Slight crunch going into 3rd gear at speed

[jesus]

It's only happened a couple of times but when I'm really giving it some stick, going from 2nd to 3rd, it gave off a bit of a crunching noise but went into gear fine and no other problems. Most of the time it doesn't do it, but on a long drive last week it did it and just on the motorway today it did too.

Is it anything to worry about with it only being every so often?

Thank youuuuu.

 

[Mr R.]

Synchro worn.

Gearbox rebuild time.

 

[TheEvilGiraffe]

Or slow your gear changes down a tad

 

[172_Tom]

Might be worth replacing the gearbox oil before stumping up for a gearbox rebuild.

 

[Mr Plums]

Mine started to do this a few weeks before my gearbox went, mine was 4th to 5th rather than 2nd to 3rd tho.

 

[jesus]

Bloody hell! Roughly how much is a gearbox rebuild? I have no idea how to take it off or anything. I'll change the oil first I reckon though.

 

[Mr R.]

Oil will not fix worn part's.

It's your money though.

 

[172_Tom]

Bloody hell! Roughly how much is a gearbox rebuild? I have no idea how to take it off or anything. I'll change the oil first I reckon though.

Depends what needs replacing - there are other bits in there that can fail and may be worth doing while the box is in bits (bearings, selectors...). If you plan on keeping the car and changing the oil doesn't cure it then I'd get it rebuilt and any worn parts in there replaced. If you're not planning on keeping it then I'd just change the oil and avoid fast gear changes at high rpm.
The gearbox oil you should use is "Elf Tranself NFJ 75W-80".

 

[172_Tom]

Oil will not fix worn part's.
It's your money though.

Agreed, but it might fix it (or at least improve it) if the gearbox is low on oil or has the wrong oil in. Of course it's also possible the damage has already been done and it won't make a difference - only way to find out is to try it! For the cost of the gearbox oil vs the cost of a rebuild I think it's probably worth a go.

 

[jesus]

Depends what needs replacing - there are other bits in there that can fail and may be worth doing while the box is in bits (bearings, selectors...). If you plan on keeping the car and changing the oil doesn't cure it then I'd get it rebuilt and any worn parts in there replaced. If you're not planning on keeping it then I'd just change the oil and avoid fast gear changes at high rpm.
The gearbox oil you should use is "Elf Tranself NFJ 75W-80".

Excellent thank you for that information. Is it easy to change the oil on the gearbox? I've only ever topped it up on my old 172.

 

[Mr R.]

Undo the drain pug in the bottom.

Box holds 3 ltrs.

 

[NorthloopCup]

I 100% guarantee that the dog teeth on 3rd gear and the teeth on the selector ring are fucked. The synchro from experience will be fine. I've stripped enough to find the same problem over and over again.

 

[Mr R.]

I 100% guarantee that the dog teeth on 3rd gear and the teeth on the selector ring are fucked. The synchro from experience will be fine. I've stripped enough to find the same problem over and over again.

As I said, oil won't fix it.

 

[NorthloopCup]

As I said, oil won't fix it.

No mate unfortunately not. It'll help steady it on for a bit with fresh oil as the viscosity of the fresh oil won't have been broken down. Give it a few months though and it'll be back.

 

[fpan]

Is this a "common" issue or caused by bad gear changes?
I am asking as I test drove a RS200 a while ago that had this issue. That was totally f***ed though, you had to press the clutch and wait for ~2s or so before changing gear, otherwise it would always do it (3rd to 4th)!

 

[NorthloopCup]

Is this a "common" issue or caused by bad gear changes?
I am asking as I test drove a RS200 a while ago that had this issue. That was totally f***ed though, you had to press the clutch and wait for ~2s or so before changing gear, otherwise it would always do it (3rd to 4th)!

It's just what comes with age on the jc5 box mate. They don't like fast gearchanges either. The box in the 200 is a different box though and it is a common issue I'm afraid.

 

[jesus]

I 100% guarantee that the dog teeth on 3rd gear and the teeth on the selector ring are fucked. The synchro from experience will be fine. I've stripped enough to find the same problem over and over again.

