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EH?. . . WHAT?... Sound deadening.



Porl

ClioSport Club Member
I just completely sound deadened my car, upgraded the audio 1000% and fixed all the rattles - well recommended:


Similar price and the installation was must easier.
I've got those. I wear them around the house so I can't hear the wife. Don't even need to play music, just use them to filter her out😂.
 

frayz

ClioSport Club Member
Finished off the back of the car with panel deadening and made a start on the super liner. Quite therapeutic once you get into it but it’s not easy to work with as the adhesive is so sticky, you can’t dare catch it on anything else it tears.


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You realise this liner stuff weighs less than a fart.
Anyway, how’a your undercrackers cleaner, have your used it yet you big Jesse? 😅
Have I balls weather has been w**k amd then as soon as I go back to work it just goes nice again

I did get you a video of it in action in the hallway 😂😂 Shes a fuckin wee belter

 

Steve1986

ClioSport Club Member
  Clio 182
I never knew sound deadening was so light nowadays, I'd always considered it not worth the extra weight but this thread has made me change my mind.

Having said that, I'm no audio engineer, but surely putting the acoustic foam behind a surface that reflects sound will basically render it useless?
 

frayz

ClioSport Club Member
I never knew sound deadening was so light nowadays, I'd always considered it not worth the extra weight but this thread has made me change my mind.

Having said that, I'm no audio engineer, but surely putting the acoustic foam behind a surface that reflects sound will basically render it useless?
Steve.

I’m also no audio engineer but speaking to a lot of my NVH teams at work and reading as much as I can. The way I understand it, sound is created by vibrations in the air. The panels in the car vibrate and reflect sound into and around the car. The deadening adds mass to the panels to significantly reduce those vibrations. Then the foam absorbs and diffuses the sound waves by decoupling those waves from the panels, the acoustic foam has a larger surface area again to break up those sound waves.

A large hard flat surface provides the best possible surface to reflect sound. Which is why we get such an echo and empty sound in a tiled bathroom or an empty room for example.
I’m just trying to fill as many voids as possible with the lightest weight possible that will diffuse as much sound as possible.
Annoyingly in some ways that the car is a daily driver and I’ve driven it at every small stage along this project. So every time I have noticed a significant improvement in the cabin. Doing it all in one go would provide the biggest change noticeable, but that’s not practical in this instance. It would certainly net the most impressive results though.
Even the sound of the boot lock has a deeper tone to it now. You can hear that the whole acoustics in the cabin have changed and listening to a podcast for example is much much clearer, and I haven’t even touched the doors yet.

I’ll weigh a roll of foam and weigh the bass stopping tiles and provide an accurate list of what’s gone back in the car. I’m predicting less than 13kg from start to finish which is basically a few bags of shopping. I’ve ordered some extra 2mm to go in the front floorpan which is another 3kg and all in the whole project has cost me £145.
Possibly one of the best £145 I’ve ever spent on it
 

Louis

ClioSport Club Member
Steve.

I’m also no audio engineer but speaking to a lot of my NVH teams at work and reading as much as I can. The way I understand it, sound is created by vibrations in the air. The panels in the car vibrate and reflect sound into and around the car. The deadening adds mass to the panels to significantly reduce those vibrations. Then the foam absorbs and diffuses the sound waves by decoupling those waves from the panels, the acoustic foam has a larger surface area again to break up those sound waves.

A large hard flat surface provides the best possible surface to reflect sound. Which is why we get such an echo and empty sound in a tiled bathroom or an empty room for example.
I’m just trying to fill as many voids as possible with the lightest weight possible that will diffuse as much sound as possible.
Annoyingly in some ways that the car is a daily driver and I’ve driven it at every small stage along this project. So every time I have noticed a significant improvement in the cabin. Doing it all in one go would provide the biggest change noticeable, but that’s not practical in this instance. It would certainly net the most impressive results though.
Even the sound of the boot lock has a deeper tone to it now. You can hear that the whole acoustics in the cabin have changed and listening to a podcast for example is much much clearer, and I haven’t even touched the doors yet.

I’ll weigh a roll of foam and weigh the bass stopping tiles and provide an accurate list of what’s gone back in the car. I’m predicting less than 13kg from start to finish which is basically a few bags of shopping. I’ve ordered some extra 2mm to go in the front floorpan which is another 3kg and all in the whole project has cost me £145.
Possibly one of the best £145 I’ve ever spent on it
Tl;dr sticky foam = less noise
 

Steve1986

ClioSport Club Member
  Clio 182
Oh I see what you mean, the sound bouncing around between the panels would be transmitted into the cabin by the innermost one. I clearly need more coffee this morning 😂
Excellent work though, I wish I'd done this to my old MX5 instead of wearing headphones on long journeys 🧐
 

frayz

ClioSport Club Member
Oh I see what you mean, the sound bouncing around between the panels would be transmitted into the cabin by the innermost one. I clearly need more coffee this morning 😂
Excellent work though, I wish I'd done this to my old MX5 instead of wearing headphones on long journeys 🧐
This is why many people get mixed results with sound deadening mass sheets. By fitting the mass loaded sheet, they have stopped a lot of the vibrations and rattles. But without something to stop diffuse the sound still coming through from outside, the road noise will still be quite apparent. Which is why a layering system is used. 🙂
 

alistairolsen

ClioSport Club Member
The next step is a mass based damper on top of the foam to absorb the sound energy. On top of the foam so that it is decoupled from the movement of the panel.

