisel to crack it off..
The markings are there as the same pulley is used on the megane, but that one uses a woodruff key

 

[levaz]

The keyway on the crank itself usually points to around the 1'o clock position.
Although on the flywheel/ bellhousing there is a small inspection window to confirm that its correct

 

[woofdog]

Was going to get this job finished today as i have a free day. So off i toddle to Renault to pic up new crank timing pulley as mine didn't look to clever by the time i tapped it off

So i wanted to play it safe and replace. The pulley they have given me has a keyway in it and is not the same part as the one thats come off the engine. The keyway in this one means that (if it fits) it will not be floating on the crank, it'll be keyed. Anyone know the right part number? Part number i got is 8200251569 which seems to be right but the timing pulley is defo not the same. Its a 2005 182 btw

 

[woofdog]

here is the one they provided: note the keyway in left pic!

 

[levaz]

I think that's the megane pulley.

iirc it's an updated design as its not unheard of for the old crank pulleys to slip in use and put the timing out, the key stops that.

Your old one looks well hammered!

 

[woofdog]

Yea it was pretty narly, so i just whacked it off with a large screwdriver as i knew i'd be replacing it anyway. Renault have just come back to me to say the official Renault documentation, references the wrong part number!!! So the right one for future ref is: 7700108817
Just means I have to wait till tomorrow to get the part which results in me not being able to finish the job now till end of next week

 

[jack_davey]

There's no need to hammer these off. All you will do is knacker the pulley. They have two threaded holes in them that allow you to put two bolts in and turn it to free it up from sticking to the crank with corrosion.
It needs to be freely moving in order to be able to accurately set the timing and tension.
The woodruff key on the new pulley may be removable. Give that a try.

Don't rotate the belt backwards, the tensioner should never be rolled anticlockwise. Also Ignore autodata's instructions as they're wrong. Use the Renault document, which is not the easiest to follow first time round, but atleast it shows the correct method.

I do these belts regularly and two things I always change are the camshaft oil seals (they come in a pack with new camshaft pulley nut/bolt) and the crank pulley bolt. You need plenty of brake cleaner too for degreasing the pulleys.

 

[levaz]

Don't rotate the belt backwards, the tensioner should never be rolled anticlockwise. Also Ignore autodata's instructions as they're wrong. Use the Renault document, which is not the easiest to follow first time round, but atleast it shows the correct method.

I've done it on every one I've changed without problem.
3 times backwards, 3 times forwards.

I think it may even have been Fred or Mick that suggested it in the first place.

 

[jack_davey]

Maybe so, but personally I think the manual wouldn't say it for no reason, and it's not worth the risk, probably less confusing to rotate it in one direction anyway

 

[midge]

Where can i get a copy of the renault document/guide to changing the belt? i had it on my old computer but can't find it on this one

 

[levaz]

Theres a guide on here somewhere

 

[joebloggz]

This may help

 

[woofdog]

Finally getting round to finishing this job either tomorrow or Friday got all the last bits and bobs I need.. Last thing I will do before building back up is replace the cam seals.. assuming they will pop out nicely with no more 'special' Renault tools..!! Hoping they will be easily persuaded!

 

[levaz]

easy to remove, make sure they are re-fitted flush to the head, push them in too far and they weep.
I used the back of the crank pulley to knock them in evenly and stop them going in too far lol

 

[woofdog]

Finally finished this job on Friday! Haven't test drove it yet as I need to put bumper back on and didnt have that much time Friday..... but it fired up and was idling nice and smooth on cold start. I reckon all in it took me about 10-12 hours lol but I was taking my time and cleaning up bits and bobs, tidying scruffy brackets and stuff. thanks for all pointers, quite a challenge if you don't do them all the time..!

 

[Clioste]

Hey hope your test drive goes well I prefer older cars like my old mk1 golf I could change cam belt on that in 1 hour lol and there wasn't no tool for it ☺ sorry to jump thread I just want to know if them docs up there are any good for a 172 cup

 

[levaz]

Yup, virtually identical, just the cup doesn't have an ac compressor to run