Best Car After A Clio

[Poopensharten]

Wouldnt be my selection to be honest

 

[cat171]

Iridium,
Close the 'better models' were the LE (limited edition) and the plus (which I had) Yep all have brembo four pots on them as standard, the LE & plus both have full leather recaro's too - some of the best seats my backside has ever graced tbh.

I'd have another one yep.


Danny - no i'm not, they known for being a bit cack (on par with some renault ones tbh)

 

[Poopensharten]

Tooshi old boy, Tooshi!

 

[Iridium]

I hate that my username on here is Iridium and not Dan heh. I knew it was something like that. Test drove a couple with my brother a few years back, he bought a 406 V6 Coupe in the end - which has been epically reliable. 4 years he must have had it now and not a single thing has gone wrong, in any single way - and it's so, so comfy. Still looks fresh as well IMHO.

Seriously fast cars those 20vTs though - reckon the Vee would pull away from one? I'm not so sure... They drive like they have 260bhp, because of the torque, gearing and lack of weight.

Dan

 

[Dave-Clio]

Dont bother with a fto, they are crap.

ill second that

 

[Dave-Clio]

5k will get you a nice Fiat coupe 20v turbo, easlily does 155mph & will hit 60 in 6 secs & to a ton in 14 secs (as standard) tuning them to start off with is quite cheap (a chip can be had for £30) you'll need a few bits to go with it though.

If I wanted something quick for 5k i'd do that (i've have one by the way)

I know this is rich coming from a Renault owner. But fiats have terrible reliability issues, probably 10 times worse than Renault.

Fast cars but id avoid it like the plague!

i looked at a 20v turbo, uncle had one and it was truly an awesome car - in his hands anyway - he is a good driver!!!

i heard a cam belt change was £2k tho so i changed my mind.

 

[cat171]

Seriously fast cars those 20vTs though - reckon the Vee would pull away from one? I'm not so sure... They drive like they have 260bhp, because of the torque, gearing and lack of weight.

Dan

A dude I know had both, he said that standard v standard it's close up to 120 (dicey is how he expalined it) I had mine round to 150 on a private road three up & I backed off, it would have gone quicker tbh The vee has been to 140 on the same runway & it felt less stable (both were speedo readings, so i'm not sure exacly ohw fast in actual mph)

The LE & plus both have six gears so you can't get that much really from each gear :dapprove:


- cambelt price is BS tbh, £400 from a reputable specailist, they are not as expensive to run as they are made out to be.

 

[RichRSi]

^ you havent mentioned how the 20vt sounds like a nice group B audi rally car. If anything they are worth there weight in gold just for the noise they make.

About the 406 coupe, that was designed by pininfarina, hence why it still looks great. It'd have to be the v6 though. There was a LPG converted one for sale down the road a couple of months back virtually being given away, I was sorely tempted, but it had done about 150k.

 

[woody_159_2000]

i though decent pulsar gtiR's were as rare as rocking horse s**t?

any stats on these though please, have always liked them but over looked them tbh, dont know why...

 

[gazcaddy]

VX220 but you are looking at 13k for a Turbo (N/A wont be a big step up in peformance)

 

[mach10]

ive had the mr2 non turbo too, and a phquick. now i own a ek4 civic 1.6 vti. better than both cars and only 4k. think about it :boring:

 

[woody_159_2000]

really, better than both? whats the performance stats like on the civic?

 

[mach10]

well the phquick when you gave it full throttle the car would feel as if its falling apart lol. the mr2 handling wasnt the best yet I wouldnt throw a car around corners anyway. Speed wise there probably aint much in it between them all, but for the price for the civic is good/ If you
can find a unmolested example it would be great. I love the civic cause it revs to 8200 and the vtec is just so fun. Its true though, once i went jap im not going back. car handles very well and when driving hard it feels safe.

as for 0 - 60 for the civic im not sure. Ive got the import version from japan so its got 10 more bhp than the uk version i think. Ive just added simple breather mods and its alot better. 5vigen cat back exhaust, apexi induction kit and strut brace front and back.

PS PETROL IS A B1TCH on this

 

[Poopensharten]

i though decent pulsar gtiR's were as rare as rocking horse s**t?

any stats on these though please, have always liked them but over looked them tbh, dont know why...

