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Williams 1 No. 0069



  Williams 1 (no.69)
Saturday 16th Feb 2008

Well I have been on the look out for a mk1 for sometime - was initially planning on getting a valver + widetrack williams suspenson but decided it best to buy a more special car.

Unfortunately the williams 3 I wanted (mat brown's mate was selling) got sold last week so hunting around i found one that looked reasonable and sounded pretty decent so I went to have a look at it this morning - all looked decent enough - went back and bought it.

It needs a lotta things doing to get it back to the way it should be. The wheels are hideous might buy some new speedlines or get a pristine refurb done.

Williams 1 No.69 - Registration from factory L69 **U
123K on the Clock - fully stamped book.
Lots of receipts in folder.

Like any car of this age it has its faults - all of which I plan to sort out in my ownership. I got it for a good price. It will probably get a trip to Nick Hill in the near future for some work and a complete assessment of the car itself.

Just wana say thanks to Sean (seanofnp on wc/c16v) for the advice and lift to pick it up also.
Also to Matteh (c16v), arj256, and shackal(the lil rascal)!!

Thought I would Post up a couple of crappy pics for the time being.

The last one shows No.26 tucked away (whilst my brothers off travelling)
My dead and nearly buried Clio 16v and my No. 69 in the back

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Report After Day:
Engine seems ok Not too noisy etc etc. It did have hints of cream in the coolant cap but none in the engine cap or dipstick which had me worried about the HG going. So i knocked the price down to include for a new HG.
It didnt overheat in traffic or on the journey back so im a little less worried now - and plan to get a coolant flush all done next week.

TBH it runs ok - some engine movement (needs new mounts).
After 123 K it still pulls strongly.
Needs a new heatshield (I have one being delivered next week)
and needs new tyres al round.
Clutch is fine - a lot lighter than my old mk1 16v.
The car has no rust ANYWHERE (even innerside of tailgate is perfect).

In all honesty I have bought the car and have a budget to cover the worse case scenario's. I havent bought it to keep for a year, I plan to get it up to a standard I like and maintain it well.

24th Feb 2008
With the Help of a few people the car underwent a coolant flush and New Oil Filter / Oil.

A cheap 'neat' coolant was used in order to act as a flush as I planned to do a coolant flush with Type D in the coming weeks. System was flushed from the Top Pipe (just below the bleed screw) and a hose down the coolant bottle.

Although, this got rid of a lot of rubbish that was in the Rad, it did not do the job 100% and therefore was done so more as a measure of something is better than nothing.

Oil Filter was purchased from GSF as a Williams filter. Turned out this part was not as listed for the Williams and was infact for another renault vehicle.Therefore this would also be changed pretty soon.

Oil used was the Fuchs Semi-Synthetic 10W40 Purchased from GSF.


Lessons learnt
1. Always flush coolant from the lower rad pipe, ensure that the condition of the Radiator is in good condition (and not full of crap).
2. Always ensure the correct part numbers are used for the oil filter - there are many companies which sell 'Williams' filters - however, they are rarely ever true Renault Williams parts.

16th March 08
Number 69 Was Now sitting on the Team Dynamic Pro Race 1.2's (with Brand New Michelin Pilot Exalto 2's in 195 50 15). These were previously being used on my 172 Mk1.

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The Williams Wheels which came with the car were looking very very tired, So after talking with a friend who was in the market to sell his Williams Alloys (superb condition) I sold these off to someone on another forum. One man's rubbish is another man's gold Laughing


21 March 08

After getting my insurance doc's for the car, and the required Road Tax it was time to get the project underway.

There were a few priorities in my list which needed addressing:
1. Coolant needed a proper flush and Type D added (including a replacement Radiator)
2. Restore the rear of the car (which had an aftermarket rear spoiler not to my taste) back to standard look.
3. Replace the Oil filter in the car to one of that which is the correct item
4. No record of Gearbox oil being replaced - therefore a flush and replacement of the oil was required.
5. Fitting of R19 Mount to eradicate the play in the engine bay which i was experiencing.

