F4R timing belt tools Renault v 3rd party

[Neal 19 16v]

OK, something I've been wondering for a while...
It's been said so many times that you must use the genuine Renault timing tools, everything else is crap. Genuine Renault or don't bother etc.
Can someone please explain exactly why this is the case though?

 

[Jamie86]

Cheap ones can bend so timing is then out simple as that really.

 

[Neal 19 16v]

which bit bends?

 

[choong-moo]

Why bother risking it buddy. It's a well trodden path.

 

[Neal 19 16v]

I'm not risking anything, my belt doesn't even need to be done. Just interested/want to understand why there is a 'risk'

 

[Jamie86]

Any/all of them, the horseshoes feel flimsy compared to a genuine one..

 

[choong-moo]

You probably can't say they're all flimsy as there will be some decent pattern versions out there. It's just that the genuine ones are known to be up to the job for sure

 

[Neal 19 16v]

OK, so it's the horseshoe bit that apparently bends?
The thickness of the tool is determined by the slot in the end of the cam, so what super modulus steel are renault using for theirs which can resist bending where 3rd party ones cant?
Anyway surely that tool is not actually meant to take any bending load? That's what the pulley locking tool is for?

 

[Paprika123]

The cams have a fair bit of tension on them.

 

[Neal 19 16v]

From what?

The tool is essentially a flat plate of a given thickness defined by the cam slots. As far as I can make out the genuine tool is the same outline shape as the 3rd party tools, which means the only possible variable which could lead to a 3rd party one bending where the genuine one holds firm is the material properties.

The tool is 5mm thick, right? So even if you made a tool of the lowest modulus bit of mild steel you could find I'm not sure how, with the pulleys locked, you could apply enough torque to the cams to bend anything?

Not being funny here, just trying to understand.

 

[Tony Hunter]

There has been pictures posted on here of bent tools.

 

[Neal 19 16v]

Aye fair enough, and I can see how that would happen if you try and do up (or even loosen) the pulley bolts without using the pulley locking tool.

I just don't understand how it happens when it's done correctly.

 

[hansthebear]

A cheap horseshoe tool wont bend if the renault pulley locking tool is used, it will bend if the pulley tool is not used, but thats the wrong way anyway.

Imo + thats what happened to me

 

[Neal 19 16v]

Right, this is what I'm wondering.
Are the 3rd party tools really inferior or is it just that the people who have bent them just didn't know what they were doing and would have bent a genuine one if they'd done it the same way?

 

[hansthebear]

The metal is definately not as tough as the genuine tool, i think the camshafts woukd suffer more than the renault tool

 

[Dan@SJM]

Even with the pulleys locked there is still a fair amount of torsional force through the cam. The pattern ones are usually made of ally, where as the genuine tools are made of high tensile steel.

 

[bloke]

Even with the pulleys locked there is still a fair amount of torsional force through the cam. The pattern ones are usually made of ally, where as the genuine tools are made of high tensile steel.

if you pick at a corner on one of the laser horseshoes you can peel the outer layer back and get to the chocolate inside:hearteyes: