172 Cup advice

Green George · Jan 30, 2006

Hello

I am looking to buy a 172 cup soon (52 or 03 plate ~ I think) and would appreciate any advice from you guys, things to look out for and general opinions.

I bought a 106 Rallye new in 1998 and sold that last year after it was broken into and the stereo stolen, I replaced it with a 03 Focus St170 and was so disappointed that I sold it a month or so later (at a great loss). I am looking for a drivers car I guess from the same mold as a 106 Rallye which was so much fun and well able to keep up with new cooper S's.

I hear that Renault dealers are best avoided! Can anyone recommend a good garage in the Hemel Hempstead or North London area to work on the Cup.

edde · Jan 30, 2006

Have a look here
No reason to avoid dealers I'd be tempted to go there every time there are bad and good one sbut least you'vbe a better knowedge that they may know what there on about.
GDi or Rentech owners are both members on here and have superb prodct knowedge and i'd personally go there if you want cheaper prices even if there a bit of a drive (cambridge and somewhere else down south for Rentech).
Cups have a rep[utation for being involved in accidents so check for damage no ABS has been a bit problems for owners (although thats bound to start contraversy) although it may also be linked to the cheap price/high performace for money it offers/offered.
Check the electrics work if you have any issues leave a messge on the forum and somoen will be able to assist you.
I'd get an extended Renault warently as well there not cheap but there full warentlies just like normal dealership ones and you can have an extra 2yrs ocver (upto 120k)
See here for common problems
http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=108607

Gaz_ · Jan 30, 2006

cup is a good car, if you want a drivers car, this is it,

have you driven one yet?

oh and not keep up with a cooper s....... pass a cooper s you mean

Green George · Jan 31, 2006

Thanks for the advice guys.

With regard to the warranty advice ~ I spoke to my local Renault garade (Hardings in Bovingdon) who were very helpful but would be unable to other the extrended warranty unless the car was purchased through aRenault delaership. They agreed that a warranty was an excellent idea and suggested either the RAC or AA. The RAC quoted £299 for 1 year or £499 for 2 years on their 5 star cover which seemd wuite good.

With regard to checking the electrics ~ Some of the appeal of a CUP is that it won't be loaded down with electronic kit waiting to go wrong!

I haven't driven one yet as I won't be seriously looking until late spring to early summertime. The comment about the Cooper S was referring to the 106 Rallye not the Cup! The point being that I hope that the Cup is as much fun as the Rallye whilst being a Q car.

I will be looking for a standard Cup without mods probably from someone on this site, as it is obviously run by and for enthusiasts without too much influence from the Max Power brigade.

With regard to the prices I will watch with interest as I think they will fall further, between now and the summer. There are apparently alot of similar spec cars (You just have to look here and in pistonheads, autotrader and ebay ~ alot of the Ebay cars aren't even attracting bids!) that are competing for a very few real buyers, as opposed to dreamers which is evidenced by the couple of Cups that are advertised at the moment well below £7K when they started out being advertised only a few weeks ago above that figure i.e. the one in Sothampton and the chap who has to go to Canada; I really feel sorry for them and would not want to be in their postion as they stand to take a big hit on both cars. I have also been there and had the exact same problem with my ST170; the market was full of them with similar specs and mileage and in order to get a quick sale you need a good standard car priced at the lower end of the market to ensure it stands out; with the ST170 I took a hit of nearly £2K!
On one of the other posts for the Southampton car someone expressed the opinion that he believed the prices will not go below £6.5K, I have to disagree it is a buyers market per se with almost any comodity at the moment and in their position I would snap the hand off someone offering a genuine 6K and have done with it. If that person has really been offered £6.5 from a dealer he should take it, because in my experience (i.e. with St170) it is highly unlikely that a dealer would offer more than £6K at the moment as they will know what the market is doing and where it is going.

trailerparktrev · Jan 31, 2006

Buy this month's Evo magazine. There's 6 pages of advice if you're in the market for a 172.

GarethM · Jan 31, 2006

hey dude welcome
good luck cup hunting

Green George · Jan 31, 2006

I subscribe to EVO and received a copy this morning. It was a good buyers guide (one of the only reasons I still subscribe to EVO is their guides) although the prices for the three cars seemed a bit steep judging from what I have seen on this site, autotrader and pistonheads.

Anyway thanks for taking time to post a message and the warm welcome!