I decided due to the gunk and rubbish appearing in the Coolant (after the previous flush) the coolant system needed to have a more adequate flush done and ideally I wanted to use a different rad to do the work.

Reasons for changing the radiator was as follows:
1. I did not believe the HG was going, as the oil filler cap / oil dipstick and engine showed no signs of HG failure. Therefore, the only conclusion i could draw, was the rad Fitted to the car was from a car that may have previously had a HG failure.
2. The radiator had a leak from the bleed screw. Although the plastic Bleed Screw has no signs of cross threading, the metal thread in the rad was showing signs of incorrect operation. For the interim, PTFE worked as a good sealant and stopped the leak completely. However, this would ultimately need changing.


After some talks with Rob (King Stromba) I had decided I would make the trip up to his to carry out the above work on my car. I also needed to pick up a new Tailgate from himself.

The morning of 21st March 08,
9.30am - I popped over to Matbrown's to collect a Williams Rear Spoiler and clips - and a radiator.
10.30am - I arrived at King Stromba's and after a brief chat, we began by fitting the new tailgate. This went on pretty easily and after a few little niggles, the tailgate was installed and in full operation.

Next was to get the Old Rad out and flush the coolant.
This took slightly longer than anticipated do the typical problems with Rad Hoses and clips. Then began the process of flushing the system. This took a long long time, as both myself and KS wanted to ensure as much rubbish was out of the system before we put the new replacement rad on and the Luminous Green Type D. After a couple of hours (and a few cups of tea later to warm the hands up - weather was freezing with the odd shower here and there) the coolant system had been flushed adquately, the coolant Bottle had been cleaned as much as possible it was time to get everything put back on. This went pretty easily without any problems.

Soon the car was fitted with the new rad, system bled with Type D as required.

NOTE: Type D can be purchased from GSF for approximately £20 - £10 Less than Renault.

The Oil Filter was replaced whilst the Rad was off for the correct item and I have noticed a 0.2 - 0.4Bar increase (going by the interior dials) in oil pressure from using the Renualt Williams Oil Filter (ordered from Renault) as opposed to the Renault 'generic' oil filter ordered from GSF.

Oil Filter Part numbers are as follows:
Renault Williams part number: 77 00 274 177 CORRECT ITEM
GSF supplied Renault Oil Filter: *********033 408 INCORRECT ITEM

Now came the next stage of our proposed works for the day - Flushing the Gearbox Oil and fitting the R19 Mount. Gearbox oil was flushed as required and some new Tranself TRX 75w80 was put in.

Fitting the R19 Mount brought up some issues - namely the PAS pipe which runs in the region of where the R19 Mount fitted. At First Glance it wasnt visible how tomove this out of the way so the proposed works were aborted and as it was also getting late now.

End result of the days work:
1. The rear of the car looked hugely better and the Williams factory look was restore.
2. Coolant system was nor running far more efficiently after the new rad, flush and installation of Type D. No signs of cream at all - just a clean coolant system which has made me very happy as I knocked the seller for some money due to a possible up coming HG Failure.
NOTE: On the drive home I noticed that the Oil Temperature had dropped by some 5-10 degrees compared to drive up in the morning. This suggests to me the cooling system is now working more efficiently than it was before.
3. Gearbox Oil flush - The actualy feel of the gears felt a lot better than the drive up in the morning. I had previously used the same GB oil in my Clio 172 and it made a substantial difference.

The R19 Mount could not be fitted at the present time. Although after talking with a few other people it became apparent, the PAS pipe which was in the way - could be loosened from its position fixing bolts and wireties out of the way for the installation of the R19 Mount.

Pics of the Old Rear Spoiler/Tailgate.

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Pics of 69 Undergoing Work:

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22 March 08
Me and My brother decide to take the cars for a little Journey to Oxford. We also decided to swap cars on the journey back to compare how each car felt.

A Pic of a quick Pit Stop on the way Back - Notice the 'Buy One get One Free Sign' :laugh:
69and26.gif


24 March 08

After talking with Adam (arj256 username on this forum) I had learnt how the R19 Mount could be fitted by moving the Solid PAS Pipe.
Therefore, I carried out the work on my drive and was relatively simple to do.

