Invisible mods

[Bezza4]

I am considering looking in to getting a bit more bhp out of the old Cup. However, the insurance company I am with does not insure any1 under the age of 25 with mods. Hence why I am asking about "invisible" mods.

What can I do that is not really a visible mod, or that someone from an insurance company would not spot if I was to have a crash?

Obviously I want to get the most for my money. I don't want to spend too much. Say around the £500 mark as a guide. What would give me the biggest increase of bhp for the fewest £?

Or would everyone advise not to do any mods without declaring it to the insurance. Even if they were "invisible"?

Cheers,

Matt

 

[Fred@BTM]

AWT inlet + remap (several companies do them, inc us) = £500 give or take

 

[Bezza4]

Wot sort of increase will that be?

Just me being thick but whats an AWT inlet?

 

[Fred@BTM]

Angel Works Technologies/rent boys (BenR) about £180 IIRC massivley improves the airflow

matched with a remap, i would estimate a fair 10bhp approx (although, you may already have a decentish manifold, they vary)

i can't remember if you have an exhaust and filter etc?

 

[BenR]

bada bing, bada boom.

 

[Bezza4]

Ive just got a cone filter, and no idea if my manifold is any good. It cracked about 12 months ago, so I think Renault had to replace it

 

[Maz]

I wouldn't risk not telling them tbh mate .. may as well just drive round with no insurance .. not worth the risk imho ..

 

[Fred@BTM]

this is inlet manifold, not exhaust mate, call me if you need ideas

 

[Bezza4]

this is inlet manifold, not exhaust mate, call me if you need ideas

Lol, can you tell I don't know anything about whats under the bonnet.

 

[Gaz_]

I wouldn't risk not telling them tbh mate .. may as well just drive round with no insurance .. not worth the risk imho ..

there is no way of telling these mods

 

[mr bognor]

Yes

 

[Bezza4]

Sorry. I'll just shut up then, and leave it to you pro's to tell me what is best to do, how much it is likely to cost, and the sort of gains I can expect.

That's if there is anything else, or is an AWT inlet plus remap the best way forward?

 

[Gaz_]

Sorry. I'll just shut up then, and leave it to you pro's to tell me what is best.

give me your bank details?

 

[Fred@BTM]

decat (if you can be bothered)
full exhaust

??
suspension??

 

[Gaz_]

what fred said really, the inlet is only how renault should have made them anyway, and a remap is just changing a few settings in the cars programming, they will be invisible

 

[edde]

there is no way of telling these mods

There is the intake isn't to the same spec and standards as one from the production run Ben adjust the size and shape. Also the finish is different inside anyone know understands production methodology and surface finish would know its been modified. Then agian its difficult they will check.
There no point in stealth mods for insurance IMO best modify the suspension and brakes there much more significant than extra HP.

Decat, intake work and a remap is about £650 I think and would be a good start.

 

[Gaz_]

agree, but has anyone ever heard of insurance going to these lenghts to check? i haven't, and i wouldn't decare it

 

[mr bognor]

Yeah but a decat and remap and intake work are not stealth mods .

 

[Gaz_]

de cat no, but do you really think the insurance will open up the engine, look at the inlet, the plug a laptop or whatever into the car to look at the map?

don't think so

 

[Day]

A reputable business encouraging engine modifications and not telling the insurance company.

Well I'd never

Us insurance investigators are not daft

 

[edde]

de cat no, but do you really think the insurance will open up the engine, look at the inlet, the plug a laptop or whatever into the car to look at the map?

don't think so

Checking the ECU maps is a very simple check my car I think was checked when I crashed it.
If i was a crash investigaor I'd check and refuse to payout but many companies arn't as mean as me.

 

[Gaz_]

lol, but i'd thought the changes in the fueling would be minimal etc, i'd undrstand it on a vag engines with revo's etc, where nearly 50bhp can be had, but not a clio wheres tops with minimal mods you'd be looking at 10bhp if lucky

 

[Day]

If you are involved in a serious accident the car could be looked at by police forensics/investigators to find the possible cause of the crash.

I would imagine the consequences to be quite severe if discovered.

Change car insurer - Greenlight insure pretty much all modifications for all drivers aged 21+ for example.

 

[edde]

lol, but i'd thought the changes in the fueling would be minimal etc, i'd undrstand it on a vag engines with revo's etc, where nearly 50bhp can be had, but not a clio wheres tops with minimal mods you'd be looking at 10bhp if lucky

Yep but a simple checksum of values whill show the programs isn't the same as standard.
I agree though VAG etc have more potential but with margins being so small in the industry they want to save costs all the time not payout if a good cost saving.
I know an Escort Cosworth was checked when it had been crashed and the onwer had told them it was chipped they checked the map would only make the power he told the insurer about thats how bad they can be.

 

[Gaz_]

fair comments, wonder what would happen if you brought a car that looked standard, but had the ecu tweeked.... and you didn't know lol!

