CSF25 ClioSport Festival 2025

[DaveL485]

did you have a passenger on board? Your ability to catch up on the brakes didn’t go unnoticed either

Yes I did, I think you did too? I can't believe the way you walked away on the straights.

I've just fitted a new brake setup and was just dialling in to how late I can stand on the brake pedal Took me to the end of the session to get a handle on the uphill braking into the 90° left hander, I was coming off the sweeping right (Church) flat out on the throttle by the apex, and I wasn't lifting off/braking until the back wheel of the car was level with the END of the kerb on the right here I was making the apex, just, but it changed my line then into the 180° right (Rocket) and ran out of session time, fuel, and bravado.

I was just going lap after lap after lap thinking "I can brake later than that". By the end I was terrifying myself

Michelin PS4 225/40/18 and a Brembo conversion on RenaultSport bimetallic discs and EBC yellow stuff.

 

[Flob]

I was similar, if there was no traffic up the hill I was flat until past the apex then hard on the brakes when the car was straight enough. Hit abs once and thought I was going grass cutting.

With some brake tweaks I suspect I could brake even later, maybe even trail brakes into the corner but thats going to take some experimentation and perhaps a crash to disprove 😂

I got it very wrong a couple of years ago and nearly T boned @Sir_Dave, of he wasn't so switched on it would have been nasty. Hence not doing full sends up there if there's traffic anymore.

@Krarl was really catching me on the brakes, his car is heavier so the VX should be as good or better on the brakes and it's really not.

 

[Krarl]

Yes I did, I think you did too? I can't believe the way you walked away on the straights.

I've just fitted a new brake setup and was just dialling in to how late I can stand on the brake pedal Took me to the end of the session to get a handle on the uphill braking into the 90° left hander, I was coming off the sweeping right (Church) flat out on the throttle by the apex, and I wasn't lifting off/braking until the back wheel of the car was level with the END of the kerb on the right here I was making the apex, just, but it changed my line then into the 180° right (Rocket) and ran out of session time, fuel, and bravado.

I was just going lap after lap after lap thinking "I can brake later than that". By the end I was terrifying myself

Michelin PS4 225/40/18 and a Brembo conversion on RenaultSport bimetallic discs and EBC yellow stuff.

View attachment 1755225

I think by the end of the day I was braking around the blue mark🤣

I had a few moments where I thought "I'm going straight here", but DS1.11 got me slowed down just in time🤣 When I had @Sunglasses_Ron in I thought I was gonna overcook it a few times



@Myfanwyi what speeds do you reckon we hit going up into rocket? I was too busy being a mong and following instructions

 

[Mr Trailer Man]

I think by the end of the day I was braking around the blue mark🤣

I had a few moments where I thought "I'm going straight here", but DS1.11 got me slowed down just in time🤣 When I had @Sunglasses_Ron in I thought I was gonna overcook it a few times

View attachment 1755232

@Myfanwyi what speeds do you reckon we hit going up into rocket? I was too busy being a mong and following instructions

Your blue mark is where you want to be braking or a bit before if there's traffic.

I reckon you'd be 110-115mph indicated into there.

 

[Renny 5]

Tough corner I thought!! I did the tight and wide line and didn’t see any difference…. Had to jab the brake before the red mark as I was doing 110mph at the tyre wall on the right.

 

[Brigsy]

Tough corner I thought!! I did the tight and wide line and didn’t see any difference…. Had to jab the brake before the red mark as I was doing 110mph at the tyre wall on the right.

Same, tried all ways and didnt see a massive difference. I could keep the megane flat all the way to the blue and stand on the brakes but it can get lively under braking, and you come up behind other cars really quick around 115mph.

Not sure if its just me or the circuit seems to get slippy in the afternoon. Ive noticed same last few years gets lively later on in the day. Might just be me overdriving the car🤷‍♂️

 

[Renny 5]

Same, tried all ways and didnt see a massive difference. I could keep the megane flat all the way to the blue and stand on the brakes but it can get lively under braking, and you come up behind other cars really quick around 115mph.

Not sure if its just me or the circuit seems to get slippy in the afternoon. Ive noticed same last few years gets lively later on in the day. Might just be me overdriving the car🤷‍♂️

Agreed, it was really hot and probably greasy….. only could do 15min stints but I bet I could’ve ran 28hot on the front and probably push it abit more but I’ll know for next time

 

[Krarl]

Your blue mark is where you want to be braking or a bit before if there's traffic.