Result:
A huge improvement in decreasing movement under the engine Bay under accelaration and deceleration.

Key to note at this point all mounts on Number 69 are pretty much New:
Top engine Mount - Checked no signs of rubber Perishing
Gearbox Top Mount - Checked no signs of rubber Perishing
Dogbone Mount - Hill Power Item 5k Old.
R19 Mount / Braket - Checked no signs of rubber Perishing.



Future Plans:

1. Some new NGK BKR6EK Spark Plugs are on order to be changed accordingly Smile
2. Re-earthing of the Speedo Cable.
3. The car is due to be booked in for its Cambelt Service. Currently unsure where I plan to take the car to have the work done, although Nick Hill @ Hill Power seems a possible option.
4. Plans to renew all the suspension of the Car thus providing a more true 'Williams' experience. This is to include and not limited to the following:

- New Williams Shocks (front and rear)
- New Williams Springs
- New Top Mounts
- New Williams Wishbones
- New ARB Bushes for Williams
- New Track Rod Ends
- New Bolts
- De-rusted and Hammerite'd Williams Subframe to be installed at the same time.

5. Mint Williams wheels (refurbished by Pristine) coming for the car.
6. Complete Machine Detail of the Car in the coming Months.
7. To purchase a JC5 Gearbox, rebuild and install with a new clutch accordingly.





TUesday March 25th 2008
This was the day the project took a complete different Turn...
MickPM who I am sure you all know...decided on selling up his Throttle Bodied Setup Including Engine, gearbox, ecu ITB's and all the other bits which are as follows:
  • [li]Emerald M3DK ECU[/li]
  • [li]4x48mm tapered ITB's, 90mm trumpets, Inlet manifold, throttle linkage, injectors, PiperX filtration[/li]
    [li]Alloy radiator to suit ITB installation by RadTec UK with Pacet Fan[/li]
    [li]2.0 16v F7R-710 engine with Megane cylinder head[/li]
    [li]JC5 5 speed gearbox (rebuilt and resealed under 1k ago) With 172 Arm (making the clutch a hell of a lot lighter!)[/li]
After a few PM's back and forth - I had made my decision to have the work done on the Williams.
Many people would immediatly assume it was done for power gains - this was not the case at all.

The standard Engine on Williams No.69 - was pulling well, although it felt very well used and 'loose' and to top this, It was due its cambelt change. The standard gearbox was a JB3 - and I wanted a JC5 like the williams should have had - therefore another cost. Additionally, the clutch was not fresh and pretty stiff. After driving my brother's Williams and feeling the difference of a fresh clutch I knew this was something that needed doing if I was to use the car everyday.

Therefore the cost equation fell as follows:
1. Cost of Cambelt: Approx £300
2. Cost of Fresh JC5 Box £300 + Fitting
3. Cost of a New clutch Approximately £100 to be fitted at the same time as the Gearbox.

Now this doesnt seem a lot of money - However, considering the Engine was very well run in LOL - It would be ideal to have it rebuilt at the same time...This would have costed anywhere from £1000-£2000...

The cost of the entire conversion with the Sale MickPM had for sale proved to be far more cost effection - additionally required was a fresh cambelt (the other one wasnt on many miles, but I thought it best to get done), a new RADTECH radiator (£340) due the one supplied with the conversion was for an R19 and not a Clio - and a Custom Made Loom to suit a Williams...
...The difference was, with the modified set-up I would have parts worth a hell of a lot more, than what a standard williams engine (even with fresh rebuild and new cambelt would be worth - therefore from a cost point of view the decision was easy, and I was looking forward to having something different...and lets face it, extra power can never be bad ;)

Therefore the decision was made...


