FAO Those With Existing Safety Devices Roll Cage, Msa Eligibilty

[Ads29]

In light of all the recent discussions regarding safety devices cages in competition cars I thought I'd speak to SD themselves, below is the response I received, thought it may be of benefit to others who are in the same position as I am now

 

[AdamCup]

Did they give any kind of ETA on the release of the newly re-designed cages ?

 

[Ads29]

Reading somebody else's thread it would appear the 20th March has been quoted, but to be honest my cage was delayed by about a month (got mine in a group buy though)

I'm going for a full weld in one next though, having found out there's a motorsport company in the same town that I live in

 

[Steven_K]

Really ... I need to read the guidance in the Blue Book but sure that means some 50%+ of Clio race cars face modifications for 2017. Classic MSA


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[Steven_K]

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[Ads29]

1.3.1 Must follow the windscreen pillars, says it all really

 

[Steven_K]

Rules don't look changed for what I remember... and I'd suggest that the Daniel is right in that the MSA don't suggest how close to the A Pillar the leg is required to be. It's a bit ambiguous to me


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[Ads29]

Normally anything that's changed is shown in red from memory?

I've got a copy of 2016 book around somewhere so I'll check that shortly

 

[scotiamr2t]

The wording regarding the following of the A pillar hasn't changed. Its simply been brought to light as a view scruts have raised a concern/issue with the design implemented in the current safety devices (and others) cage design

 

[Ads29]

I guess whichever way you look at it I'm gonna have to change my cage, and I expect I'm not the only one either

 

[BlackGoldMatt]

I'll await the for sale section for 6-point bolt in cages that isn't MSA compliant!

 

[massiveCoRbyn]

I contacted the MSA about this because I was a bit worried about the cage in my Escort, but thankfully mine is homologated so not effected. It surprised me that the Clio cage had not been homologated. I guess the new one will be though, as otherwise this could easily happen again.

 

[Hyperhatch]

Is it only the Safety Devices cage this affects or are there implications for other brands?

 

[Ads29]

Is it only the Safety Devices cage this affects or are there implications for other brands?

I'm not sure to be honest, these were questioned due to the front section not following the line of the A pillar

 

[Digger90]

It presumably applies to any and all dash-dodger cages, not just Safety Devices.

 

[massiveCoRbyn]

Yeah you'd have to assume that any dash dodger could be effected, unless it has FIA/MSA homologation. The cage in my Escort is ok because it is homologated.

 

[Ads29]

Yeah you'd have to assume that any dash dodger could be effected, unless it has FIA/MSA homologation.

This is where I get confused, as I believe mine is homologated, it's got its Fia sticker on B pillar with serial number. I'm not disputing the argument over front section at all, just a little confused

 

[Sam Linssner]

Is it only the Safety Devices cage this affects or are there implications for other brands?

think its any cage that doesn't follow the specifications, its just been bought up with Safety Devices because theirs stops short of the dash and that's against 1.3.1 written above

 

[massiveCoRbyn]

This is where I get confused, as I believe mine is homologated, it's got its Fia sticker on B pillar with serial number. I'm not disputing the argument over front section at all, just a little confused

View attachment 176300

Interesting.

I contacted SD and they said mine was ok, though mine appears to suffer the same issue as the Clio one.

 

[Fraser.J.]

Ye i can't really get round my head how my cage can now fail scruitinering when the rules haven't changed regarding the a-pillar. Seems very unfair to now make near enough all dash-dodgers now void due to this. I'll be taking mine to be scruitinered with last years stickers on and raising how it passed last year and it hasn't changed!

 

[Pauleds]

Emailed my scrutineer and he said as long as I have paperwork, there shouldn't be an issue.
Not sure what paperwork he means, as I just remember it just having the sticker like the above photo

 

[massiveCoRbyn]

I'll try and grab a picture of the sticker on mine at the weekend if I remember. As I say, SD told me mine was ok but said the Clio one was never homologated.