Will it get gradually worse over time or is it fine to carry on with (for now)? It's only done it twice ever so I'm not too worried about it at the moment but do intend on getting it looked at in the near future.

Also, I have no idea how to get a gearbox off or anything so is there somewhere that will take it all apart, send it off and fit it again? Do normal garages do that?

Thankssss.

 

[imprezaworks]

I would take it somewhere you trust, get them to strip the box (oooh matron) and send it off to Agency transmissions.

Where are you based?

 

[MarkCup]

I had exactly this on my 172 Cup for 30k or so before I finally knackered the gearbox once and for all by driving over a cone at pace at Goodwood.

It only ever happened when I was really rushing the change on track so I just slowed them down and lived with it.

 

[jesus]

I would take it somewhere you trust, get them to strip the box (oooh matron) and send it off to Agency transmissions.

Where are you based?

North West, Manchester area.

 

[imprezaworks]

If it was me, either keep an eye on things or take it too someone off here, Birchdown, get them to take the box out and re fit. Worth a call

 

[NorthloopCup]

Will it get gradually worse over time or is it fine to carry on with (for now)? It's only done it twice ever so I'm not too worried about it at the moment but do intend on getting it looked at in the near future.

Also, I have no idea how to get a gearbox off or anything so is there somewhere that will take it all apart, send it off and fit it again? Do normal garages do that?

Thankssss.

Yeah it'll just get gradually worse mate over time. If it's only done it twice I wouldn't be worrying about it at all for a good few months though.
How many miles has it covered?

 

[jesus]

Yeah it'll just get gradually worse mate over time. If it's only done it twice I wouldn't be worrying about it at all for a good few months though.
How many miles has it covered?

It's on 99800ish now! I want to keep it going for as long as possible so will definitely get it done. Thanks for your help.

 

[NorthloopCup]

It's on 99800ish now! I want to keep it going for as long as possible so will definitely get it done. Thanks for your help.

No worries mate! Just to put it into perspective for you cost wise, 3rd gear from Renault is about £60. If it needs other parts your looking at around £70 for 4th, £170 for the 1st and 2nd gear kit (they've changed the design so you can't just replace individual gears - w*****s!) and £160 for bearings/seals.
It can soon get expensive! Martin @agency transmissions is running low on his stock pile of gears too, so once they're gone he's gonna have to put his prices up for rebuilds I'd imagine.

 

[jesus]

No worries mate! Just to put it into perspective for you cost wise, 3rd gear from Renault is about £60. If it needs other parts your looking at around £70 for 4th, £170 for the 1st and 2nd gear kit (they've changed the design so you can't just replace individual gears - w*****s!) and £160 for bearings/seals.
It can soon get expensive! Martin @agency transmissions is running low on his stock pile of gears too, so once they're gone he's gonna have to put his prices up for rebuilds I'd imagine.

Since I can't take it out or put it back in, and due to the fact they are pretty far away, I can see this being an expensive job

 

[Brett]

I had exactly this on my 172 Cup for 30k or so before I finally knackered the gearbox once and for all by driving over a cone at pace at Goodwood.

It only ever happened when I was really rushing the change on track so I just slowed them down and lived with it.

Mine does it if I rush the second to third change but it's fine as long as you don't drive like you're in the Fast and the Furious.

 

[NorthloopCup]

Since I can't take it out or put it back in, and due to the fact they are pretty far away, I can see this being an expensive job 😧

Bring it to me and I'll do the lot mate.

 

[Tim.]

My 60k Trophy sometimes refuses to go into third when down-shifting from fourth while driving 'enthusiastically'.
Not mastered heel-and-toe yet (pedal still to be fitted) but always try and rev-match, and the odd occasion it doesn't slot home it really ruins the flow.

Gearbox oil has been changed but with no discernible difference.

Is it the same or a similar root cause as Jamie (OP), and is it foolish to keep pushing the box to breaking point, or should I get it sorted now (from a cost/collateral damage perspective)?