I reckon you'd be 110-115mph indicated into there.

Aye there were a few slow 197s out (as usual) and some of the 666 spackas got in the way. Either way it was 4th all the way round church and getting into 5th before the apex on the left hand side

The new ratio box was so much better, the car just needs a bit more oomph to get it out of the corners

 

[Myfanwyi]

I think by the end of the day I was braking around the blue mark🤣

I had a few moments where I thought "I'm going straight here", but DS1.11 got me slowed down just in time🤣 When I had @Sunglasses_Ron in I thought I was gonna overcook it a few times

View attachment 1755232

@Myfanwyi what speeds do you reckon we hit going up into rocket? I was too busy being a mong and following instructions

Being a mong and following instruction made you so much faster mate, it was - well. Unreal 😂

When you took church properly on the final lap, you headed in to the braking point of rocket at 120-125 give. It was mid/high end of the revs in 5th and I know you've got a megane 5th in that box of yours. The gripper diff is mega, car is mega. Driver - getting better.

Same again at Combe?

 

[Krarl]

Being a mong and following instruction made you so much faster mate, it was - well. Unreal 😂

When you took church properly on the final lap, you headed in to the braking point of rocket at 120-125 give. It was mid/high end of the revs in 5th and I know you've got a megane 5th in that box of yours. The gripper diff is mega, car is mega. Driver - getting better.

Same again at Combe?

No Megane 5th in this box

Deffo, I wanna jump in as passenger at Combe. At the last 5 CSFs I think I've been a passenger twice🤣

 

[Diamond Performance]

No idea on actual speeds , my speedo was reading was reading 60mph , LOL, guess being 32 years old and abused it is fair to say it needs some attention..
flat in 5th in the old MX5 going up to Rocket....
If I took a wide line in I could get it nice and straight before standing on the brakes , If I took a tighter line in before braking it was like riding a smackhead on payday, pretty fast, then pretty violent, then calm around Rocket...
braking into Rocket is where I make up most of my lap time around the circuit.. and probably why the Flag marshall has claimed for tennis elbow with the blue flag..

Afternoon session really do feel greasy because you don't have the tyre cooling of going upto the hairpin and back, tyres take some hammer and feel like they are losing grip but usually just getting hot on the left, cooler on the right... great fun though..

 

[Cub.]

Back in the old flamer, it started raining and I was on the direzzas. Lost it on Church, and went grass cutting.



14 mins into this, off I go sideways….

 

[Sunglasses_Ron]

I think by the end of the day I was braking around the blue mark🤣

I had a few moments where I thought "I'm going straight here", but DS1.11 got me slowed down just in time🤣 When I had @Sunglasses_Ron in I thought I was gonna overcook it a few times

View attachment 1755232

@Myfanwyi what speeds do you reckon we hit going up into rocket? I was too busy being a mong and following instructions

I absolutely loved the laps. Didnt feel like you were anywhere close to overcooking on the approach to that corner.

 

[Myfanwyi]

No Megane 5th in this box

Deffo, I wanna jump in as passenger at Combe. At the last 5 CSFs I think I've been a passenger twice🤣

👀 What? Oookay, maybe it was more then.

Passenger...

 

[DaveL485]

@Krarl was really catching me on the brakes, his car is heavier so the VX should be as good or better on the brakes and it's really not.

Brakes are all about tyres. You can only brake as much as the tyre will grip. I was well impressed with mine for a fat Clio on road tyres tbh.

Unless of course your tyres have more grip then your brakes will brake.

And therein we have the viscious circle of upgrading stuff usually limited by budget!

 

[Krarl]

Brakes are all about tyres. You can only brake as much as the tyre will grip. I was well impressed with mine for a fat Clio on road tyres tbh.

Unless of course your tyres have more grip then your brakes will brake.

And therein we have the viscious circle of upgrading stuff usually limited by budget!

I said to @Flob he needs to get a bit better tyre on his car

Road tyres don't do the car much justice

 

[Flob]

Back in the old flamer, it started raining and I was on the direzzas. Lost it on Church, and went grass cutting.



14 mins into this, off I go sideways….

Its because you lifted, mine tried to do that in the dry when I lifted there, was a very unwelcome feeling

 

[andybond]

Brakes are all about tyres. You can only brake as much as the tyre will grip. I was well impressed with mine for a fat Clio on road tyres tbh.