No they are out there if you know where to look

Standard they make 227bhp and are 4x4 drive. As legend has it they do 0-60 in 6.1 secs

Ins Grp 20 so thats a b**ch, apparently there quite fragile but there true 911 eaters

 

[Poopensharten]

well the phquick when you gave it full throttle the car would feel as if its falling apart lol. the mr2 handling wasnt the best yet I wouldnt throw a car around corners anyway. Speed wise there probably aint much in it between them all, but for the price for the civic is good/ If you
can find a unmolested example it would be great. I love the civic cause it revs to 8200 and the vtec is just so fun. Its true though, once i went jap im not going back. car handles very well and when driving hard it feels safe.

as for 0 - 60 for the civic im not sure. Ive got the import version from japan so its got 10 more bhp than the uk version i think. Ive just added simple breather mods and its alot better. 5vigen cat back exhaust, apexi induction kit and strut brace front and back.


PS PETROL IS A B1TCH on this

Id like to see how your car stands up against an EK9? Are you part of the ek9 owners forum>? www.ek9.org

Alot of good lads on there,really know there stuff!

 

[cg172]

Seriously mate, if you're considering Jap, it's gotta be a GT-Four. My mate has one, and they're seriously rapid. He plays with Evos and all sorts. £5k will get you a nice import with a boost controller, exhaust and filter on already, and probably alloys. Tends to be how most people mod them anyway. Much more solid than a Pulsar. 300bhp quite easily and there are some cars running 400bhp on standard internals, but the fuelling has to be spot on. 500 is possible on forged internals. Nice solid 4x4 handling, and a whiteline anti-roll bar make them beyond awesome.

Wanna know the best bit?

Group 17 insurance. 220 bhp as standard.

 

[woody_159_2000]

my mate had a gt-four...it was rapid but kept over heating...the top mounted radiator has burnt many of his sweatshirts... the turbo kept popping off samco hoses aswell (i am no mechanic, so dont know why they kept coming off)

other than that i have no experience of them, so any more info would be much appreciated

 

[woody_159_2000]

like, what year/shape is best to aim for etc...

thanks

 

[cg172]

We did a DIY lagging job on the top-mount intercooler, and it's never overheated since (not that it did before either...), sounds more like a head-gasket problem on your mates to me. A lot of silicon hoses have habits of popping off under boost. They tend to be a bit smooth and slippy! Just have to get the jubilee clips done up as much as possible. I guess keying into the surface that it's located against to create a bit of roughness would probably help as well.

My mate's is getting treated to the front-mount intercooler off an Evo 6, supposed to get better charge temps.

What else do you want to know? I'm fairly knowlegeable on them. It was a toss up between a 'four or a 172, but I couldn't justify the extra fuel cost, and I don't have the bottle to use one to it's full potential. Awesome cars.

 

[woody_159_2000]

i prefer the look of the older gt-four's, 1989-1990 shape, especially the carlos sainz model, but are they getting on a bit?

i think the newer, rounder ones (not the newest model) look a bit, dare i say it, like a hairdressers car (no offense intended to any owners)

how are the older ones, reliability wise? obviously checking the cambelts done, but anything else to look for?

 

[cg172]

The ST185 (carlos sainz shape) are really getting on a bit. Known in GT-Four circles as the "one crate five" because they're so heavy. There are some good ones about though, making decent power as well. ST205 are the ones to go for in my opinon. Lighter and more powerful as standard, and a slightly better base to tune. Gen7 (latest one) is a bit cr*p. More of a "look at me" car.

Go for an imported ST205 for £5k. They have a really good owners club as well, so there's lots of support.

 

[cg172]

Look out for figure 8's and cambelts, and smokey turbos.

 

[sideways danny]

It's scaremongering tbh, a bit like if I buy a rover the head gasket is 100% going to fail on it (you read that on here all the time, yet in reality nhow many have ever experienced it ??) probably a load of old rubbish tbh.

I was with you right upto this point. The engineers we use were at one point refurbishing 7 K-series cylinder heads every single week. They love them, they make a fortune out of them. The k-series DOES have inherant design faults that make the HG fail. Sadly the problem has been resolved by ford of all people.


The Fiat Coupe is a superb car, my brother has had 3, my stepdad 2. There's also a hell of a lot of enthusiast knowledge about them which makes owning one viable

 

[woody_159_2000]

so i guess its a toss up between the st205 gt-four and the fiat coupe 20v turbo...

 

[cg172]

Yey! Test drive time! My favourite part of buying cars... After trying to make the salesman cry.

 

[woody_159_2000]

so i guess its a toss up between the st205 gt-four and the fiat coupe 20v turbo...although i cant lose the interest in the mr2 turbo (fto is out the window now)

 

[cg172]

GT-Four and MR2 Turbo = same engine. Just different ways of using it

 

[woody_159_2000]

surely the mr2 turbo is lighter? how do you rate its performance againt the 4wd of the st205?