 

[Guy]

AWT billet cams
AWT/GDI Inlet manifold match
Standard ECU Remap (GDI/Hillpower/chipwizards)
ITG panel filter

should see 190odd and look totally standard?

 

[Guy]

fair comments, wonder what would happen if you brought a car that looked standard, but had the ecu tweeked.... and you didn't know lol!

just play dumb..

at the end of the day.. how would you possibly know if these undetectable mods were there or not when you bought it?

 

[cK]

Make massive power gaining visable mod's and change your insurance company to a mod friendly one

 

[edde]

fair comments, wonder what would happen if you brought a car that looked standard, but had the ecu tweeked.... and you didn't know lol!

Your deemed as safe.
Be interesting to see what they said if they found out the car had some real mods like a forged bottom end reving to 9k but looking stock what they would say though.

 

[Ali]

Stealth zorst, decat, headwork, cams, inlets, remap...All will go un noticed.

 

[Thomss]

I'm thinking I may need a re-map soon??
I've got ITG Panel filter, decat and custom ss exhaust.
Wondering also, what would be the next thing to get without spending big money by that I mean TB money.

 

[edde]

I'm thinking I may need a re-map soon??
I've got ITG Panel filter, decat and custom ss exhaust.
Wondering also, what would be the next thing to get without spending big money by that I mean TB money.

What do you describe as big money?
Intake modified preferably level 2 if your going to remap. Thats £450 or so, level 1 modification is £150 or so I think but the gains are almost as good as throttle bodies on level 2 and much cheaper since stock ECU can be used.
if you want to go any further cams are the way to go thats £1k or so and if your having that done might as well have the head off and have it ported as well (£700 or so). If your going this far though you'll be best upgrading the injectors as well personally anyhwere over 190 I'd uprate them its not that much extra and well worth it when you trhink if they fail when your at 200hp then its melted pistons.

 

[Bezza4]

AWT billet cams
AWT/GDI Inlet manifold match
Standard ECU Remap (GDI/Hillpower/chipwizards)
ITG panel filter

should see 190odd and look totally standard?

How much is all that likely to cost?

I like the thought of big gains, but dont like the thought of spending a lot of dollar. I get bored of cars fairly easy, and although I plan on keeping this one a bit longer, there is always the chance I may want to change it before long.

I would change insurance companies, but I am with Privilege with 4yrs NCB, so the beat any quote, and to be fair the amount I am paying is quite a bit cheaper than anyone else. Directline wasn't too far off, but will also have to be 25 for mods, every one else was at least £300 difference, and that is just for a standard car.

 

[MarkM]

My insurance for cams, coilovers, ECU, manifold match, exhaust, IK is £595 with greenlight all mods declared so not much more then it cost to insure it standard with direct line.

They told me that if I am prepared to spend alot of money modifying the car I would be more likely to look after it and not drive round like a t**t. Which I think in my case is true. You wont recover the labour costs, for modifying it, if you right it off.

 

[Bezza4]

Yeah, but I think greenlight said they give good rates for all clio sports apart from 172 cups due to the amount of claims they have for cups. Might give them a try though. Won't hurt to get a quote.

 

[cK]

Greenlight are cheapest I have come across. Cups lack abs which they said is the main reason they can't give good rates for them.

 

[Bezza4]

May just have to stick to my invisible mods then. Wouldn't mind lowering it though, but can't really hide that.

 

[MarkCup]

Why not spend £500 on driver training?

Would make you quicker than an extra 10bhp ever will...

 

[JEFF4507]

This is all very well, but the only way they'll ever check for these little things is in a big accident in which the police are involved.

Saying that, I couldn't comment on smaller accidents with police as I've never been involved with police and accidents (like to keep those separate ).

I have heard police check cars sometimes (usually boy racer cruises) and confirm any mods with insurers, but that would be simply for alloy wheels, body kits, K+N, Pipercross etc induction kits, exhausts. Not things like ECU remaps (lucky for my diesel :approve: ) and more subtle exhaust systems... I imagine.

What is the deal with alloys and the like then ? I am buying the DCI 80 I mentioned in another thread, and the tyres on the front will need changing soon, and one of the rear wheels is missing a badge. No biggie, but I though instead of buying new tyres, might aswell buy new alloy wheels with tyres right away.

I am with Direct Line, do alloy wheels count for these "not allowed" mods. And if they do, is there anyway to get them allowed, such as "I need new wheels and have a set in the garage".

And as for these AWT inlets, are they available for diesels, I want to fix the intake and exhaust before doing a visit to my friends at superchips.co.uk... I'm not going for outragous loud stuff, just high flow with minimal noise (although wouldn't mind a little roar when booting it).:rasp:

 

[JEFF4507]

Why not spend £500 on driver training?

Would make you quicker than an extra 10bhp ever will...

Not sure about that one. Invisible mods for straight line speed are obviously not affected by driver skill. But advance driving schools will indeed help keep you out of accidents, and make you a generally more respectable driver.