172 Cams, ITB's and OMEX HEEEELP!!!

[172exclusive]

Hi guys, as im currently working overseas for a year and my 172 is tucked away in the garage at home i thought when i get back she could have some presents.
thinking about going down the ITB's Omex and cams route. im planning to go for jenvey itbs and was wondering what ppl thought the best cams to go for with these mods... i was thinking about schrick cams but everywhere i read on this ppl are always talking about cat cams so im a bit unsure now.
this will be going on the car which has 182 manifold decat and yozzasport 2.5inch race system. also has ecu remap and KnN but those will be going away i presume as soon as ITB's and Omex say helloooo.

Merry Christmas everyone. any thoughts will be greatly apprecitated
Thanks

 

[Nick r26r]

i think throttle bodies are over priced IMO for such a small jump of 20-30bhp , why not just get it turbo'd for that sort of money , bb tuning now called engine dynamics do a kit on e bay cheap , at least if u get bored of the power you can always up it by bolting a bigger turbo on or upping the boost with better internals obviously, thats just my oppinion though, http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Renault-Clio-...arts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item19b8b69d2e

 

[Andyman]

Hi guys, as im currently working overseas for a year and my 172 is tucked away in the garage at home i thought when i get back she could have some presents.
thinking about going down the ITB's Omex and cams route. im planning to go for jenvey itbs and was wondering what ppl thought the best cams to go for with these mods... i was thinking about schrick cams but everywhere i read on this ppl are always talking about cat cams so im a bit unsure now.
this will be going on the car which has 182 manifold decat and yozzasport 2.5inch race system. also has ecu remap and KnN but those will be going away i presume as soon as ITB's and Omex say helloooo.

Merry Christmas everyone. any thoughts will be greatly apprecitated
Thanks

For the cost of all that you'd be far better Supercharging. Wont be far off the cost plus will have bags more future potential

 

[Nick r26r]

might be worth trying these guys , they have a real good rep with the peugeot and citroen guys , and are cheap , http://www.mtechautomotive.co.uk/throttle-bodies/

 

[172Ben]

Supercharger.

Done

 

[172exclusive]

You guys really think the supercharger is the way forward even when im using it as my everyday car??? kinda worries me with reliability...if so which place do people think is the place to do the work?

 

[DMS]

Everyone bums the supercharger on here TBH. However, you have to weigh up the pro's and con's of each.

ITB's - sound awesome, keep the engine normally aspirated. Cheapest option, although with an Omex and high comp internals as well it'll bump the price up to a similar level as a supercharger. Might get around 230bhp tops from ITB's.

Supercharger - sounds awesome, massive gains in power and the potential for more by upgrading to forged internals etc. Apparently up to 400bhp is possible with fully forged internals and an aftermarket ECU although I don't know of any 1*2's making anywhere near that yet. You'll get around 250-260bhp with RSTuning's conversion which leaves the engine internals standard. A forged bottom end would bump up the cost a lot but would see more power. No turbo lag either, which is good.

Turbo - Loads more power than standard. The most powerful 1*2 turbo I know of is almost 300bhp but the engine does have the potential for a lot more (see Scoff's R5 with F4R turbo lump). Doesn't sound quite as good as the supercharger IMO and it does cost a lot more (at the moment), but the torque gains are immense. There's a general concensus on here between those who have never driven a turbo'd 1*2 that they'll have bad turbo lag, will chew tyres and will be unreliable - not true.

/can of worms.

 

[sideways danny]

Everyone bums the supercharger on here TBH. However, you have to weigh up the pro's and con's of each.

ITB's - sound awesome, keep the engine normally aspirated. Cheapest option, although with an Omex and high comp internals as well it'll bump the price up to a similar level as a supercharger. Might get around 230bhp tops from ITB's.

Supercharger - sounds awesome, massive gains in power and the potential for more by upgrading to forged internals etc. Apparently up to 400bhp is possible with fully forged internals and an aftermarket ECU although I don't know of any 1*2's making anywhere near that yet. You'll get around 250-260bhp with RSTuning's conversion which leaves the engine internals standard. A forged bottom end would bump up the cost a lot but would see more power. No turbo lag either, which is good.

Turbo - Loads more power than standard. The most powerful 1*2 turbo I know of is almost 300bhp but the engine does have the potential for a lot more (see Scoff's R5 with F4R turbo lump). Doesn't sound quite as good as the supercharger IMO and it does cost a lot more (at the moment), but the torque gains are immense. There's a general concensus on here between those who have never driven a turbo'd 1*2 that they'll have bad turbo lag, will chew tyres and will be unreliable - not true.

/can of worms.

interesting points, fairly well balanced views, but a few things worth considering also.....

ITBs can be tuned to give factory economy if done well, and NA is often easier to manage if you're doing track work.

Turbos - again, all down to execution. Lag ridden setups are normally down to bad ECU calibration (although getting the mech spec wrong wont help)

Supercharging with a rotrex - massively misunderstood. normally approached as if it's the same as a turbo, but it's more like NA with double the CC. Again ECU calibration is key. some people can get torque, and some are scared of ignition timing.

 

[DanFreemanPhoto]

^ we will have to have a good chin wag soon Danny, I'm seriously considering the SC kit next year if all goes well at my job review, so i'll seen a bit of advice!

 

[sideways danny]

any time

 

[K-Tec Racing]

ITBs give amazing response, very drivable and have an "instant" feel to the throttle. as Dan correctly says, economy on a run is about 330 miles to a tank at 85mph approx, round town stop start is about 300 miles. will give 190-200 bhp on std engines.

