172 vs 172 cup

[richlawson]

182's own 172 cups

Simple evolution.

not at all

172 cups still have the fastest 0-60 of all the 2.0 clios plus the 172 cup is more raw and fun

only downfall is you will end up in a hedge at some point lol

 

[Mr Hurst]

Cup = OWNAGE!

 

[Daz.]

All cup owners do is go on about weight, fastest 0-60 specs and this 'rawness' word. 99.9% of cup owners I doubt have the downstairs gentleman to make any of that count on a real road in the real world.

Not having a go so I apologise if anyone thinks I am but I'm sorry if thats the trump card thats always played its not a very good one!

 

[Sir_Dave]

172 cup is faster/more fun than the 182. FACT. I've had both.

All cup owners do is go on about weight, fastest 0-60 specs and this 'rawness' word. 99.9% of cup owners I doubt have the downstairs gentleman to make any of that count on a real road in the real world.

I agree with that tbh, most people simply jump on the band wagon. But, in Feb '08, i back to back test drove a '53 172 with 50k and a '53 172 cup with 55k on it, ended up buying the cup as it felt more 'alive' Nothing to do with outright speed, etc, maybe it just felt more 'nervous', but i just preferred it. Less easy to drive at the limit, so more fun imho.

In the wet, yes ABS is nice to have, but we all lived without it in the past, learn to look further further up the road & drive slower in the damp. Simples.

 

[Ads_172]

As above, it's not necessarily about constantly pushing it to those limits that make it quicker; it just feels better and more exciting to drive, even normally.

 

[activ]

You don't get a wider track at all.

You get wheels with a greater offset and different suspension that's it. I looked into it.

My 172 cup has a wider track than my 182 not the wheels as I have swapped them between the two cars but the hubs, also has a different caster angle giving it more stability at speed.

 

[maz172cup]

when was the last time someone went from a cup to a 172ff, it just dont happen. For me the cup is so much more nicer to look at.

The best way to describe it really is if someone has bought one and doesnt like it, then they didnt know enough about it and should get a FF.

The margins are small but they are there, a talented driver in a cup would run rings around the "normal" driver in a 182 so everyones opinions are based on their own experiences.

 

[Rob669]

There was also the phase 1, 172. 14 kg heavier than a 172 Cup or 75 kg lighter than the phase 2, 172. With leather and the cold dry air nonsense. Either way, just strip them out and they're all the same.

 

[Glenn182Trophy]

has anybody got the weight of the 172 cup with the optional aircon

 

[Rob669]

About 6-8 kg extra.

 

[Daz.]

Do cups on rollers seem to make more power simply due to the engine not having run the aircon kit?

alot of mk1 172 conversions seem to make cup style engine figures which would suggest the same?

 

[gaz44]

All cup owners do is go on about weight, fastest 0-60 specs and this 'rawness' word. 99.9% of cup owners I doubt have the downstairs gentleman to make any of that count on a real road in the real world.

Not having a go so I apologise if anyone thinks I am but I'm sorry if thats the trump card thats always played its not a very good one!

If it's not it's trump card then what's the point in it?

The main difference is the weight, which change the handling characteristics of the car compared to other Clios. Agreed, it would take a lot to make it count in the real world but the 'rawness' is a factor. It makes it feel more old school, like the older hot hatches which were built for fun and not for safety and luxury.

The 172 is still a fun car but the Cup takes the fun a step further. It also looks better, imo.

I think it is it's trump card - at least it has one...

 

[Daz.]

So forgive me but if I stick some 38 offset wheels on a 172 and take out the back seats and the spare etc then I've got a cup?

The trump cars should lie with a 172 then if it can be a comfy cruiser and a cup within 20 mins off unbolting?

I don't want people thinking I've got something against the cup - I certainly do not, It was at the top of my list of cars to replace my Williams when I went out shopping as I read into the rawness of it compared to an old skool hatch but I just didn't feel it when I drove the 2 I drove, the 172 made so much more sense, they both don't hold a candle to my old chassis but I don't know I felt more of a cheapskate in the cup than I did in the 172, they felt as quick as each other but I felt happier in the 172 - so I bought one

I love a good looking cup, but maybe I don't see this stature thats been built up around them thats all.

 

[Sir_Dave]

Tbh, they are all different, french build tollerances are shocking, some cups do decent power, so do some normal 172s, just like the fabled 130bhp 106 gti's/saxo vts' ... just depends on whether its a monday morning or friday afternoon car tbh.

Fact is, the cup was built as a stripped down lightweight model, to maximise the potential of the 172. It did that, all the reviews said it did, all the owners say it does. Different things appeal to different people. To some they arent worth the extra hassle, to some they are, horses for courses, etc. I liked it because it was like an old school hatch, ie it was harder to drive on the limit, the 182 i had could be driven fast by any old tool tbh, not fun in my eyes.

The guy who bought my 172 cup from me 'classicsheepflavour' also had a normal 172. He said mine 'felt' far quicker than his did. Shame he's not on here that much as im sure he could offer some input; he had both of them for about 3 months!! Used the normal one for the commute & the cup for fun at the weekends ...