 

[The Seer]

surely the mr2 turbo is lighter? how do you rate its performance againt the 4wd of the st205?

I think they're around 1150 kgs which sounds promising.

What's not so promising is the annoying thrust of torque mid corner loosening of the rear end which undoubtedly will send you in the opposite direction at some point of owning the turbo version.

 

[cg172]

Scarier... In a "is that a bend ahead? SH*T!" sort of way. Never been in an MR2, but I know a lad who had one before he got a 'four. He kept buying increasingly wider alloys for the rear in an attempt to get around roundabouts without looking like he was trying to do an impression of "The fast and the furious"... My money would be on the four, but I do love the coupe turbo's as well. But again, never been in one.

MR2 is apparently capable of supercar worrying performance, but is supposed to be a bit skittish.
Mates 'four keeps up with pretty much anything, and has more to come, and it's really sure footed.

Only you know how you drive, and which appeals.

guess the Coupe turbo is different agin, considering its fwd.

 

[Iridium]

I like the ST205 GT4s - with the 4 headlights. They have awesome grip in any conditions - although they're not as fast as you'd hope in a straight line when standard considering they are the awesome side of 240bhp - because they're heavy and it's quite a 'lossy' AWD system. The good news is, the engines are tough as old boots and 300bhp is cheap and easy.

Dan

 

[woody_159_2000]

i have a bit of experience of the mr2 cornering...i owned a non turbo before the clio 172...

i was going round a roundabout at 10 mph, foot down a touch heavy and early and spun the car, oops... luckily other peoples awareness saved alot of embarressment. i will stick to my story and say there was petrol on the tyres as i had just filled up and there must have been some on the floor!

 

[cg172]

I like the ST205 GT4s - with the 4 headlights. They have awesome grip in any conditions - although they're not as fast as you'd hope in a straight line when standard considering they are the awesome side of 240bhp - because they're heavy and it's quite a 'lossy' AWD system. The good news is, the engines are tough as old boots and 300bhp is cheap and easy.

Dan

They have awesome grip except when you go light over blind crest at 70 mph, and dont realise the road goes to the right, and then you realise you aren't Carlos Sainz, but you are Car Loss Sainz, and you oversteer up a bank, hit a tree, bounce back onto the road and down an 8ft ditch coming to a rather sudden stop as you hit a dry stone wall.

Or somthing like that...

Worst crash yet, that.

 

[The Seer]

As far a 4WD for 5K the Lancer is king. It's much lighter than an ST 205 and has better gearing, drive train and deploys traction better. Shame it doesn't look as nice.:dapprove:

M R 2 Turbo's are ok in straight line, I'm sure some will defend em' here but after owning an N/A 2.0ltr 16v some time back, I can honestly say they don't do as well in the bends as a well sorted hatch.

If it is to be a Celica or Coupe say goodbye to the M R 2 in the bends, FACT.

 

[The Seer]

i have a bit of experience of the mr2 cornering...i owned a non turbo before the clio 172...

i was going round a roundabout at 10 mph, foot down a touch heavy and early and spun the car, oops... luckily other peoples awareness saved alot of embarressment. i will stick to my story and say there was petrol on the tyres as i had just filled up and there must have been some on the floor!

My Gaurdian Angel's worked overtime when I had the M R 2. I span four or five times in it's 2.5 years with me. Never colided with anything.

Chassis just isn't up to the job of being driven spiritedly, matched springs and adjustable dampers, plus S0 2's made a difference, then again I only had 158 bhp.

Turbo...no thanks!

 

[woody_159_2000]

i wouldnt say i was driving spiritedly either...thats why the spin was a suprise.

i just think the mr2 looks are awesome, thats why its on my 'maybe' list with the gt-4 and the coupe.

 

[cg172]

I'd leave it off the list. You've had one...

 

[The Seer]

They certainly do look good, but they certainly don't drive as good as they look. If you don't mind driving easy all the time, an N/A 2.0 ltr 16V would make more sense.

If it's just straight line acceleration your after the Turbo will provide. Then again a Cerbera 4.5 will do this much better.

 

[woody_159_2000]

would love the tvr but unfortunately its about £3000 over budget

 

[Iridium]

Been a bit kind to standard MR2s there re: cornering IMHO heh. I reckon, in the wet, with bald tyres, driving drunk in a Mk1 Vee - you'd be less likely to bin it than you would sober in a tidy MR2 hehehe

Dan