Just finished doing the test calibration for the KTR Sport low boost turbo kit and it drives really well, better than a std car now, cold starts are perfect even in this weather. has give at 0.55bar of boost 232 lb ft and 231bhp, very smooth and easy to use. Great gains from a low prices kit.

Rotrex supercharged kits are very linear in power delivery. As they are boosting all the time as they are belt driven the engine reaction time is excellent. As said there is no lag and as Dan points out they feel like a larger engined car, not a boosted one. I personally love the way these drive as they make more boost the more you rev them and therfore have a more predictable power delivery.

All three options have their merits, and they are not just about power. We have had customers drive all three types of car and choose ITB's as they personally prefer the way they drive.

We will have all three options available at work to try....

Andy
KTR Sport

 

[172Ben]

Would love a drive of a S/C car!

I love my ITB's, the noise is immense. Changes the whole way the car drives, low down power aswell.

 

[Brian172]

I think the only way you'll tell what you want is to have a drive in the options your interested in.

 

[sideways danny]

I think the only way you'll tell what you want is to have a drive in the options your interested in.

i've driven all the common options, and i change my mind what i want about 3 times a week

 

[Brian172]

i've driven all the common options, and i change my mind what i want about 3 times a week

lol, ive only driven a low pressure turbo and liked that.
Im leanin towards cams and itb's myself though, but need a drive to really see tbh.

 

[172Ben]

i've driven all the common options, and i change my mind what i want about 3 times a week

In terms of money though, which would you go for?

 

[sideways danny]

well money's more than the cost of the conversion, running costs need to be thought about. bang for buck it's got to be a supercharger, but ITBs with cams is a very strong option IMO as you can get standard economy out of it. with a blower i'd use it.

 

[Nick r26r]

if it was me i would go for cams , i have just bought a set for my 172 , also bought a second hand head that is getting sent away as soon as i receive it to be played with and some new valve springs , i should see between 190-200bhp i would of thought , and all this is gonna cost me about £700 ish + a reamp , where as omex throttle bodies are 3k ish for around 200-215bhp !!!! i know what i would go for , but if money isnt a issue S/C or turbo , I am thinking of turbo'ing the clio if the engine ever pops !!!!

 

[Matt@Stealthsport]

Personal opinion here but it appears that is costs roughly £100 per 1 bhp to tune a Clio 1*2 when your talking about S/C, Turbo's or Throttle body's and to me it seems a waste of money when there are many other cars out there that can be tuned far more easily.......

Clio's are great handling cars and are much more fun if there setup right and not made into mini dragsters etc.

I will get slated for saying this but as I said this is just my personal opinion.

 

[172Ben]

I think if i was to start again, with the clio.

Id fit a 1.8t vag engine.

 

[sideways danny]

I think if i was to start again, with the clio.

Id fit a 1.8t vag engine.

aweful. nasty. bad

 

[DMS]

I think whichever option you go for you'll be happy with it. 200ish bhp in a Clio makes it very quick no matter which setup you go for. I grin like a wanking Jap every time I drive mine and it's not running anywhere near full boost yet.

 

[172Ben]

aweful. nasty. bad

I love it as it is though!

 

[Matt@Stealthsport]

I think whichever option you go for you'll be happy with it. 200ish bhp in a Clio makes it very quick no matter which setup you go for. I grin like a wanking Jap every time I drive mine and it's not running anywhere near full boost yet.

How much did it cost though?

 

[sideways danny]

How much did it cost though?

you bought a trophy. how much extra was that over a cup, when you removed most of the unique bits. different strokes. People spend on what they want

 

[Matt@Stealthsport]

you bought a trophy. how much extra was that over a cup, when you removed most of the unique bits. different strokes. People spend on what they want

That's not the point I am trying to make I am saying that the 1*2's are very expensive to tune.

 

[sideways danny]

it's getting cheaper and cheaper. development takes time and costs money

 

[DMS]

How much did it cost though?

Loads. But...

a) I can afford to pay for it.
b) I can afford to run it.
c) Yes I could have just brought a faster car, but then it wouldn't surprise anyone. I like my car to feel special in some way.

At the end of the day I don't have any outstanding debts, I have a high disposable income and I'm enjoying it while I still can

 

[Matt@Stealthsport]

Loads. But...

a) I can afford to pay for it.
b) I can afford to run it.
c) Yes I could have just brought a faster car, but then it wouldn't surprise anyone. I like my car to feel special in some way.

At the end of the day I don't have any outstanding debts, I have a high disposable income and I'm enjoying it while I still can

It wasn't a dig at you all I was saying is that there not cheap to get power out of and for the thousands it costs there are other cars out there.

Different stroke for different folks and all that.

 

[DanFreemanPhoto]

How much is a low pressure turbo kit compared to a SC kit?

Do KTEC do a sc kit too?

 

[K-Tec Racing]

How much is a low pressure turbo kit compared to a SC kit?

Do KTEC do a sc kit too?

en route.

Andy
KTR Sport

 

[mini-valver]

Personally in a small hot hatch with a revvy 2.0, I'd ALWAYS go for ITB's and NA. SC looks awesome and of the boosted options, thats the one I'd choose. Its a very personal opinion of what you like/want. For me, I love raw NA engines, so natrally I'd fit bodies. If you like boost, you need to drive a turbo and a SC and choose. The SC kit is so well done though the turbo kit would have to be a more complete package than it is to compete for me.