Newbie needs help :(

[Millbo01]

Hi guys, want to say firstly what a fantastic forum. I am so glad that i came accross it. Have been spending the last week reading posts relavant to my problem.

It goes like this --- 1 week ago i bought a 172 2001 with 99k on the clock full years MOT and a brand new cam belt.
The seller was a mechanic selling the car privately from his Mot center/garage. After a test and inspection i quickly parted with my cash thinking i was getting a bargain.

First indication of a problem was on the two hour drive back to Bath where i live, pulling up to junctions it was reving high, and only a blip of the throttle would set it back to tick over. I investigated and was told to try cleaning out the throttle body, i did this and the car ran like a dream.

Less than 24 hours after buying the car, ( possibly 5 hours on the road) the engine just cut out traveling at about 30mph in 3rd gear. Instictivly i put my foot on the clutch and let it roll to a stop in a layby. All electrics still working at this point, i tried to turn it over, the car was Cranking but not firing at all, a look under hood gave me no clues at all to what had happend.

I towed the car back the next day, quite naively replaced the TDC sensor later finding out that this wouldnt have killed the engine mid flow.
My local engineer now tells me that all the valves below the back cam are probably bent, as now the cam isnt even touching the top of them any more.

Please see this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KaJlEWiOzb4

What i want to know is, what happend to cause this, ill have the head off at the weekend to see the damage, i cant get in contact with the seller to find out if all the nessisary pullys and aux belt were changed at the same time, but all seemed intact before they were removed.

This engineer is reluctant to continue working with the car as he doesnt have much experience with this engine, but a local renault specialist quoted over £2000 for the job, asuming there is no damage to the pistonheads ect. ( all using genuine renault parts) Is there anyone more local to Bristol / bath who specializes in renault sports?

Sorry for the wall of text and my naivety, any advice would be greatly apreciated.

Thanks James

 

[pendulumx]

Horrible luck for that to happen on a car you've just bought.

 

[JackJack]

BTM performance in Birmingham mate it's the best way.

 

[imprezaworks]

2000 for all the work?????. Where are you based? Oops just re read, take it to btm.


Dan.

 

[Millbo01]

Hi guys, thanks for the replys, but i wouldnt be very happy towing a car that far, its a good 1.5 hours from here and i dont have a trailer.
If i can buy the parts i need to get the job done a mechanic near me said he would work for £40 ph + VAT to get the job done. Estimating three hours for the cam belt alone.

Here is the mechanics web site http://www.advancedvehicleservices.co.uk/ Any one used him before?

I wanted to know what parts i am likely to have to replace asuming there is no damage to the pistons or the head.

16 new valves
Valve springs?
Full Gasket set
New cambelt, aux belt and pullys
Oil filter + Oil
What else am i missing. Also where can i buy all of this as all of my local suppliers dont have any of it.

Cheers James

 

[CuppyDean]

Tbh mate if he hasnt worked on these engine before id be sending it to a specialist to get done, the cambelt itself is a job which requires specialist renault cambelt tools

 

[Millbo01]

Hes a renault specialist aparantly acording to their website, used to actualy work for Renault. A warning sign though was that he said he only uses genuine Renault parts, but was happy for me to supply to parts and he does the laybor. Only problem being he then wouldnt warrenty any of the work? is this a steer clear? or is this normal if they are your parts?

 

[imprezaworks]

This is going to be a recipe for disaster mate

Dan

 

[JackJack]

I know this is expensive but id be looking on the internet for some company that will transport your car from you to btm mate that garage does not sound too good.

 

[TheEvilGiraffe]

Fred@BTM. There's plenty of companies who will trailer a car for you. Fred might even know someone....

Don't take it anywhere else unless they are a proper Renault specialist with a decent rep on here. He won't warrant the parts or the work if you supply, no one will. If he supplies, he knows where they're from and they are warrantied from his supplier.

No point spending £2k on a £1k ph1 ... put a new engine in.

Speak to Fred. Call him, don't PM him.

 

[Millbo01]

As much as i would love to 120 miles is too far for me, particularly as my budget is around the £1000 to get the car up to scratch. Im suprised a "renault specialist" with 5 outlets doesnt have a Rep on here..

http://www.advancedvehicleservices.co.uk/

Still my main concern is parts, i must either be looking in the wrong places or there are no valves available online, links would be greatly apreciated.