MarkCup · Jan 31, 2006

Welcome to the site and good luck with your hunting...

As far as who to have look after it...I'd suggest (as would many members on here) using Mike at Rentech. He used to work at a Renault dealership, but has now set-up on his own.

It'll take you 2 hours to drive down and see him, but look in the "Dealers" section of the forum and you'll see plenty of positive feedback from people who have travelled even further than that.

He looked after mine while at the dealership, and now looks after mine as an independant...I would never take it anywhere else and trust him implicitly (just don't challenge him to a game of Hold'em LOL).

From what you've said the Cup is the car for you...just make sure you get a standard (or near to standard) one; the balance is superb...then get it on track to find out what they're really capable of

Green George · Jan 31, 2006

Hi Mark

Thank you for your comments. I have also been recommended GDI near Cambridge who are a bit closer to me, but I would definitely consider Ren-Tech as well; they are both apparently very professional and enthusiasts so i gueess it would boil down to costs.

On that subject I spoke to my local Renault garage today about servicing and other matters and they said they charge £220 all in for a minor service, £260 all in for an intermediate and advised selling the car prior to the five year / 72K service which would cost £400 + £700 for the cam belt change i.e.. at least £1100! At least they were open about it!

Thanks for the comments about the Cup that is just the sort of thing I am looking for. I like the idea of track days but the insurance companies don't seem to like them! Have you done many track days? Who have you done them with?

MarkCup · Jan 31, 2006

I do 6-8 a year, with whoever's running them at tracks that fit in with my diary.

Insurance? Look here...

As for servicing costs...Rentech 12K minor service is circa £135 IIRC - really can't stress this strongly enough...DO NOT LISTEN TO DEALERS...some of them will tell you it only needs a service every 18k.

edde · Jan 31, 2006

Green George said:
With regard to the warranty advice ~ I spoke to my local Renault garade (Hardings in Bovingdon) who were very helpful but would be unable to other the extrended warranty unless the car was purchased through aRenault delaership. They agreed that a warranty was an excellent idea and suggested either the RAC or AA. The RAC quoted £299 for 1 year or £499 for 2 years on their 5 star cover which seemd wuite good.

With regard to checking the electrics ~ Some of the appeal of a CUP is that it won't be loaded down with electronic kit waiting to go wrong!

I will be looking for a standard Cup without mods probably from someone on this site, as it is obviously run by and for enthusiasts without too much influence from the Max Power brigade.

On one of the other posts for the Southampton car someone expressed the opinion that he believed the prices will not go below £6.5K,

Prices will drop as low as the market dicatates prices will drop more though its just like any car maybe they won't loose as much value as they.
The Cup doesn't have the zeons but its still got most of the toys and the electronics are still a huge issue get a Mk1 if you want something with less complex electrics plus you get the better drive by a proper bit of cable throttle body.
You can get the cambelt done cheaper from GDI or Rentech though and least they know what there on about. plus the minor ie 12/24/48/60k services are only about £140 from the above places.
Go see Renault though ask them if you can buy the car if you claim to be the last owner you can have the warently or get the present owner to pay or you go to the garage with them the warently is held on the car not the purchaser.

DH_GTI · Jan 31, 2006

what are the service intervals on the 172 cup ??

CHRIS172CUP · Jan 31, 2006

Welcome to the cup club. You'll love the little blue (or silver) rocket. Had mine for 3 years now and it still delivers a real driving buzz.

As long as you find a mechanically sound example you only have to worry about the odd rattle from the cabin but that all goes out of the window when you start driving.

Hemel's not far from me, I'm in Ware. Don't want to take business away from GDi or Rentech but Darlingtons Renault in Harlow are a very good and hospitable main dealer. There's also Mark Fish in Harlow who is a racing brain.

edde · Jan 31, 2006

Davehughes said:
what are the service intervals on the 172 cup ??

Same as the noraml 172/182
Servicing rules/time/whats done etc (172/182)
http://www.cliosport.net/forum/showthread.php?t=107873

Green George · Jan 31, 2006

Hi Mark
Thanks for the advice and the link. Excuse my ignorance but what does IIRC mean?

Green George · Jan 31, 2006

Hi Edde

I definately want a Cup with it's enhanced suspension and hopefully lower mileage over a Series 2 car (e.g mk 1 172). The Cup flicks my switch!

