abs failure

[jinjur]

Hi guys,

Apologies, I realised this abs specific question was buried in the engines sub-forum so hoped some exposure here would help me.

A few days ago, when i got into the car to drive home, I noted that the ABS, SERV and ESP lights were all on. When I drove off, i saw the STOP and handbrake light come on too. The car was given the "full monty" wash the day before.....including heavy work on the arches etc. I suspect this is an ABS sensor as it comes on immediately before the car even moves....but could it be something worse? ABS pump or scary stuff like that?

Not sure if this helps but i went round all my abs sensors tonight with my albeit crappy multimeter.
Not sure if this shows any issues?

Help?
J

 

[jinjur]

Ok guys.....popped on an RSTuner and now I am a bit worried.
Can someone please help?

 

[jinjur]

HALP!

 

[Rob669]

See if it goes after disconnecting the ABS wiring plugs, drying it all out (WD40) and reconnecting. You might have some water in the electrics.

 

[jinjur]

ok bud, ill try that
Will focus on the abs ecu as I have done that will all of the abs sensor connectors already thinking my powerwash had done the same.
really not happy at the mo

 

[jinjur]

Ok, pulled every connection that i could see including the ABS Module and each of the sensors. Cleaned them.....none of them were wet but I gave each a wee pop of WD to make sure.

Cleared the error and it came back straight away.

HALP!

 

[jinjur]

Hi gang,

Anyone have any other ideas? Really stuck now

Would CLip give me anything more or does anyone know if the ABS Pump/module is fubar?

A

 

[jinjur]

Don't like to ping directly but have tried a number of things and short of going to Reno......which would be bad.....I am stuck
@Fred@BTM @Mike@Rentech @MicKPM @Dan@SJM
Can you help?

A

 

[MicKPM]

172 or 182?
Start with a proper diagnostic session. No disrespect to RST but it's not CLIP/AutoLogic so go to someone wit hone of these two systems. After that, you'll know what is actually wrong and can concentrate on fixing it from there on.

Mick

 

[jinjur]

Ok bud.....appreciate that.
I will have a dig about and see who is local with either of those systems
Cheers for the quick response.
Andy

 

[jinjur]

Sorry, 172

 

[jinjur]

Ok.....so I took it to an auto spark i know.........who threw it on a Snapon tool.
Spat out ABS Motor Communication Failure or something to that effect. Looks like the ABS pump or ECU then.
Quick question then. Hard job?

J

 

[bloke]

would get it on something better than snap on before you go throwing parts at it.

 

[jinjur]

Ok, fair enough bud.
Any Northern Ireland people know of someone with CLIP/AutoLogic here then?

Not going to the Renault dealership as last time I got a diagnostic done there for a poor running Megane, they told me I needed a new ECU.
Turns out, they had left a plastic housing loose on the back of the block and 2 sensors unplugged when it was getting serviced (with them) that I only found when I was trying to locate an oil leak.
They might own a CLiP machine.....but they are not getting ANY money from me again.
J

 

[Cub.]

Not wishing to be the bearer of bad news, and this may not be the same for you, but I had similar ABS problems that I couldn't get to the bottom of. Kept putting it 50/50 which isn't exactly ideal.

After much faffing about and trying to solve, I gave up and removed the ABS completely (it's predominantly a track car) and swapped in a full cup setup.

 

[jinjur]

Dude. You are killing me
Did you replace the ECU/pump combo at any stage?

 

[Cub.]

Dude. You are killing me 😧
Did you replace the ECU/pump combo at any stage?

The only things left to be swapped were the ABS ECU and the Pump, and the cost of the cup set up was cheaper than those parts and I wanted non-abs for track work as it was better.

 

[bloke]

have you had it on live data to see what the abs sensors are showing/seeing?

 

[Darren S]

Your initial symptoms (apart from my brake pedal going to the floor) were identical to when a rear brake pipe went on mine.

I take it you've still got full fluid levels? No little pools of fluid on the floor near one of the wheels?

 

[Dutchman99]

Any issues with breaking. Abs kicking in at below 10mph? My lights are on but I know my problem. The abs ring has snapped. Got a new one but struggling to get hub nut off to replace. I ain't d Wayne Johnson after all.

 

[jinjur]

My ABS issues, well.......it......just doesn't work at all.
Braking works absolutely fine. The only thing that doesn't is ABS and ESP.

All the rings are fine, the pipes are fine, the sensors look to be putting out the right values.....(i think)

It hasn't been on live data yet as tbh, I can't afford that right now.....so the car is running with a lit up dash until I can. I will bend over and take it to Renault and see what they say but both the RSTuner and a Snap-On system elude to the fact that the ABS pump/ECU isn't talking.

ANY ABS symptom I have usually seen comes back only when you start to move after clearing the problem (rings, sensors etc)

This however, appears when stationery after a reset.

Codes cleared, ignition on, all looks well, start engine, count to 15, SERV/ABS/ESP lights come on, count to 15, Handbrake and STOP light come on, fault logged.

When the SERV/ABS/ESP lights come on, I hear a relay "Plink" in the footwell area as well.


J

 

[MicKPM]

You need CLIP I'm afraid chap, genuinely - it's not a network issue so most likely an input signal/sensor is massively incorrect or is in open circuit.

