ph1 172 to 197

[pughy172]

Thinkin of swappin the ph1 am i going to be dissapointed if i get a 197???????

 

[sussex_gti]

Why do you want to change? The only way to know is to get out and drive one. It's different strokes for different folks.

 

[pughy172]

Was just thinking of having something newer! il see if i can test drive one and giv it a blast cheers

 

[Mr Burns]

It depends what you value in a car?

Expect better build quality, better brakes, more stability, poorer economy and they don't 'feel' as quick.

 

[Fletcher]

It depends what you value in a car?

.

This.

 

[alanc1000]

if you want something newer then you obviously wont be dissapointed.

The 197 is better in lots of ways compared to the 172, i've had them both.

 

[jesus]

If you enjoy driving your ph1, yes.

 

[pughy172]

ye love driving my ph1 are 197's any quicker??

 

[Mr Burns]

ye love driving my ph1 are 197's any quicker??

Pretty much the same, the way they behave is very different though. The 197 needs revving more and feels much more planted, especially at higher speeds. Because of this they feel slower, but in reality they're not.

 

[The Fatty]

I would have thought the 197s were heavier, thus giving them similar speed performance? I think 5th gear has a video on youtube that compairs a 182 with the 197 with the 197 being faster around the track due to better handling...

 

[R-Sport.]

in essence these are 2 different cars- the Ph1 is a bit raw- 'rough & ready' if you like- if you lined the 2 cars up I bet the phase 1 would be ever so slightly quicker-

Ive been back in an R27 for a few days & the handling & chassis is where the later clio really does kick a standard ph1 into touch- you can take corners with a lot more confidence & everything is so more refined-

If your going for a 197 - budget around 8k- buy either a Glacier white 197 cup with all the options or an R27 - which is specced with Xenons & Climate..

Watch out for knackered gearbox syncros...

S

 

[alanc1000]

the brakes on a 197 are much better too, so speed isnt quicker but you can out break and out handle a 172

 

[Munson]

The 197 needs revving more and feels much more planted, especially at higher speeds. Because of this they feel slower, but in reality they're not.

But surely how a car feels is paramount. Don't get me wrong I love the 197, but it does feel gutless. Yeah you need to thrash it to get the best out of it, and I can appreciate that, but nothing actually happens when you rev it to the redline. The 182 was far more exciting in this regard. 5k kicked in y0.

BTW don't confuse better quality materials with better build quality. Common mistake.

 

[leeds_182]

Not worth the extra outlay IMO.

 

[theduck]

I would have thought the 197s were heavier, thus giving them similar speed performance? I think 5th gear has a video on youtube that compairs a 182 with the 197 with the 197 being faster around the track due to better handling...

Except that it was faked and the 182 was actually faster. Well documented as the owner of the 182 is on here and was present.

a 197 is great but will feel very different to our 172.

 

[Mr Burns]

But surely how a car feels is paramount. Don't get me wrong I love the 197, but it does feel gutless. Yeah you need to thrash it to get the best out of it, and I can appreciate that, but nothing actually happens when you rev it to the redline. The 182 was far more exciting in this regard. 5k kicked in y0.

BTW don't confuse better quality materials with better build quality. Common mistake.

Going from a 182 the 197 did feel slower, fact. Once I'd fitted the coilovers, mapped it and stripped it out however it was a completely different animal. So controllable and 'thrashable' it was awesome.

 

[Munson]

Well yeah but that's not an apples for apples comparison really. I imagine any car can be improved by applying those modifications. Fact is they don't really feel very quick in a straight line (relative to a 182). They do handle better though IMO.

 

[GTA]

The 172 feels raw, the 197 feels refined and things have changed a lot over the years so massive improvements in handling etc etc

 

[Mr Burns]

Well yeah but that's not an apples for apples comparison really. I imagine any car can be improved by applying those modifications. Fact is they don't really feel very quick in a straight line (relative to a 182). They do handle better though IMO.

We're pretty much agreeing here, a 197 with the right mods is a nice car to own. It's a shame they're so thirsty in relation to a Mk2 and have a gearbox made by Thorntons.

 

[2Damnsly Andy]

Driven a 197 a fair few times and I still prefer the ph1 172's or a 182. The 197 is a heavier car so power to weight they would have a similar performance but you have to ring the neck on a 197 to make it feel fast.

 

[Daz_RT_04]

Handling better? thats a tricky one as Id say thats personal preference...

 

[Munson]

Hence people giving personal opinions TBH.

 

[Mr Burns]

Warren (force india/brown bear) had a Ph1 172 all stripped out with KW v3 coilovers and brand new RS2's. Could he drive? Yes. Was it good on track? Yes. Could he pull away from my 197? No. Same applies to Freds Dynacup, he said he wasn't 100% happy with the set-up on the day but I was all over him.

 

[Jonny1*2]

Except that it was faked and the 182 was actually faster. Well documented as the owner of the 182 is on here and was present.

a 197 is great but will feel very different to our 172.

is that true Stu?

Warren (force india/brown bear) had a Ph1 172 all stripped out with KW v3 coilovers and brand new RS2's. Could he drive? Yes. Was it good on track? Yes. Could he pull away from my 197? No. Same applies to Freds Dynacup, he said he wasn't 100% happy with the set-up on the day but I was all over him.

Yours wasn't standard though iirc Ste

I've driven both the 197 and 200 cups. Engine feels a bit gutless, but when chasing one in the 182 there isn't really anything in it. The 197/200's are much more planted on track and easier to drive fast imo, but I wouldn't swap my ph2 for one.

 

[alanc1000]

Warren (force india/brown bear) had a Ph1 172 all stripped out with KW v3 coilovers and brand new RS2's. Could he drive? Yes. Was it good on track? Yes. Could he pull away from my 197? No. Same applies to Freds Dynacup, he said he wasn't 100% happy with the set-up on the day but I was all over him.

It warms my heart to read this story, given that brown bear used to have ants in his pants about how crap and slow the 197s were. How did he react to you pulling away from him (other than abandoning this forum?)

 

[Munson]

I don't think he said they were crap and slow. He was (still is I hope) a rational petrol head, able to have some negative opinions of something he owned, yet still like it. He did in fact buy a Clio 200 IYRC, and was still vocal about its deficiencies, as well as it's positives. It's called not being a fanboy.

Plus, once again, grip and lap times do not equal good handling. I love the handling of the 197, but that doesn't mean he had to. I'm sure he would say he had more fun in the slower car.

 

[Simon7929]

My 197 cup, i thought was fast. Then i drove a MEG R26. On paper the 0-60 dash works out about half a second quicker in MEGS favour. Yet on the road the words Tortoise and Hare spring to mind. What i am trying to say is that sometimes certain cars seem so much quicker than others owing to their individual characteristics, yet in reality there's very little difference in performance.

 

[The Fatty]

Except that it was faked and the 182 was actually faster. Well documented as the owner of the 182 is on here and was present.

a 197 is great but will feel very different to our 172.

No way?! Woudl love to be pointed to the relivant thread to see what really went down!

 

[Mr Burns]

I had KW v1 coilovers and removed the rear seats, I was running V12 EVO's at the time. I'm just saying that the Ph1 isn't significantly quicker like some people think. Warren was surprised but pleased, we spent the whole day playing cat and mouse. Then again, we played cat and mouse in his 200 when I had the Ignis.

 

[Ex-User (19928)]

In fairness neither is going to be massively faster than the other. Lots of Ph1s have worn parts that need replacing, I imagine a Ph1 with a fresh setup and good rubber will be just as capable as a 197.

 

[theduck]

is that true Stu?

Yep, owned by a certain racing driver on here...