29th March 2008
As mentioned Earlier - A friend (MattyH) decided on fitting his Brand New Speedlines to his car, and therefore parted with his Pristine Refurbed Set of Williams Wheels. The Colour is 100% Spot on match and MattyH did his research well before having them refurbed...
A few pics whilst the wheel change was underway....Also Note the OEM rear spoiler and New Tailgate (as the old one had been drilled to attach the Larger aftermarket spoiler)

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30th March 2008

The car was to be dropped off to Mick Today and I had also decided upon on refreshing the suspension on 69 at the same time. It transpired later that the Front shocks were some modified version with bored out lower bolts to reduce the Camber - they were not safe, and there was no way anyone should be driving a car on them - just goes to show how closely you should look when buying a car :eek:

Suspension Renewal Included the Following:
New OEM Front Shocks
New OEM Rear Shocks
10k Old 172 Cup Springs (apparently 3mm lower and 15% stiffer than OEM williams Springs)
New Wishbones including All bushes and Ball Joints
Fitting of Williams (triple skin) sub frame - Turned out 69 Had a Valver One on it.
New ARB Bushes
New Track Rod Ends
New Top Mount Kits including All bits needed.

Obviously, All new fluids were used:
Gearbox Oil - Tranself 75w80 TRX
Type D Coolant
10W40 Semi Syn Engine Oil
New Power Steering Fluid

The car was deliver to MickPM for the work to be carried out on the 30th March 2008, and some 5 weeks later it was ready for collection on the 04/05/08. Throughout this time, there were hurdles to overcome and decisions to be made - Mick kept me informed every step of the way and always gave me informed suggestions in how to proceed.

4th May 2008
Car was collected late afternoon/Early Evening and Damn was I excited...I was told to ensure I ran the engine in, so over the next week or so the car was run gently with the odd blast here and there, with plenty of engine braking...

5th May 2008
After a few blasts in the car - the Old coolant pipes started playing up, I didnt even think to have this replaced at the same time and did regret not having the Samco ones ordered and put on at the same time of the conversion...Note: 15 Year old Rubber hoses do perish over time..Had the Major 5 Branch Coolant hose which Connects to the OEM oil coller go...which Is not the easiest to Change...

After sourcing one such Coolant hose, I undertook the work to replace this myself and since then it hasnt given me any issues :D

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There are more to come in due time, Although The car is at the moment Begging for Machine Detailing session - have two weeks booked off in Early June where the car will be detailed over 4 days Making the paintwork look as good as the engine Bay!


Friday 16th May 2008 10pm
After coming out of a side road I floored the car to hear the reverberations (I know I know I am old enough to know better - but It is SO difficult not to floor the car in tunnels / regions of tall building close to the road - to hear the reverberations the 90mm Trumpets make mmmmmmmm)...I spotted a Police fan slowly coming up to the rear of my car...I carried on and parked the car in Maida Vale London, to see a few mates at our usual chill out shop...And the Officer in the van in the passenger side door (van blocking traffic) asked me to pull my window down...

In my mind i was saying to myself 'didnt break speed limit, didnt break traction, be cool, dont be aggressive, be sensible, dont kick up a fuss'.....etc
Turned out all they wanted to do was talk to me about the Williams :laugh:
Tell me how they loved the car when they were younger, and that 15 years ago it was the car to have... :p - A couple of the officers opened the Rear door and were having a look to which one of them said 'Top Car Mate' definitely a bonus owning a car which is recognised and respected by so many....An even bigger Bonus, when the Old bill dont give you a hard time!

Have had people ask me if it was for sale whilst I been on road (not a chance!!) and had many people in new performance cars (Audi RS4's RS6's, Gold Mk5 R32's etc) talk to me about the car at various stages of traffic in central london - even get the stern look from people in exotics - guess they are just wondering how a 15 year old Renault Classic is still on the road....Never had this level of treatment in any car I have owned before and I must say I love it!!! :D



18th May 2008
A few friend had decided on going to Santa Pod on their RWYB day - so I decided this be a good time to test the Williams out and see what it does...

1/4 Mile time was 14.5 - Done with Only the Rear Seats removed! And with a catalytic converter, 3/4 tank of fuel and on Road Tyre Pressures!!! and thats with my dodgy drag racing skills too!
The Max Speed I acheived when crossing the 1/4mile marker was 98.875 MPH.