 

[Joeh]

Is the guy being serious who said a cup will kill you because it has no abs, jesus christ, i had a 106rallye with brembo 4pots and no abs yet im still alive, hatches have so many aids these days that people forget how to actualy drive, 'oh no what will i do without tcm abs gdfc ahfc csx and aircon

its more of a drivers car, if you care about having cowskin on your seats or not wishing to simply wind your window down in the summer, then buy a normal 172.

if your'e buying a car to actualy drive in then get a cup

you think cups are raw, try an s1 106rallye with a 140bhp gti lump, no power steering, windy windows, no abs traction NOTHING
pure driving fun
and you wont die

 

[MarkCup]

Do cups on rollers seem to make more power simply due to the engine not having run the aircon kit?

alot of mk1 172 conversions seem to make cup style engine figures which would suggest the same?

I think so.

Most will say that unless the aircon is actually turned on there's no load/drag on the engine, but on a rolling road, the power-steering pump is doing nothing as the wheels are dead ahead, and taking that pump off mine released another 7bhp.

So there must be something in it?

 

[jonathanedew]

Glad for the climate control today :rasp:

 

[MarkCup]

I waited until 20:30 before driving mine. Easy.

 

[gaz44]

So forgive me but if I stick some 38 offset wheels on a 172 and take out the back seats and the spare etc then I've got a cup?

The trump cars should lie with a 172 then if it can be a comfy cruiser and a cup within 20 mins off unbolting?

I don't want people thinking I've got something against the cup - I certainly do not, It was at the top of my list of cars to replace my Williams when I went out shopping as I read into the rawness of it compared to an old skool hatch but I just didn't feel it when I drove the 2 I drove, the 172 made so much more sense, they both don't hold a candle to my old chassis but I don't know I felt more of a cheapskate in the cup than I did in the 172, they felt as quick as each other but I felt happier in the 172 - so I bought one

I love a good looking cup, but maybe I don't see this stature thats been built up around them thats all.

You obviously don't see the opint in them. Fair enough but there is a marked difference.

If you want a comfy cruiser, buy a BMW or something.

 

[Daz.]

I don't want a comfy bmw if I did I would have bought one, I wanted something a little more civilised for me and my missus day to day than the Williams was.

If I had it my way I'd have an Elise sat on the drive, I do see the point in cups what I don't see is the pointless bickering on forums about the negligble differences between them all, too many people seem to have the need to justify what they've bought - why?

 

[gaz44]

I don't want a comfy bmw if I did I would have bought one, I wanted something a little more civilised for me and my missus day to day than the Williams was.

If I had it my way I'd have an Elise sat on the drive, I do see the point in cups what I don't see is the pointless bickering on forums about the negligble differences between them all, too many people seem to have the need to justify what they've bought - why?

Well you buy a car for a reason. The Cup is different in many ways to the standard 172, therefore people justify this, through bickering or otherwise. There is maybe negligble difference in performance on the public roads but there is a difference how ever it's experienced.

I had mine over standard because it was cheaper, it looked better, it felt more nimble and sorted and it was a bit more special than the 172. I also had hoped to do some track days but never got round to it, and you can't deny what's better on the track!

The whole ethos of making lighter cars is a winner for me, so the Cup it was. There, I just justified why I bought the Cup!

(My BMW is not light, but it is lighter than standard, in CS form)

 

[Daz.]

The other half had a big factor in buying the 172, due to buying a house it was important to get something we both could live with due to going down to one car for a while...

I'll not bore you with the details but the original compromise was an iceberg cup, but that was before I test drove those cups I mentioned!

Its all a matter of opinion, I guess we'd all be the same if we logged onto a tv forum, people would be arguing that their 40" sony 200hz lcd 0wnz someones panasonic 42" plasma lol.

 

[FlamingMonkey]

Its all a matter of opinion, I guess we'd all be the same if we logged onto a tv forum, people would be arguing that their 40" sony 200hz lcd 0wnz someones panasonic 42" plasma lol.

Nope your wrong my Cup is better and faster than both of those tellys

...and your 172 :lolup:

 

[gaz44]

The other half had a big factor in buying the 172, due to buying a house it was important to get something we both could live with due to going down to one car for a while...

I'll not bore you with the details but the original compromise was an iceberg cup, but that was before I test drove those cups I mentioned!

Its all a matter of opinion, I guess we'd all be the same if we logged onto a tv forum, people would be arguing that their 40" sony 200hz lcd 0wnz someones panasonic 42" plasma lol.

That could indeed happen. The light-weight Sony LCD is the better option though.

At the end of the day, it get's dark.

 

[Daz.]

Nope your wrong my Cup is better and faster than both of those tellys

...and your 172 :lolup:

I wondered when you'd be sticking your face in Monkster

You know more than anyone what I'm talking about!

 

[bark]

End of the day the difference is negligible and all down to the drivers ability.

I bought the cup because it was affordable fun, a logical progression from my last car and the fact the colour and wheels were to my taste.

None of this back to basics shizzle or anything like that!

 

[FlamingMonkey]

I wondered when you'd be sticking your face in Monkster

You know more than anyone what I'm talking about!

Yep 172 is a poor mans Williams :evil:

 

[Heliosphan]

I've never driven a 172 but I can't imagine there's much difference.

Quicker to 60mph is pure pub-talk, you won't feel a difference when there's barely half a second between them.

I had a Saxo Vts (very light mods, manifold and head) and my cup doesn't feel any quicker except at high speeds, 50mph+

Edit: Forgot to say the reason I went for a cup is because I knew coming from a Saxo, it would feel more 'luxurious' anyway and I wanted to experience the quicker car (on paper). Basically, If i'd gone for the 172 I'd always wonder what the 'cup' was like.

 

[Badger_GT]

Cups FTW!!

Short but sweet