 

[imprezaworks]

Just get a replacement engine mate.

Dan

 

[Whisker biscuit]

I have an engine here with the bottom end away, top end is fit as a fiddle which would mean a hell of a lot less work, £150 takes it.

 

[Millbo01]

I have an engine here with the bottom end away, top end is fit as a fiddle which would mean a hell of a lot less work, £150 takes it.

Pm sent mate

 

[Millbo01]

Guys, my mechanic friend had his head in there and has said its probably an oil pump failure. As the Hydrolic lifters had retracted when it lost preasue.
There is damage to the side of the head from where the "cam followers" have smashed into the side of it, so ill go ahead and get that head from T_2_the_c.
But does this sound like the likely cause. There was no oil warning light, but there is now. Rough cost of a new oil pump?

 

[coxxy]

get another engine get the belts done and drop it in

 

[AUTOCRASH]

spot on! youve been bent over and shafted allready! get a good replacment engine!

I have an engine here with the bottom end away, top end is fit as a fiddle which would mean a hell of a lot less work, £150 takes it.

 

[Fred@BTM]

Guys, my mechanic friend had his head in there and has said its probably an oil pump failure. As the Hydrolic lifters had retracted when it lost preasue.
There is damage to the side of the head from where the "cam followers" have smashed into the side of it, so ill go ahead and get that head from T_2_the_c.
But does this sound like the likely cause. There was no oil warning light, but there is now. Rough cost of a new oil pump?

nope, that's not possible

that's a belt failure of sorts ,probably the upper cambelt idler or the auxbelt, maybe the inlet/exhaust pulley have come loose or the crank bolt streched, valves get a "double bend", rockers fall off and get smashed by the cams, your cams will be scrap too

problem was caused by someone not knowing what they were doing, and you want to get it fixed by someone who possibly has the same lack of knowledge, you can't mess about when it comes to these engines

 

[EngineerD]

Go on Shiply to get quotes to get your car transported mate, most quotes are likely to be under £150

 

[Russ_16v]

If your mechanic said that, id get a new mechanic lol.

 

[AUTOCRASH]

come on guys help his guy out!im new to this engine too! what caused this???cheapest fix!umm?

 

[Russ_16v]

Fred has said what probably has caused it dude, but without viewing the car is isn't easy.

Cheapest way is easy - but is that the best?

£500 will get an engine off Ebay, and a weekend and it's in and running - but that engine will need a £200 cambelt kit, new oil etc, and who says that engine isnt scrap?

Im afraid to get a guarranteed fix there is no cheap way

Other option is get a head, send it away to be checked over, then change it yourself - bear in mind again you need a new cambelt kit and the locking tools to fit it.

 

[AUTOCRASH]

point taken! these aint cheap engines to fix!!! im learning that too!!!

Fred has said what probably has caused it dude, but without viewing the car is isn't easy.

Cheapest way is easy - but is that the best?

£500 will get an engine off Ebay, and a weekend and it's in and running - but that engine will need a £200 cambelt kit, new oil etc, and who says that engine isnt scrap?

Im afraid to get a guarranteed fix there is no cheap way

Other option is get a head, send it away to be checked over, then change it yourself - bear in mind again you need a new cambelt kit and the locking tools to fit it.

 

[Millbo01]

I apreciate every ones advice guys, what my friend was saying about the hydrolic lifters seemed to make so much sense..... ah well.
I am currently waiting to recieve quotes from shiply as to the costs to get the car up to Fred in Birmingham, im wondering if they will take me up with them, then if we are able to arrange for the belt to be fitted in one day i can enjoy the delights of the city and drive it home. If i buy that replacement head, is it likely that i will have everything i need? I know thats difficult to answer not knowing the full exstent of the damage.

 

[Cookson]

I apreciate every ones advice guys, what my friend was saying about the hydrolic lifters seemed to make so much sense..... ah well.
I am currently waiting to recieve quotes from shiply as to the costs to get the car up to Fred in Birmingham, im wondering if they will take me up with them, then if we are able to arrange for the belt to be fitted in one day i can enjoy the delights of the city and drive it home. If i buy that replacement head, is it likely that i will have everything i need? I know thats difficult to answer not knowing the full exstent of the damage.

Ring Fred and discuss with him mate. He wont bite