FAO Anyone with a Safety Devices bolt in cage (issue with door bars)

[alexapps]

Hey All,

I came around to doing the final (hopefully) fit of the roll cage this evening (Safety Devices 6 point bolt in front/rear).

Im having some real issue with fitting the door bars around the seat however.

I have CDS seat rails welded into the car, and I'm mounting my seat (Sabelt Titan XL, (Big bones... )) with side mounts directly to these.

I have the seat mounted pretty much dead on center but there seems to be no possible way of fitting the door bars with this seat.

The door bars basically need to sit so far inside the car which makes them hit the hip? part of the seat.

Its looking more and more likely that I will need to get some custom doorbars made up for both as I'm going to be running a Taurus xl (same seat but with head restraints) also on track days (will be removed for racing).

I have tried to take some pictures to try and illustrate my issues, but has anyone come across this before?

If I'm totally honest, I have been slightly disappointed with the fit of this cage since the first mockup and it just seems very strange that the cage sits so far in side the shell.

-Alex

image by alexanderrobertjames, on Flickr

image by alexanderrobertjames, on Flickr

image by alexanderrobertjames, on Flickr

 

[M.C..]

Mine are a tight fit with the Bimarco Futura.
I think the main reason for this is the cage was designed for standard door cards to be used.
When I first fitted mine I had standard door cards and they were just touching the door bar, but now I have carbon door cards there is a massive gap.
My seats are on OMP subframes but I cant get them any closer as the sholder supports will touch

 

[M.C..]

not got any good pics but you sort of get the idea with these

 

[Fletcher]

I have a 6 point SD cage. I run Recaro SPG, or Corbeau Revos, I just fitted the OEM door cards for the ring trip and have plenty of room between the door bar and seat/ door cards.

 

[alexapps]

Thanks for the replies guys.

it may just be this seat then, really annoying aswell as it's by far the best fitting seat I've sat in.
Fletcher do you have any pictures at all I could take a peek at?

Cheers
-Alex

 

[Fletcher]

Thanks for the replies guys.

it may just be this seat then, really annoying aswell as it's by far the best fitting seat I've sat in.
@Fletcher do you have any pictures at all I could take a peek at?

Cheers
-Alex

I'll get some pics for you tomorrow mate.

 

[alexapps]

I'll get some pics for you tomorrow mate.

Great, that would be awesome

just remembered that I have a sparco evo copy bucket in the garage somewhere.

might dig that out shortly just to confirm it's my large (big boned ) seats that's causing the issues.

-Alex

 

[alexapps]

yea so the evo copy fits.

anyone care to agree with me that I'm barking mad to consider taking a dremmel to my seat to trim of the plastic that is catching on the door bar?

Im going to say it's not blue book compliant anyhow...

-Alex

 

[car.crash]

Do these come with the door bar brackets welded from factory?
i thought it was down to the user to weld them where they wanted to avoid this.

 

[alexapps]

All pre welded, all I needed to get welded were the footplates for the cage to stand on.

-Alex

 

[car.crash]

Ah ok, maybe it was the omp ones that need welding on.
you could buy those brackets that attach to the cage and weld a pair so the bar clears. Its a bit of mucking about but a fairly simple job and shouldn't cost to much.

ebay number 281215321210

 

[alexapps]

Ah ok, maybe it was the omp ones that need welding on.
you could buy those brackets that attach to the cage and weld a pair so the bar clears. Its a bit of mucking about but a fairly simple job and shouldn't cost to much.

ebay number 281215321210

certainly something to think about thanks , but given how the front leg is bent I'm not sure I could weld that saddle pickups above the original and still use the supplied doorbar.

the other option I can see, is to try and space out the doorbar by half an inch or so so that it clears the seat.

-Alex

 

[Cub.]

It's the seat.

Although a different cage, I can't fit my door bars with Sparco Evo 3's due to the seat width. In the long run I was going to get the bars adjusted to dip under the seat lip, if that makes sense.

 

[alexapps]

It's the seat.

Although a different cage, I can't fit my door bars with Sparco Evo 3's due to the seat width. In the long run I was going to get the bars adjusted to dip under the seat lip, if that makes sense.

Thanks for confirming Cub, seems like a fairly common issue with wide seats then.

Yea makes sense, and its one of the options that I am going to need to consider.

-Alex

 

[Fletcher]

Untitled by fletcher10, on Flickr

As you can see I have lots of space between the door bars/ seat.

 

[alexapps]

Untitled by fletcher10, on Flickr

As you can see I have lots of space between the door bars/ seat.

