144BHP!!!

[clean16v]

got rolling roaded today. 144bhp at the flywheel, mods are;


Mongoose straight through exhaust with de-cat pipe
piperX induction kit with home made heat shield
Stage one hill power chip
but, how did the guy give me a flywheel power from a rolling road?? also, the graph he gave me had no labels, it was just a line on a graph. he said he will mess about with my ignition advance etc. and should be able to increase power

 

[Matty]

He would have multiplied the wheels figure by 1.15 like mine did to count for transmission loss.

Mine worked out at 148bhp at flywheel, just over 126 at wheels with just Magnex cat back and BMC CDA fitted. Suprised with your chip its not more, unless the open IK does not help.

 

[clean16v]

talking about IKs, viper have just started to do universal viper kits, does anyone know if they are still to big for the 16V?? i really want one

 

[clean16v]

and how difficult is it to attach the BMC CDA? take it it was a home made jobbby?

 

[viceroy]

I thought they calculated the power at the wheels on the RR run then when the engine slows down by itself they are able to calculate the losses that way and give you a pretty accurate FW reading

 

[clean16v]

he let it slow down. he caned first let it slow, caned second, let it slow etc. up til fourth were he let revs drop to 900 and rdlined it.

 

[maciek]

doing it on first second and third wos nat really needed
if you can, try making runs on different gears and see the ifference in power and torque.

tthen its important to pick the engine speed accurately - best would be not from rev meter read-out - which is not very accurate, but from wiring... calculating from gear ratios is also quite difficult - because you have to measure real circ. of your wheel to get accurate. Easy step is to go to your friendly renault dealer link to the computer, rev it to the limiter a couple of times, and check when it comes. then make sure that on RR it cuts out on the same revs (calculated by RR)
all these things create small differences that sum up and can become quite big

WHEN ON RR ASK FOR:

lamda read-out.

power at wheels graph and values - this is the most important thing - most accurate and gives real idea of how your car goes. there is less posibility to tamper with the results (it is often one click to make power go up or down significantly - its all the matter of RR software afterall)

if you want an idea of est. power at the flywheel ask for transmission losses graph

its best if you get combined - power at wheels+transmission losses+power at flywheel +torqe data.... or even better divided - power at engine+torque and power at wheels+trans.loss+power at flywheel - ask for possibly similar scale...

cheers and good read-outs

 

[clean16v]

anyone?? why is the power so low for the mods i had done?? viper?

 

[Matbrown]

I dont think its low, seems about right.



Mat.

 

[OutKa5t]

figure sounds right to me too...

 

[coolspot007007]

Well ill hopefully be at RE at the end of the months to see what kind of power i have now, I fitted my CDA today too. Its better than the old piperX performance wise but i miss the noise.

 

[Leigh]

Id say it was about right as well !! But what the fook do i know

 

[vibrio]

chips are normally mapped for a standard car (is the hill power one any different ). putting one on with other mods can lose you power.

 

[Paul16V]

Sounds a bit low to me mate.

Got mine done the other week, was 147BHP. This is what I got:

K and N filter,

Decat pipe,

Powerflow backbox.

Not bad for a car with over 60K on it and ten years old .

Mines not chipped or anything but will be next week hopefully. Does that mean its runnin well??

 

[clean16v]

hello eveyone! this is a bit of an old topic! since then i have had my car RRd at RE in Bury and managed a very healthy 122bhp at wheels! so nearly 150bhp at fly. engine is being ripped out in a month for major surgery so hopefully hit 150bhp at wheels? Maybe?

 

[Ben j]

122 isnt 150 at fly

 

[maciek]

i was once RRed with 120ps@wheels. and using appr. transmission losses from slowing down, it showed 131@fly funny isnt it?

 

[Paul16V]

Mine was like 112 at the wheels and 147 at the fly. Gettin it chipped this week sometime i think though so should help a bit. Anyone here got a star chip?

 

[bondy]

bhp is a funny thing mine had 147.6 bhp at the flywheel with standard exhaust, cat and ecu. but a pipercross airfilter and pbv, and kent fast road cams. then i had it chipped stage 2 and a free flow exhaust and the power went up to 150bhp not much of a gain is it.

 

[coolspot007007]

Quote: Originally posted by bondy on 02 February 2003

bhp is a funny thing mine had 147.6 bhp at the flywheel with standard exhaust, cat and ecu. but a pipercross airfilter and pbv, and kent fast road cams. then i had it chipped stage 2 and a free flow exhaust and the power went up to 150bhp not much of a gain is it.

Was that at the same same rolling road? And did you get a big increase in torque rather than bhp? Cos my set up doesnt feel theres much more bhp, but more torquey.

 

[Ben j]

look how different everyones calculated fly figures are!

pointless usin em!

just go by what u have at the wheels!



i have 127!

 

[paddymph]

is the best thing to always go back to the SAME rollin road then, and use that as a constant?

 

[Matbrown]

YES! The only thing you can do.



Mat.

 

[Matbrown]

And even then atmospheric conditions will be different!



Mat.

 

[adiclio16v]

mine made 137 @ wheels at r.e yesterday

seems its a good en and ken was impressed with it

 

[coolspot007007]

was that the Willy engine?

 

[Nick Read]

hehe I feel I must address your two points clean16v -

firstly 144 is a nice figure but you *cannot* compare it in any way to anyone elses results, not even at the same rolling road. There are so many different and inaccurate ways of calculating flywheel power that its impossible. The only real comparison is quarter miling the car, although you can use your 144 figure as a rough guide to how your mods are working as and when you do them....eg say as the moment it makes 144 then you do the head and cams and find that the new figure (at the same ambient temperature) is 155 then you know youve made a gain which is around 11 bhp.

as far as universal viper kits go the only thing that you can say about universal kits for anything is that they are guaranteed to *not quite* fit on *every* car! You always could use a Viper on a 16v if you could get a throttle body adapter made up. So the universal kit is pretty much just a normal Viper with no special adapter, so you have to make your own!

 

[clean16v]

mailto:122BHP@wheels">122BHP@wheels if divided by 0.825 for transmision loss shows mailto:148BHP@Fly">148BHP@Fly. depends how you calculate it though.

 

[Ben j]

means i have 154 bhp if thats correct

 

[clean16v]

just going off what i have been told mate. 0.8 is very optimistic and 0.85 is very conservative so i use .825

 

[Nick Read]

We did a rolling road last year and every single Clio came out of it with a different transmission loss, it varied between something like 15% and 35%. Obviously the idea that all of these wildly different trans losses were genuinely measured is a nonsense...as long as you stick to comparing your Clio with itself and use the same RR every time you cant really go wrong. If you want a comparison with others, the best way is to attend a RR shootout and see how it fares on the day.

One way to level out all the different crazy results youll get at different rolling roads is to only look at power at the wheels rather than calculated by the rolling road computer.