 

[jinjur]

Hi mucker, cheers for the reply.

I totally hear you and it's not that I am ignoring the advice I am being given, it is just down to funds currently (holiday season....eek) so as soon as I have the pennies I will drop it in to Reno and hopefully get a clear answer. I will be doing this before I spend a bean on parts as advised.

I will drop the results in here too when I know in case it helps anyone else.

Cheers
Andy

 

[jinjur]

Right gents.....after much faffing about......the car is off to the stealer tomorrow for a diagnostic. I know, it took a long time

I have advised what the problem is (not that i need to looking at the dash) but with hope that it will help them focus on the ABS.

I have asked for full detail on the error codes, hopefully with a printout as last time I had a diagnostic done, I had just a service desk guy try to explain to me what needed done (not this car, mum's old car). I need the detail this time I think.

Will post back here when I get that.

Cheers
J

 

[jinjur]

Ok.
Dealership has just called to say that the car needs an ABS pump.
I asked if they would be able to give me the detail on the failure, perhaps an error code or whatnot and they said they will not do that. Just that it needs an ABS pump......at £1100 or so quid.


I am obv not going to do that.

So.....is their stance on not giving me the detail normal and acceptable? Any Reno guys here would think that's ok?
Also, is the pump an easy enough job? I see plenty on eBay for around 30/40 quid.

Appreciate all input to this stage guys.

J

 

[jinjur]

Does the ABS pump need coding to the car?

 

[Cub.]

That is an extortionate amount. You can sort it cheaper with a pump and ECU off a car being broken. Swap both out and get it all recoded.

@Dan@SJM and @MicKPM are the men best placed to guide on this....

 

[jinjur]

Hi bud.....to be honest.....I do value the abs.
Appreciate the help though, I know an awful lot prefer it out as you do...

J

 

[jinjur]

Let me just add further clarification to that figure guys. Gutted.

So......I am getting mixed signals on-line about recoding. If, hypothetically I find an ABS module with the same part number as mine.....will I need to recode it?

This is not the news I was hoping for. I was r-e-a-l-l-y hoping for an "oh you silly boy, its an ABS sensor" response. Not this

J

 

[jinjur]

Hey guys,

Not one to bump a thread usually but if I can get an answer with reference to the coding query (I.e. if I get the same part #, do I need to recode anything?), I can get one of these eBay pumps bought and fitted.

If it's any incentive, I'll do a full write up for the guides section
Cheers.
J

 

[bloke]

ignoring the snap on and rstuner codes, you say you've cleaned all the connectors etc but did you do the main front to rear? big plug on passengers side, rear of the front subframe?

also have you had a live reading from wheel speed sensors?

 

[jinjur]

Have done the connector on the and module itself fella.....is that the one?

No live readings....I just left it into Renault and implicitly asked them to tell me what was wrong with the abs and they said the only code was the abs module. Reporting a faulty circuit within the pump or something.

 

[bloke]

nope, back of the front subframe, triangular bracing plate and it's under that.
what is it actually doing or not by the way??

may well be a pump issue but if renault won't tell you exact code then it's worth checking anyway.

 

[jinjur]

No abs or DSC. Dash all lit up.
Have checked the resistance of all sensors and none are open or anything.
Reno just said pump.

 

[jinjur]

Right.......ripped the shat out of everything to get a good eye on the pump. Looks like a right now lacks to get right out.....bottom bolts seem to require an elf to remove.

Part # is 8200 270 251

Would anyone here happen to have one of those kicking about?

J

 

[James Sturrock]

Just an idea, why don't you remove your pump and send it away to a specialist and have it refurbished, this way you won't lose the coding from the original module, and should have at the end of it a practically brand new pump. I work at Mercedes commercials and we have had it loads of times where customers bring their old vans in and have a faulty abs pump and because of the price of them they send them away to get repaired. If imagine doing that will save you a hell of a lot of money!

 

[jinjur]

Hey bud, I hear you.....that is definitely an option....have already been in touch with bba-reman, ecu-testing and actronics. Cheapest for a rebuild is ~200.

However, I have sourced an abs pump that is the same number as mine for less, probably worth a punt.

Just need clarity if i use the same part number, is coding required?

J

 

[cs_dave]

Hey bud, I hear you.....that is definitely an option....have already been in touch with bba-reman, ecu-testing and actronics. Cheapest for a rebuild is ~200.

However, I have sourced an abs pump that is the same number as mine for less, probably worth a punt.

Just need clarity if i use the same part number, is coding required?

J

As long as all the numbers match up on both pumps it wont need coding! But its a b**ch of a job and will need putting on CLIP to prime the pump to remove all the air out the system

 

[jinjur]

That's good news at least bud.
Yeah. Looks like a bit of a pig to get at but I have the RSTuner ABS module and am hoping that will help me in the bleeding process.
J

 

[MicKPM]

Actually, replacing the physical pump isn't that bad once you take the PAS and coolant reservoir out the way then remove the sound deadening material from the bulkhead... Just be careful not to round any of the fixings when removing them and when refitting, ensure they all go in by finger first or else you'll pull the thread out the aluminium on the new ABS unit (Easier to do than you'd think with steel fixings).