Thanks for the picture, I got the cage fully bolted down today to see exactly what I'm playing with.

Looks like its only possibly 10mm I need removing from the seat to clear the bar. I don't really want to start butchering the seat though unless thats the only option....

I guess another option I have is to try and space out the door bars slightly, what are peoples views on creating some 1" spacers from some 10mm internal diameter CDS tubing (not sure if I need to go for a bigger id, need to measure) and effectively spacing the door bar out by an inch.

So essentially, in this picture:

image by alexanderrobertjames, on Flickr


You would have (rear upright clamp - 1" CDS spacer - door bar clamp) all bolted together with suitably longer bolts.

From my (limited) engineering mind I will be introducing a weak spot into the door bars using this method and I'm 99% sure the car wouldn't be up to blue book standards but I'm trying to think of a solution that doesn't require me to start cutting and chopping things on my nice shiny new cage.

-Alex

 

[Adam G]

I presume you are as far left as the seat rails will allow Alex, as they look the same as mine and there is a bit of adjustment on how the seat mount bolts in.

 

[Midnight]

Not heard anything back from Mark Fish regarding my cage yet however this has made me a little nervous. With the corbeau seat there isn't much room as it is.

 

[alexapps]

I presume you are as far left as the seat rails will allow Alex, as they look the same as mine and there is a bit of adjustment on how the seat mount bolts in.

Yea as far left as I can go Adam, the side mounts are actually touching the tunnel at the front and the seat still won't go in.

Not heard anything back from Mark Fish regarding my cage yet however this has made me a little nervous. With the corbeau seat there isn't much room as it is.

I can't comment on the Corbeau seats as I'm not sure how wide they are, I'm sure Mark Fish would have a better idea though .

On a side note I have contacted Safety Devices direct about this, they suggested trying a different seat (which I have) so I'm just waiting on another response.

I think the only 'proper' way to get around this issue is with some door bars that bulge out and around the seat and into the area where the standard door card would be.

Shame really, as I was hoping a bolt in cage like this would be exactly that (being tall and fat sucks lol).

-Alex

 

[mark123]

Looking at that pic it looks like you could redrill the floor and pull the cage 15-20mm towards the B pillar. Possibly the same at the front?

 

[alexapps]

Looking at that pic it looks like you could redrill the floor and pull the cage 15-20mm towards the B pillar. Possibly the same at the front?

I can see what you are thinking, but given how the cage is constructed I don't think the cage will pull that much (if any), plus if I did this on the front the front roof cross member would then be to short.

 

[mark123]

Mine was pretty flexible before I welded the cross in the centre hoop. It would easily have moved 20mm either way on each leg. I'm not familar with the SD one though.

I have the later OMP version, which looks like it is closer to the B pillar to start with, you can't keep the door card but you can have a wider seat.

 

[alexapps]

Mine was pretty flexible before I welded the cross in the centre hoop. It would easily have moved 20mm either way on each leg. I'm not familar with the SD one though.

I have the later OMP version, which looks like it is closer to the B pillar to start with, you can't keep the door card but you can have a wider seat.

It can move slightly, but only really enough to line up the holes on the floor plates.

 

[alexapps]

So slight update on this for those who are interested.

I have been in contact with Safety Devices regarding this, and this is the first time they have been made aware of this issue.

As the cage was designed for use with door cards and original equipment seats they only option they offer is a bespoke redevelopment of the door bars.

Which in theory sounds great, however they would need the car for a week and the cost would be approximately £650 + vat..

Time to explore other options I think.

-Alex

 

[markfishy]

Hello ClioSport members.
I have been reading your comments with interest and would like to offer my advice on the door bar and seat fitting issues.
It is correct that the roll cage was originally designed to miss the door card and dashboard, but this does not normally cause any seat issues etc.
Having fitted many of these cages you need to be aware of the following.
1) When fitting make sure the roll cage floor bracket towers are fully up against the floor AND the sill panels (ie fully spread), before welding!!
2) If you are using the wider "GT" race seats, especially with two seats in the car. Put both seats in and they may just touch on the head restraint/wings at the centre line.
Depending on the subframe you may need a side mount, for the centre, that comes straight down from the seat and turns 90 degrees under the seat. This allows the seat to be positioned nearer the centre line and still be bolted to the subframe.
3) Or turn the side mount around so the bolt holes face outwards and then bolt through the subframe and transmission tunnel top face.
I hope this helps.
Best regards
Mark Fish