JC5 Dog Box

[NorthloopCup]

Evening folks! Hope you’re all ready for Santa to deliver you some pressies!

There’s potential that in 2022 I will need someone who races a mk2 Clio to be a Guinea pig and run a dog box in a kind of development role. The box will be supplied by me and would be ready to fit and try to see if any issues/failures arise.

This is something that will be done with my own money - so it’s quite a large investment, as I’m sure you’ll appreciate.

In return, I should be able to offer a dog box gear kit at a reduced price.

Merry Christmas 🎄

 

[Krarl]

I reckon @Nathan Evans should 👀👀

 

[NorthloopCup]

I reckon @Nathan Evans should 👀👀

He’s got a sadev mate. Josh (Nath’s brother) may be up for it though.

 

[Bluebeard]

If nobody wants to be a ginea pig on their race car, I’ll do it on my track car.
i do 10 full days a year so it will get a good testing.

 

[Twingo 1??]

Brilliant offer for someone! Pity the Twingo runs a different box 😔

 

[Louis]

If I promise to limiter bash it everyday to work can I be considered? Thanks.

 

[Mr Squashie]

If I promise to limiter bash it everyday to work can I be considered? Thanks.

Glad I'm not the only one who thought that!

 

[Jamie86]

Hi! Happy to help I’m used to dnfs with gearbox/driveshaft issues already haha

 

[NorthloopCup]

A dog box is a very different gearbox to use compared to a synchro box, so it’s worth looking into so you understand how it works.

 

[Jamie86]

Yeah know a few who race with them. Including Nick G with a pms one!

You’ve got my number anyway

 

[EVO 4LEX]

Also only a track dayer as you well know but I don’t hang about either. Glad to see you pushing forward with it pal. Let me know if I can help.

 

[Nathan Evans]

He’s got a sadev mate. Josh (Nath’s brother) may be up for it though.

Josh will test it to destruction you know that 😂

 

[NorthloopCup]

Josh will test it to destruction you know that 😂

Lol 100% no doubt in my mind 🤣

 

[Crybert]

Can you explain it to us mere mortals? Just purely out of interest

 

[Krarl]

Can you explain it to us mere mortals? Just purely out of interest

Let Me Google That

For all those people that find it more convenient to bother you with their question than to google it for themselves.

letmegooglethat.com

 

[NorthloopCup]

Can you explain it to us mere mortals? Just purely out of interest

Ok so first video gives the explanation:



And this video gives the demonstration of just how fast the gear change is when using one.

 

[Crybert]

Ok so first video gives the explanation:



And this video gives the demonstration of just how fast the gear change is when using one.

Holy f**k that’s fooking rapid!

 

[NorthloopCup]

Holy f**k that’s fooking rapid!

It’s also a very mechanical engagement and shock loadings are huge.

 

[NorthloopCup]

Here’s part of the Jc5 dog box kit. You can clearly see the dog engagement teeth here. There’s a lot of work needed though still. I'm wanting to do away with the brass selector forks as well, so this all needs to be added into a redesign.

 

[choonlim]

Is the dog box H pattern or sequential ?

5 or 6 speed ?

 

[NorthloopCup]

Is the dog box H pattern or sequential ?

5 or 6 speed ?

It’s a 5 speed H pattern.

 

[Turbo steve]

Will it handle 250 / 250 from a turbo engine?

 

[NorthloopCup]

Will it handle 250 / 250 from a turbo engine?

It’s difficult to say mate. The ratios also won’t suit a boost motor, but I am wanting to have it setup to work with a oe final drive should people wish.

 

[Turbo steve]

It’s difficult to say mate. The ratios also won’t suit a boost motor, but I am wanting to have it setup to work with a oe final drive should people wish.

Ok. Alex will be building me another track car later this year that will be NA so can try one in that if you want

 

[Kev@KAM]

I've got my 182 Trackcar. I'm not racing so its no bother if there are issues that need addressing or the car has to sit around for any length of time. Can easily be trailered anywhere.