Green George · Jan 31, 2006

Chris172Cup

I will add Darlingtons Renault in Harlow to my short list!
Thank you.

Andy GDI · Jan 31, 2006

CHRIS172CUP said:
Welcome to the cup club. You'll love the little blue (or silver) rocket. Had mine for 3 years now and it still delivers a real driving buzz.

As long as you find a mechanically sound example you only have to worry about the odd rattle from the cabin but that all goes out of the window when you start driving.

Hemel's not far from me, I'm in Ware. Don't want to take business away from GDi or Rentech but Darlingtons Renault in Harlow are a very good and hospitable main dealer. There's also Mark Fish in Harlow who is a racing brain.

Chris

I agree, we often use Darlingtons for parts, known them for yrs.... not sure if your allowed to watch the car getting serviced.. Mark is cool with it iirc.

p.s. I used to live in Hoe Lane, opposite Presdales.! ;-)

Andy

edde · Jan 31, 2006

Green George said:
I definately want a Cup with it's enhanced suspension and hopefully lower mileage over a Series 2 car (e.g mk 1 172). The Cup flicks my switch!

Aftermarket stuff is much better and the parts are a direct fit (new stock and springs) so I wouldn't use that as a huge issue.

tomehb · Jan 31, 2006

Best to shop around so i think! i brought my privately, an it worked out far cheaper.. took me around a month to find a spotless CUP though :> .. an had to travel to london from shropshire to get it.. but got it quite cheap... ahh cash :>

I have soo much fun in My Cup its mad

sticks to the good dam road though :> Roads around here have to be the best :>

Goodluck!

Ian_182 · Jan 31, 2006

Go and get one mate.There cracking cars and like people say theres less to go wrong.Great colour,alloys and power to match
Also will despatch a cooper s quite well..

ian

MarkCup · Feb 1, 2006

If I Recall Correctly...

AOKCUP · Feb 1, 2006

Had mine 6 months and it puts a smile on my face every moment I'm driving it. I also own a MK1 Escort and come the summer its going to be tough to choose which one to drive on the fantastic windy roads from Merthyr to Brecon.

Go for it, you won't regret it.

Green George · Feb 1, 2006

Mark Thanks for the lesson in computer abbreviations!

Dave H · Feb 1, 2006

I went from a 205 1.9 gti to the Cup.....defo the right choice! The cup is quite a raw car compared to other 172s/coopers etc etc but compared to the pug it was like a Merc!
Going from the 106 Rallye to the Cup should be your best bet.If you've never had ABS the you should know your limits and be sensible when its wet/slippy.

Green George · Feb 1, 2006

I just had a look back over recent 172 CUPS advertised on Ebay and found a nice looking 2002 model with 28K miles (Item # 4606926229) which failed to attract a single bid with a starting price of £5995! I don’t understand why they aren’t selling at that price ~ 6K seems to be good price…

MJD1 · Feb 1, 2006

Green George,

I have recently put my beloved Cup up for Sale.

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/63458.htm

If you really want one you will not be disappointed. Its a very clean example.

Matt

eo52vug · Feb 1, 2006

You could buy my 53 plate cup with 25k for £7200 drop me a pm if you interested . Thanks mark .

Green George · Feb 1, 2006

Hello MJD1 & EO52VUG

Thanks you for your posts. I am realistically looking at later spring early summer to buy a Cup so it is a little early for me; but thank you for taking the time to let me know.

MJD1 ~ I had already seen your car on pistonheads and it does look like a beauty. Unfortunately, I think the price is too high in the current market. If you look around there are a lot of cars with similar mileage that aren't selling at 6.5K let alone 7K plus and in fact there was one on ebay (see my earlier post) with 28K miles on the clock which failed to attract one bid at £5995. Like the old adage goes somtheiumng is onlt worth waht someone will pay you for it. For waht ist is worth the Parker Guide value's your car with 20K miles (14K less than yours) between £7140 and £5480 and the aftermarket suspension is in my opinion not going to strengthen your position as the car is now non-standard.

EO52VUG ~ Like I said earlier it a bit too soon for me to be looking and I wouldn't want to mess you around. Your pricing is closer to the mark for a later car with less miles, but like I said before there are alot cars out there with similar specifications and mileage on the market for alot less ~ so your car would have to be very very special to get noticed.

I am not trying to be the voice of doom! but you have to face facts...
Anyway good luck with selling your cars and I hope you get what you want for them.