Unless of course your tyres have more grip then your brakes will brake.

And therein we have the viscious circle of upgrading stuff usually limited by budget!

HOLD MY BEER

 

[Flob]

Brakes are all about tyres. You can only brake as much as the tyre will grip. I was well impressed with mine for a fat Clio on road tyres tbh.

Unless of course your tyres have more grip then your brakes will brake.

And therein we have the viscious circle of upgrading stuff usually limited by budget!

100% Its a combo - mine has a fair bit of weight at the back and I don't think the rear brakes are doing enough, it has the most awful abs system too - if you hit the brakes too hard/quickly it freaks out and goes into 'ice mode' where it essentially cuts braking effort to the rears and the pedal goes super hard, its very disconcerting at 120!! But its cat and mouse, likely with proper track tyres the silly ABS would have been far happier.

I know I wasn't flat at the first green line drawn below because @Myfanwyi was giving me the universal pussyole go full throttle you gimp gesture with his hand, but I was flat by the 2nd green line then hard on the brakes from around 2nd orange line when the car was straight. My speedo was reading 120 by there, I wish I could be braking at the blue line!!

First orange line is a stab of brakes that I don't think I really needed, in the dry the car was very stable around that area of the track and I suspect could have been going a lot faster.



I'm going to chuck the ABS in the bin and fit a comp brake balance bar setup so I can adjust bias to get more rear effort in the dry.

Regardless, by the afternoon I was faster than I've been before thanks to the weather and finally dropping my tyre pressures low enough!

 

[andybond]

100% Its a combo - mine has a fair bit of weight at the back and I don't think the rear brakes are doing enough, it has the most awful abs system too - if you hit the brakes too hard/quickly it freaks out and goes into 'ice mode' where it essentially cuts braking effort to the rears and the pedal goes super hard, its very disconcerting at 120!! But its cat and mouse, likely with proper track tyres the silly ABS would have been far happier.

Are your tyres mismatched? Or one pair newer than the other?
Its that or your ABS system is up the creek.

I have had this on a set of knackered 52s with spanking new ones on the rear.

 

[Cub.]

Its because you lifted, mine tried to do that in the dry when I lifted there, was a very unwelcome feeling

It was because it was wet my good man.

I wasn’t driving it any different to the first 14 minutes of that video.

The only thing that was different, was it was raining. Hence the wipers.

 

[Tighten My Nuts]

I can see you issue clearly now @Flob .

You created your own track. How did you manage that without the marshals pulling you off?

 

[Krarl]

100% Its a combo - mine has a fair bit of weight at the back and I don't think the rear brakes are doing enough, it has the most awful abs system too - if you hit the brakes too hard/quickly it freaks out and goes into 'ice mode' where it essentially cuts braking effort to the rears and the pedal goes super hard, its very disconcerting at 120!! But its cat and mouse, likely with proper track tyres the silly ABS would have been far happier.

I know I wasn't flat at the first green line drawn below because @Myfanwyi was giving me the universal pussyole go full throttle you gimp gesture with his hand, but I was flat by the 2nd green line then hard on the brakes from around 2nd orange line when the car was straight. My speedo was reading 120 by there, I wish I could be braking at the blue line!!

First orange line is a stab of brakes that I don't think I really needed, in the dry the car was very stable around that area of the track and I suspect could have been going a lot faster.

View attachment 1755357

I'm going to chuck the ABS in the bin and fit a comp brake balance bar setup so I can adjust bias to get more rear effort in the dry.

Regardless, by the afternoon I was faster than I've been before thanks to the weather and finally dropping my tyre pressures low enough!

The green part wasn't even on the layout mate 😂

Church corner is bottom right, you were deffo carrying some speed through there though, I think we we're evenly paced... right until the braking zone and I was like

 

[Jonnio]

I can see you issue clearly now @Flob .

You created your own track. How did you manage that without the marshals pulling you off?

He's driving on the infield section? 😆

 

[Flob]

Are your tyres mismatched? Or one pair newer than the other?
Its that or your ABS system is up the creek.

I have had this on a set of knackered 52s with spanking new ones on the rear.

No the tyres are all the same age/type/date code. Although my fronts and rears are staggered.

But its a well known issue with the VX. Its physically the same ABS block as yours but the ABS controller is different, lots of people upgrade to yours but is a £1000 job and ice mode still exists just much much later.