 

[NorthloopCup]

Right, now things are starting to get more back to normal after covid, this dog box kit could well be back in the offings.

I’ve spoken to a machine shop that’s happy to do the machining - they’re UK based and extremely good at what they do. They also have experience in this area, so that will prove invaluable.

I’ve still got a few things to iron out with them (cost and whether we change from straight cut to helical gears mainly) but we are both on the same page. The consideration to change to helical gears allows the use of any available final drives, and helical gear teeth are also stronger (to some extent) as there’s more of the gear tooth in contact at any particular time. Straight cut is strong, but it allows for less frictional losses - therefore more power is transmitted to the wheels.

For this to realistically work out, I’d need a minimum of 5 people who are prepared to put their money where their mouth is and stump up a 50% deposit. I’ll be the one paying out for the first production version and building it into a box.

Obviously no one will be held to gun point if the total outlay is too expensive and you wish to back out - I get it.

 

[Ph1 Tom]

Could be interested Mark 👍

 

[Beauvais Motorsport]

Get the gears finished ground, don’t ask for the cost until you go to pay 😆

 

[NorthloopCup]

Get the gears finished ground, don’t ask for the cost until you go to pay 😆

That will be being done anyway mate

 

[Beauvais Motorsport]

does this company do small involute helicoil gears (rack pinions) as well?

 

[gez 172]

@ian-speedy

 

[NorthloopCup]

does this company do small involute helicoil gears (rack pinions) as well?

If you can send me a picture of what you want, I’ll ask the question. 👍🏻

 

[Beauvais Motorsport]

Will do mate. Will have to get some good quality pictures first with dimensions.

 

[Ph1 Tom]

If not, I deal with a gear company that will do one offs from anything small enough for mechanical watches up to about 700mm.

 

[Beauvais Motorsport]

Thanks guys. Really what I want to have machined are torsion bars. I spoke to someone the other day who was very experienced but he wouldn't tell me the alloy steel used, I think he worked for gov/military..

 

[Dowd]

Right, now things are starting to get more back to normal after covid, this dog box kit could well be back in the offings.

I’ve spoken to a machine shop that’s happy to do the machining - they’re UK based and extremely good at what they do. They also have experience in this area, so that will prove invaluable.

I’ve still got a few things to iron out with them (cost and whether we change from straight cut to helical gears mainly) but we are both on the same page. The consideration to change to helical gears allows the use of any available final drives, and helical gear teeth are also stronger (to some extent) as there’s more of the gear tooth in contact at any particular time. Straight cut is strong, but it allows for less frictional losses - therefore more power is transmitted to the wheels.

For this to realistically work out, I’d need a minimum of 5 people who are prepared to put their money where their mouth is and stump up a 50% deposit. I’ll be the one paying out for the first production version and building it into a box.

Obviously no one will be held to gun point if the total outlay is too expensive and you wish to back out - I get it.

What kind of price are we looking at?

 

[Ph1 Tom]

Thanks guys. Really what I want to have machined are torsion bars. I spoke to someone the other day who was very experienced but he wouldn't tell me the alloy steel used, I think he worked for gov/military..

View attachment 1665989

We can machine stuff like that. If you send me one I can check the grade of steel.

 

[Beauvais Motorsport]

We can machine stuff like that. If you send me one I can check the grade of steel.

Perfect!!! ll give you a pm in a bit, I have one dismantled for reference I need to keep but a few others I would take apart to send out.

 

[Ph1 Tom]

Perfect!!! ll give you a pm in a bit, I have one dismantled for reference I need to keep but a few others I would take apart to send out.

No worries 👍

I'm in the office next week but I'm off the week after for half term.

 

[Beauvais Motorsport]

No worries!!

Im building a metrology station for rack/column testing and have kinda spent a bit much and have more to buy so Ill be going about this over the next couple months Hopefully santa didnt see what I did the other day on the road...

Should have em send out to you next week though...