James Bushell · Feb 1, 2006

You won't be disapointed.. I do get a bit bored of it from time to time if being driven normally.. BUT when you you give it a good beating when you're in the groove on your favourite lane.. I think you be hard pushed to better it..

Enjoy...

Green George · Feb 1, 2006

Hi James

Really nice photos! Are the first two of your car or from a magazine article? I notivce in the last photo yuo have a aftermarket airfilter. What are the advantages of it and does it affect your warranty and insurance? I sthat your 1.9 205 GTi in the photo? Hopw does that compare to the Cup on the road?

MarkCup · Feb 1, 2006

^^^ sort your lame induction kit out James...

***runs***

davo172cup · Feb 1, 2006

i got 172 cup in silver, ive had it for nearly 2 years now and i still get a massive grin every time i drive it!!!!! just make sure u test drive a 172 full fat as well so u can decide which on u prefer comfort and luxurys of rawness and power. i wanted a raw, no frills speed machine and thats why i went for the cup!!!! u wudnt regret getting one.there amazing cars!!!!

James Bushell · Feb 2, 2006

PMSL.. @ Mark..

James Bushell · Feb 2, 2006

Green George said:
Hi James

Really nice photos! Are the first two of your car or from a magazine article? I notivce in the last photo yuo have a aftermarket airfilter. What are the advantages of it and does it affect your warranty and insurance? I sthat your 1.9 205 GTi in the photo? Hopw does that compare to the Cup on the road?

Hi.. Yep.. that's mine in the photos... the filter is a K&N Gen 2,.. better than the previous K&N as it has a heat sheild.. it makes it a bit quicker as it increases the airflow.. but the biggest difference is the induction noise,, which is what really does it for me..

the 205 belongs to my brother, although i used to have a near identical one before my Scoob about 7/8 years ago.. The Cup will piss all over it 205 in relative speed terms on a lane in both acceleration and can carry far higher speeds through the corners.. however the 205 could be classed as more fun.. as it has lower levels of grip and a far more progressive back end.. so you can really slide the 205 nicely, whereas the CUP is far more snappy, especially on the limit.. It certianly makes for a few exciting moments.. (i.e Breakfast Run..

)...

Green George · Feb 2, 2006

Hi James

Firstly what is PMSL?

Secondly thanks for the reply. Does the heat shield fix to existing mounting points? Does it affect your insurance much?

I have had two 205 GTI's one a 1.6 (before my rallye) and then a 1.9 last year from a company called Just GtI's. The 1.6 had over a 100K on the clock when bought it but it was a real peach, not as fun or quick as the Rallye but really good fun; and the 1.9 was a completely different story....! After selling the ST170 I started yearning for a drivers car again and started looking for a 205 GTI. My search lead me to the doors of Just GTI in Horsham. Nive guys and on the face of it they refettle 205's so I naively let my guard down and bought a complete dog! The AFM was on its way out (Idle all over the place and kept stalling) and the rear beam axle was on the way out and it just didn't handle right. I ended up taking it back to them.... I still can't believe i ley me guard down to such and extent because I thought I was dealing with "experts".... never ever again.

Your comments comparing the two marques is very interesting and I have got to say I am really warming to the CUP. I definately want one over a 172 Sport... roll on the spring!

One last question, is your engne missing a cover for the rocker cover / inlet manifold or is it standard? It is just that in the photo of Lee_Cup's engine bay which is in the for sale section he has a cover in silver and mondial blue which looks very sexy and I had presumed was standard.

MarkCup · Feb 2, 2006

Lesson no. 2...

P*** My Self Laughing

Green George · Feb 2, 2006

So that is the next step on from LOL...?

Theres no flies on me!

James Bushell · Feb 2, 2006

^^ Exactly.. LOL..

Mine is as it comes as standard.. the cover is extra (weight)..

insurance was a bit extra although not much.. and Renault seemed ok with the filter..

and yes it all bolts onto existing mounts. very straightforward fit..

did you have a 205 Rallye.. only my brother had 2 before writing them off.. his 2nd one was the best.. full harnesses + seats.. 6 Cibies, flaps, Compomtives, etc.... looked like a true rally car..

James Bushell · Feb 2, 2006

A few of us from the Breakfast Run at Brands.. Mark must have been somewhere behind..

..

172 Cup advice

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