Mass loaded vinyl seems the common choice. In my research so far, I don't intend using it everywhere, but places like the boot floor, or front footwells/bulkhead I'm going to.
 

frayz

ClioSport Club Member
The next step is a mass based damper on top of the foam to absorb the sound energy. On top of the foam so that it is decoupled from the movement of the panel.

Mass loaded vinyl seems the common choice. In my research so far, I don't intend using it everywhere, but places like the boot floor, or front footwells/bulkhead I'm going to.
I’ll be using the OEM boot mat on top of the foam in the boot area. The MLV would arguably be better but I want to try this first. 🙂
 
  Clio Sport
Got another hour on it tonight so did a bit more. I need to remove the rear bumper to modify the cabin vents. So that will happen another day. Carried on with the boot floor and also started playing with placement of the 35mm acoustic trap foam tiles. Managed to acquire a few of these and I think they will also help the sound from the rear speakers. They’re not fixed yet as I may not fit the tile below the rubbing strip as I do not want the chance of it holding moisture. So that lower tile I may fix to the back of the doorcard directly.

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I’ll be using the OEM boot mat on top of the foam in the boot area. The MLV would arguably be better but I want to try this first. 🙂
I have done the same as you last year and I've been getting a lot of condensation inside the car when it's really cold..make sure you have left a gap between the inner arches and the panel for the condensation to rundown the drain holes.I placed the silver mats and foam just below the windows it's been getting wet there too,the condensation has nowhere to run.
 

MLB

ClioSport Club Member
I have done the same as you last year and I've been getting a lot of condensation inside the car when it's really cold..make sure you have left a gap between the inner arches and the panel for the condensation to rundown the drain holes.I placed the silver mats and foam just below the windows it's been getting wet there too,the condensation has nowhere to run.

Do you have your airconditioning on all the time?

I would think with airconditioning on and doing 300 miles a week condensation shouldn't be a problem.
 

frayz

ClioSport Club Member
I have done the same as you last year and I've been getting a lot of condensation inside the car when it's really cold..make sure you have left a gap between the inner arches and the panel for the condensation to rundown the drain holes.I placed the silver mats and foam just below the windows it's been getting wet there too,the condensation has nowhere to run.
You'll be complaing you can't hear the exhaust when all this is finished @frayz 😂.
Don’t think that will be an issue with a decat PMS 🤣
 

frayz

ClioSport Club Member
I have done the same as you last year and I've been getting a lot of condensation inside the car when it's really cold..make sure you have left a gap between the inner arches and the panel for the condensation to rundown the drain holes.I placed the silver mats and foam just below the windows it's been getting wet there too,the condensation has nowhere to run.
All drains are clear as is their routing. Not sure how condensation can form on there unless you introduce moisture?
This is the exact same process and materials used to turn vans into sleepers.
 

frayz

ClioSport Club Member
Finished up the rear foam today. Took it as far forward as the rear bench. Fixed in the foam bass traps with some spray adhesive. I’ve kept these over the wheel arches and above the rubbing strips. Added further deadening to the rear doorcards and took the opportunity to swap the OEM rear speakers for some Focal RCX130.
I weighed a full roll of Super liner which is 6m and is just over 1kg the bass trap tiles are 70 grams each.
So nice fitting the interior trim over the foam as everything fits so snug and tight.
This concludes the rear of the car for now, next up will be the front cabin and obviously the doors.

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  Clio Sport
All drains are clear as is their routing. Not sure how condensation can form on there unless you introduce moisture?
This is the exact same process and materials used to turn vans into sleepers.
Maybe I have a leak I'll have to check the rear boot seals again.
 

frayz

ClioSport Club Member
Maybe I have a leak I'll have to check the rear boot seals again.
I think that’s probably a good shout. I’ve seen massive condensation inside stripped out cars that have been left outside in the rain etc. But having the car better insulated should reduce the level of temperature change inside the car so should actually reduce the chances of condensation. That’s the theory anyway. 😅
 

frayz

ClioSport Club Member
So far I've done the rear of the car, tailgate, floor and arches inner and outer tubs and rear qtr panels.

2x sheets Stinger roadblock 0.6kg
22x sheets DodoMat Hex = 6kg
1x 6m roll DodoMat Superliner 1kg
10x 300x300 bass trap tiles 0.7kg

Total weigh added 8.3kg

Now i know this test is totally flawed and to be honest im not really interested in the numbers, more how the car sounds and feels to be in. More a case of trying to see if i could get a measurable difference.
I used a basic iphone app, sat in a magnetic phone mount on my screen, same stretch of road (A127), cruise set at 50mph in 5th gear.
Ignore the centre figure (amazed i screen shotted them so close to be honest) as this is live and jumps all over the place when driving, but teh average drop according to my super basic test is 5.3dB!
But i dont need the figures to tell me what a huge difference it has made, its some way still from a brand new car, but considering it has a full decat PMS system, im happy with that for now.

Next up i'll do the front cabin and doors :)
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DomP182

ClioSport Club Member
  ph1 172, Arctic182
Just a thought, could foam in the rear quarters hold moisture and condensation?
 

frayz

ClioSport Club Member
Just a thought, could foam in the rear quarters hold moisture and condensation?
It shouldn’t do as it’s designed for it. Having said that, I purposely kept it above the rubbing strip of the body so no water will be getting on it. I don’t see how it can condensate in there either.
But i will check periodically to be sure.
 

npt

ClioSport Club Member
  BMW 320d- 172 cup
It shouldn’t do as it’s designed for it. Having said that, I purposely kept it above the rubbing strip of the body so no water will be getting on it. I don’t see how it can condensate in there either.
But i will check periodically to be sure.

It should be dry in there, never seen mine wet anyway
 


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