 

[shiftspark]

I think a lot of the problem stems from the dash dodger front cages as some have 2 bends in them I think the GT86 cage has 3! I have seen cages with an extra bar welded across the door opening from the front leg to the top horizontal.
See here http://www.customcages.co.uk/news-room/msa-rule-changes-and-update-kits

 

[Ads29]

Emailed my scrutineer and he said as long as I have paperwork, there shouldn't be an issue.
Not sure what paperwork he means, as I just remember it just having the sticker like the above photo

According to the Safety Devices website I'm supposed to ring the Msa and pay a £25 fee to get a certificate to show the cage is what it is, I think I'll ring them in the next day or two and what they say

 

[Steven_K]

The custom cages link is good as it shows that the front leg (as per the SD dash dodger) is compliant As is the Ktec cage and others to boot.
I can only assume someone has had a shunt and subsequently an investigation to create this type of a stir ... my thoughts as per a previous post is that I'll take my car to scrutineering with last years stickers on also ... I'm not expecting any repercussions.


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[Ads29]

So according to the roll cage group buys there are plans for a redesigned front cage??

The plot thickens

 

[Sam Linssner]

Its confusing as hell. The wording hasn't changed, but the old cage is no good, the new one is going to be to msa spec but that is a completely new cage, but then there is a new front end that will fit the old rear and that will be msa compliant. But i've had it conformed that the new font/old rear will and will not be produced.

Ive cancelled my safety devices order and getting a custom made one to spec.

 

[Ads29]

Same here, totally confused. As I said before on your thread I'll be buying another shell and starting again, it's the best way I think

 

[Hyperhatch]

The new cage will go through the dash, I have it on order and have said to Mark Fish they can use my car as the test/first car with the new cage. I have been told the end of March for delivery to Mark but I'll hold my breath with that! I imagine there will be a big rush on once it's released!

 

[GrahamS]

@Martin. New cage, not a new front section :S

 

[Martin.]

Safety Devices are c***s. Fact

 

[Pauleds]

Agreed. MSA don't help either though.
£800 cage, 12 months ago fitted, car 7 months finished build, 4 events inc international event and now I can't fecking compete in it again unless I strip the car out and replace the whole cage!! It certainly won't be another SD one.

 

[massiveCoRbyn]

No, the MSA definitely don't help. It would seem to me, however, that it would have been in SD's interest to properly homologate the cage from the off. They've sold plenty of them, so surely the cost could have been offset. But, I guess they get another pile of money with people now replacing them!

 

[Ads29]

No, the MSA definitely don't help. It would seem to me, however, that it would have been in SD's interest to properly homologate the cage from the off. They've sold plenty of them, so surely the cost could have been offset. But, I guess they get another pile of money with people now replacing them!

Not from me they won't be, one bitten twice shy and all

 

[DCELEC 182]

As above, total pisser really as I bought a full safety devices last year and had it professionally fitted with the intention of building the car to race spec.....if the cage is indeed no longer acceptable that's nearly £1,500 chucked away! I wouldn't give them any of my money again when they could easily make a modified front section to replace the dash dodgers!
Be a lot worse if I was racing this year as lots of people will be I guess. Roll cages are a boring enough modification as it is!!

 

[Martin.]

Safety Devices will be getting zero money from me ever again. Unless they make a proper front section to comply with my current rear section.

 

[Ads29]

Safety Devices will be getting zero money from me ever again. Unless they make a proper front section to comply with my current rear section.

I still wouldn't spend the money to buy a new front section now, I understand and agree that they should produce something that complies but I'm afraid I'm done with Safety Devices

 

[Marshal10]

If you gussetted the A pillar leg into the A pillar would that meet the requirements?

 

[Russ Rallye]

Surely Safety Devices have slipped up here, if they're saying it isn't now fit for purpose regarding Msa regs then it never has been fit for purpose and can easily be proved with previous blue books and dates of sake of the cage? Surely trading standards could help out here? I have a vested interest in this I've built a 172 with an sd cage last year that a friend now owns, it's been raced in 2016 with various clubs without issue but obviously he's a little concerned for next season.
Russ

 

[Fraser.J.]

Surely Safety Devices have slipped up here, if they're saying it isn't now fit for purpose regarding Msa regs then it never has been fit for purpose and can easily be proved with previous blue books and dates of sake of the cage? Surely trading standards could help out here? I have a vested interest in this I've built a 172 with an sd cage last year that a friend now owns, it's been raced in 2016 with various clubs without issue but obviously he's a little concerned for next season.
Russ

Couldn't agree more.

How you can turn round and now say it doesn't comply without a new rule is beyond me.

I can understand them making new ones to avoid any doubt, but I've competed last year with this cage, with no issues.

I'll be racing again this year, with the same cage, surely worth a fight with a scruitneer!