Quaife-time when it does get done

 

[jesus]

Bring it to me and I'll do the lot mate.

You're less than a couple of hours away but not sure if serious or not... :grin:

How long would the job take roughly?

 

[The Russian.]

Bring it to me and I'll do the lot mate.

Proper effort there mate [emoji106]

 

[NorthloopCup]

You're less than a couple of hours away but not sure if serious or not... :grin:

How long would the job take roughly?

Yeah serious mate! Time wise your looking at however long it takes to strip the box and Renault to get me the bits really. If needs be I can fit my spare box and send you on your way back home, then when yours is ready to go, you come back down and I do the swap over.
Just means your still mobile that way. If you allowed 2 weeks, that would give Renault enough time to get me the bits and me to get it rebuilt.

 

[NorthloopCup]

My 60k Trophy sometimes refuses to go into third when down-shifting from fourth while driving 'enthusiastically'.
Not mastered heel-and-toe yet (pedal still to be fitted) but always try and rev-match, and the odd occasion it doesn't slot home it really ruins the flow.

Gearbox oil has been changed but with no discernible difference.

Is it the same or a similar root cause as Jamie (OP), and is it foolish to keep pushing the box to breaking point, or should I get it sorted now (from a cost/collateral damage perspective)?

Quaife-time when it does get done :smile:

My cup box crunched on blipped 3rd gear downshifts with the old heal and toe so I stopped doing it into 3rd. Lol!

I'd imagine your problem will be the same mate yeah, but yours could well be synchro related as well.

 

[NorthloopCup]

Proper effort there mate [emoji106]

I must need my bumps felt tbh! Lol!

 

[jesus]

Yeah serious mate! Time wise your looking at however long it takes to strip the box and Renault to get me the bits really. If needs be I can fit my spare box and send you on your way back home, then when yours is ready to go, you come back down and I do the swap over.
Just means your still mobile that way. If you allowed 2 weeks, that would give Renault enough time to get me the bits and me to get it rebuilt.

How could I refuse an offer like that?!

I'm going away until the end of the month but when I get back I may be in contact if you're still up for it mate! You're closer than the specialists I usually use too. What a top guy :smiley:

 

[NorthloopCup]

How could I refuse an offer like that?!

I'm going away until the end of the month but when I get back I may be in contact if you're still up for it mate! You're closer than the specialists I usually use too. What a top guy :smiley:

No problem at all mate. If I'm still fighting my own jc5 I'll be declining! Flol!

 

[The Russian.]

I must need my bumps felt tbh! Lol!

I still owe you a few beers mate.

 

[NorthloopCup]

I still owe you a few beers mate.

I'm a Jägermeister man! :wink:

 

[imprezaworks]

Top Cs help right there. Got to love the members on here. In a manly car way obviously

 

[Jekyll]

Bloody hell! Roughly how much is a gearbox rebuild? I have no idea how to take it off or anything. I'll change the oil first I reckon though.

Mine was done by agency transmissions recently after having the same smytoms as you currently have. Luckily my engine and box was out of the car anyway but it was £45 to pallet the gearbox each way and £275 for the rebuild.

Got it back and the cover plate had leaked due to a dodgy seal. Shame as it had just been oiled but new seal in and it was fine. Never got a receipt either. Not really good from a company IMO.

Regardless, I'd still be taking the box to @NorthloopCup

You've only got to look at he's posts & pics and speak to people who've dealt with him to know that he's a genuine guy who knows he's stuff and will sort it out for you with no dramas.

 

[The Russian.]

Mine was done by agency transmissions recently after having the same smytoms as you currently have. Luckily my engine and box was out of the car anyway but it was £45 to pallet the gearbox each way and £275 for the rebuild.

Got it back and the cover plate had leaked due to a dodgy seal. Shame as it had just been oiled but new seal in and it was fine. Never got a receipt either.

Regardless, I'd still be taking the box to @NorthloopCup You've only got to look at he's posts & pics and speak to people who've delay with him to know thatbjes a genuine guy who knows he's stuff.

Martin will send you a receipt of his work mate, he probably just forgot.