Funniest Thing was - the guy who is captured racing me (in the Nissan 350Z) before we raced, didnt even talk or even look at my car whilst we were queing, not sure if he thought he was wasting his time racing me - he was so shocked I beat him, when we came back around to que up he jumped out of his car to come and talk.... :rasp:

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The CAT is heavily restricting power at the top end and I am currently on the lookout to purchase a decat...And the Car ideally needs a ReMap due to the various changed which have occured from the previous car the engine set up was being used on.



20th May 2008
The plans for the Williams are as follows:
- Decat to be bought and fitted
- Oil Change (its done about 1k since the engine going in)
- Oil Filter Change
- Possible upgrade of ECU and 3 Maps added (switchable from inside the car :D)

The Paintwork on the car is pretty decent - And as its my daily drive I am reluctant to have it all resprayed at the moment...as its bound to pick up marks/scratches/ dents etc..The joys of living in London :roll:
Nevertheless this will be assessed further after I have been on a detailing course day, and see the results I can achieve using various different detailing methods...

Hope you guys enjoy the thread, as at the moment I am enjoying owning this car - As Always there will be more to come in due time :cool:
 
  Mk2 Golf GTI 16v
georgous. reminds me of when i was a wee boy and my next door neighbour had one when they'd just came out. i wanted one even back then!
 
  ValverInBits
Great read well done mate. Glad to see people still care about MK1s on CS.

I'm sure you don't need telling how lucky you are to have found a willy 1 with no rust !!

You mentioned "earthing the speedo cable". I'm almost sure that the speedos are mechanical (cable) setup on williams. They definitely are on valvers ph1 and 2

Edit: I'm a jeff buckley fan too :)
 
  '92 172, Lotus Elise
they are

but they have a plug at the dash end which needs to be connected (contains an ignition live and an earth iirc). without it, the car will idle at 1500 after being driven (no idea why)
 
  Williams 1 (no.69)
Cheers to all for the comments!

Dunster
Get one (and make sure its a Williams 1) !! Im predicting a sudden shortfall in years to come...at the moment there seem to be quite a few about and some in decent nick for not very much money..

A.E
Thanks Fella - Williams 3! my brother had one. I have heard 432 cars are notorious for rusting (for some weird reason) hope yours is waxoyled all over :D

Ali
Williams' are awesome - but they do have a habit of giving grief!! - My 172 mk1 has been a dream, got it serviced and replaced the clutch. Thats it for 10k worth of motoring for a performance hatch!! Although in all honesty, the mk1's arent bad, just need everything renewed really - LOL

Rich
I'd be lying if I said the number didnt appeal to me - quite a cheeky number thats for sure.:lolup:

MaceV6
Mk1 V6....MMMMMMMmmmmmmmmmmm enough said.

Aluco
Aye, in a word she sure is (at the moment anyway lol)

Chris Cliomk1

Theres a lot more to come in terms of power from the car...and I definitely need more practise at pod.
The ECU was mapped conservatively (190bhp drivable - MPG ) for a different exhaust system system..It had a different manifold downpipe and no catalytic converter.

Therefore, as mentioned need to get a decat on and ECU will be upgraded later on in the year to have 3 switchable maps (switchable on the fly) - then i'll get it to pod for a truer unleashing of power.

Alex
The Mk1's sure do make great project/track cars...I always say 'bang for buck they cannot be beaten' :rasp:

Avstart1 / Sharpie / Marky / Whitley
Cheers Fellas - glad you enjoyed the read...