Its mad they fitted this - yours has a 4 channel abs controller, so can brake/unlock each wheel individually... the VX is 2 channel so unlocks bother fronts or both wheels together!! Its terrible and was something Lotus did to differentiate the cars, probably find on the road but on track its more dangerous than anything.

 

[Flob]

The green part wasn't even on the layout mate 😂

Church corner is bottom right, you were deffo carrying some speed through there though, I think we we're evenly paced... right until the braking zone and I was like
View attachment 1755359

f**king hell haha - your right, I was thinking that all looked very tight wait a min

 

[Flob]

This makes more sense.

@Krarl before your tutor session I was pulling away after church but you would immediately catch me on the brakes, I suspect after your session you would have been quicker all the way up there than me.

 

[Flob]

It was because it was wet my good man.

I wasn’t driving it any different to the first 14 minutes of that video.

The only thing that was different, was it was raining. Hence the wipers.

I can see its raining thank you chuckles. Amused me that the moment you lifted the car went - nope, this is physics b**ch! I would have enjoyed hearing this going round, can't believe you sold it!

 

[Fantastic Nostrils]

FWIW you boys would almost definitely have been doing more than 110 before rocket!

I peeked down a few times and my speedo was showing just a smidge over 110 in the compact. It ever so slightly over-reads (75 indicated is 70gps).

Im pretty sure some borrowed Meta Raybans should show that too actually.

Oh, and the Compact was fully flat all the way into rocket. Pussys.

 

[Fantastic Nostrils]

I can see its raining thank you chuckles. Amused me that the moment you lifted the car went - nope, this is physics b**ch! I would have enjoyed hearing this going round, can't believe you sold it!

Wait, @Cub. had a flamer?

 

[Flob]

I can see you issue clearly now @Flob .

You created your own track. How did you manage that without the marshals pulling you off?

If I could edit it out I would Mark. Don't think this minor misreading of a map is going to distract people from your wheel nearly falling off!

 

[Flob]

Wait, @Cub. had a flamer?

Has he not mentioned it to you 8000 times tougher with expressing his sincere regret at ever selling it? And for your next question - yes he did fit in it.

 

[Tighten My Nuts]

If I could edit it out I would Mark. Don't think this minor misreading of a map is going to distract people from your wheel nearly falling off!

F**k.

 

[Flob]

F**k.

The way you immediately blames Shaun had me laughing - SHAUN - YOU NEARLY KILLED US SHAUN, I thought Shaun was about to walk home in a rage

He 100% didn't torque that wheel though, powder coat or not, that singular wheel had all 5 bolts 2 threads away from falling out.

 

[Fantastic Nostrils]

Guys can you all be nicer to Mark please, it was his first trackday.

 

[andybond]

No the tyres are all the same age/type/date code. Although my fronts and rears are staggered.

But its a well known issue with the VX. Its physically the same ABS block as yours but the ABS controller is different, lots of people upgrade to yours but is a £1000 job and ice mode still exists just much much later.

Its mad they fitted this - yours has a 4 channel abs controller, so can brake/unlock each wheel individually... the VX is 2 channel so unlocks bother fronts or both wheels together!! Its terrible and was something Lotus did to differentiate the cars, probably find on the road but on track its more dangerous than anything.

Fair comment. I completely looked over this.

If your going in for a grand might as well do £2600 with this : https://www.scs-delta.co.uk/product-page/delta-motorsport-abs

I know it works very, very well.

 

[RustyMojo]

Mini would only just get to 100mph up there and the Cayman would be pulling 115, before having to brake. Be interesting next year in the new Cayman!

 

[Flob]

Fair comment. I completely looked over this.

If your going in for a grand might as well do £2600 with this : https://www.scs-delta.co.uk/product-page/delta-motorsport-abs

I know it works very, very well.

Exactly! Knew you would be onboard

 

[Flob]

Guys can you all be nicer to Mark please, it was his first trackday.

Jokes aside I'm amazed that this is the first time to my knowledge his Cayman has been recovered off track given the number of miles it must have done on track and that fact he looked at me like an alien when I asked if he torqued his own wheel bolts.

"Me, dirty my gloves, I think not you peasant looking troll" - was what I think he said to me. Bit rude now I look back.

 

[Mr Trailer Man]

Just come to look for my tyre pressure gauge and can't find it anywhere.

I think I've left it at Anglesey hanging on one of the power outlets 🤦🏻‍♂️