Point8
Thanks for the positive comments.
Yeh - its had body work done at some point, one of the good points when I bought the car - although using the car everyday it isnt half picking up marks at an exponential rate! And the paintwork is screaming for a detail :eek: (got two weeks of in June, and at a Detailing Course day on saturday so should pick up some further tips - so will get some better pics of the car then)

Yeh the speed cables are mechanical in nature - although, not 100%why - but they definitely need earthing, causes high idle when the earthing isnt quite right. However, I no longer have this problem, all been overridden with the New ECU/engine set up

Hallelujah!!!!! ;)
 
  Golf GTI PP Mk7
thats 2 of us with williams 1' being done up. Mines in the garage atm slowly being tidied up, just wating for a new clutch now, then tax+insurance and shes ready to roll. Yours is looking spot on tho mate

IMG_3245_800.jpg
 
  Golf R
good to see you in another Williams after the events of our brekky run last year! from seeing your last one it looks like you still have the same focus for getting this one equally mint :)
 
  clio williams n0.26
good to see you in another Williams after the events of our brekky run last year! from seeing your last one it looks like you still have the same focus for getting this one equally mint :)


hi fella:)

unfortuanetly that was my williams i did a poop in:eek: .

but my new one is sitting outside:approve:
 
  Williams 1 (no.69)
Point8
The Earthing (I have on good authority) is required for the speed sensor, just thought I would clear that one up

FunkyMunky
Hope you and your missus (bubbles?) are well...:)
As said by finalabode, it was his car that went to clioheaven that day, I was merely the passenger.
Will definitely hope to come to a meet in your vicinity to see yourself (and of course your new car) steve, and the rest of you lot.

LewisNevin
your motor sure does look lush!!
What number is your car? 125?

Jamesstone
Cheers mate, they sound even better:approve:

Martin
The same martin who had the white ITB hybrid and then moved over to ''kick in his vtec yo!'' ??
I hear you are due to return back to the reno/clio scene :D

StormRider
I estimate it to be making 180-185 bhp (with cat) at the mo.
The set up itself (on standard engine internals) is good for 200bhp although this will potentially ruin the every day drivability of the car.
I shall be upgrading the ecu and having 3 switchable maps put on, so an MPG capable map will stand by itself with two others geared for fast road, 1/4miling, Track use in some form. ;)

T110MAS

Cheers Pal - they sure are cracking cars!
 
  Fiat Coupe 20v turbo
Martin
The same martin who had the white ITB hybrid and then moved over to ''kick in his vtec yo!'' ??
I hear you are due to return back to the reno/clio scene :D

indeed back in the reno land.....think I saw you ages ago at pod actually, hope to catch up with you at an event some time, itb's ftw!
 
  Williams 1 (no.69)
Ted182
The car your thinking of is 'Cliolord's' car - his on the WC and C16V forum.
APD built the car and it is pretty lethal.

What Car were you in?
I did spot a 172 Cup - but the owner of it was always driving somewhere or running off somewhere so never got the chance to have a chat with him.

JayJayMk1 / Leeshez
Cheers Gents.

Martin
Yeh was in early 2007 - I had a valver back then and you had the ITB'd White Hybrid! What a difference a year makes...LOL
Welcome Back! Will keep a close on your progress - always enjoy watching your vids (msouth ;))

Jamie
Totally Agree - I did consider getting some ultra-light alloys at one point (3.5kg a corner) , only for a second though - then I remembered it was a Williams and started looking for some Minty Williams wheels :rasp:
 
  M140i/Orange 182
Ted182
The car your thinking of is 'Cliolord's' car - his on the WC and C16V forum.
APD built the car and it is pretty lethal.


i was not driving, i was with my mate in his black type R there was also a focus RS and a Golf GTI edtion 30 with us.
 
  Williams 1 (no.69)
Ted182
The car your thinking of is 'Cliolord's' car - his on the WC and C16V forum.
APD built the car and it is pretty lethal.


i was not driving, i was with my mate in his black type R there was also a focus RS and a Golf GTI edtion 30 with us.

Ahhh ok - I must have been somewhere else in the queue.
I did have a good chat with a Guy in a Mint Civic EK9 which was Turbo'd! :eek: -He had traction issues but was posting 13.3/13.4's :D.
 
Last edited:
  Monaco Ph2 172
Having those mint wheels really transforms the car.

Definitely - the car is a beauty though! ;)


Were the wheels done at Pristine - or did MattH do them himself? My Williams wheels need doing, but people I have spoke to before aren't keen on doing them. Plus I have my own doubts whether the colour can be matched close enough...
 


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