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Any advice on ITB's ? Worth it or not
- Thread starter Briv6
- Start date
I'v been running the KTEC bodies (with GEN90) for 2 years now and has not missed a beat, on a otherwise standard engine (except map of course). If you can afford the £ per bhp ratio its def worth it in my option, esp if you can get one second hand.
You have to bin your fly by throttle wire and replace it with a traditional cable throttle linkage, which I like anyway, so don't see this as a negative.
You have to bin your fly by throttle wire and replace it with a traditional cable throttle linkage, which I like anyway, so don't see this as a negative.
Friend of mine has Ktec ITB's (inc Gen90) on his Ph1.
The sound is brilliant, and the power, when you're on it, is brilliant, but getting to the power is what is hard on public roads. Its all top end on his for sure, very little low down.
Turbo certainly has more power, and is probably better to drive as a daily car. Track car ITB's will be fine.
Just get somebody decent to map it, my mates is so rich its ridiculous, and it was mapped by somebody mentioned in this thread.
The sound is brilliant, and the power, when you're on it, is brilliant, but getting to the power is what is hard on public roads. Its all top end on his for sure, very little low down.
Turbo certainly has more power, and is probably better to drive as a daily car. Track car ITB's will be fine.
Just get somebody decent to map it, my mates is so rich its ridiculous, and it was mapped by somebody mentioned in this thread.
Depends what you want from the car and obviously engine.
It's a relatively easy bolt on bolt off modification and not too expensive if you get a 2nd hand kit.
I love mine. Really decent increase in power and the noise is incredible. Would definitely go for them again if I was building a Clio from scratch again.
Plus if your engine randomly dies you are no worse off and can just bolt it straight onto the new lump. Mapping check and tweaks probably advisable though.
If you want huge power etc then go the turbo route. But don't underestimate the true cost of a conversion and costs for maintenance and problems.
BHP per £ isn't that great no lol.
But you can pick up a second hand kit for around £1500. Get you up to mid 190s in BHP with the general supporting mods.
Not bad for a simple bolt on modification if that's what you want. Mapping is obviously needed as with anything like this.
Other option is the RS2. Ultimately not as good as ITBs but a good cost saving and you can keep some comforts like cruise if it bothers you.
But you can pick up a second hand kit for around £1500. Get you up to mid 190s in BHP with the general supporting mods.
Not bad for a simple bolt on modification if that's what you want. Mapping is obviously needed as with anything like this.
Other option is the RS2. Ultimately not as good as ITBs but a good cost saving and you can keep some comforts like cruise if it bothers you.
Thanks for the advice ... I'm not to keen on having huge noise and was looking to gain a little more torque lower down as I have custom exhaust which opens up at top end nicely .
Rs2 seems an interesting alternative but I can't seem to find who sells them or if anybody offers a supply and fit with a map included
Rs2 seems an interesting alternative but I can't seem to find who sells them or if anybody offers a supply and fit with a map included
Italian 3.2 V6
Performance wise they made my pals 182 (which wasn't much slower to start with) on par to about 100mph at my old 147GTA, after 100 I'd still start pulling. Knocked 1second off his quarter mile time.
Unless its it's a proper track car I don't think it's worth the hassle. Can be unreliable, loud and not much quicker. Personally I'd rather put the money into getting a better/quicker car or go down the boost route.
Unless its it's a proper track car I don't think it's worth the hassle. Can be unreliable, loud and not much quicker. Personally I'd rather put the money into getting a better/quicker car or go down the boost route.
davo172
ClioSport Club Member
TCR'd 172
For performance, the gains arent huge, but if you buy secondhand they hold their money so in the long run it doesnt really cost you much ultimately, they do sound nice though.
Boost is the only thing that really works well to tune these engines, its telephone numbers of moderate gains otherwise, they just dont suit N/A tuning at all well,there are far too many design flaws, but for turbo they are epic.
Boost is the only thing that really works well to tune these engines, its telephone numbers of moderate gains otherwise, they just dont suit N/A tuning at all well,there are far too many design flaws, but for turbo they are epic.
Trophy Turbo :)
Thanks for the add tom.
I see very little if any point in that personally.
The fuelling algorithm gets far more complex, and it wont gain you any power over a single throttle setup.
About the only advantage really is a small improvement in throttle response, but the downsides outweigh it in most aftermarket cases (bit different with manufacturer money behind you like say a pulsar)
Clio 172 phase 1
What's low boost like in terms of reliability vs throttle bodies tho as for me I love to have a hard spirited drive and also the odd track day but I've got something in me that says bodies will last longer than the turbo set up.... Can some one explain this further as if I'm wrong then I'll save longer and buy the engine dynamics turbo kit 
or ktec turbo kit
or ktec turbo kit What's low boost like in terms of reliability vs throttle bodies tho as for me I love to have a hard spirited drive and also the odd track day but I've got something in me that says bodies will last longer than the turbo set up.... Can some one explain this further as if I'm wrong then I'll save longer and buy the engine dynamics turbo kit
Low boost is 225bhp like a megane, and those do 150K miles no drama.
Why do you think renault went turbo instead of bodies?
reliability!
Now dont get me wrong, throw together some shonky turbo conversion and it wont last, but done right its very reliable indeed on low boost!
Clio 172 phase 1
Sounds fair enough what's the low boost conversion kit going to handle like on say a day to day basis and on a hard run? The torque and bhp gain seems to be ideally usable and where I'd want the car to be but at the same time I don't fancy engine and gearbox explosions lol, the ktec kit looks pretty tidy
The problem with the ktec it mainly just that you are tied into who can map it, or in the case of ktec, demonstrably who CANT map it as they really dont seem to have much clue what they are doing sadly from what I have seen.
At the sort of 230bhp or so range, gearboxes shouldnt really be a drama, in fact I killed more with high revving clios than I have with turbo ones, I think the revs are quite harmful to the boxes in these cars.
The engine dynamics kit is good value and well proven for turbo clios.
At the sort of 230bhp or so range, gearboxes shouldnt really be a drama, in fact I killed more with high revving clios than I have with turbo ones, I think the revs are quite harmful to the boxes in these cars.
The engine dynamics kit is good value and well proven for turbo clios.
Clio 172 phase 1
I was looking into the engine dynamics kit as it's stupidly reasonably priced but It dosent say much about an ecu with the kit just about mapping.... And I'm sure it dosent mean the standard ecu as it won't be able to recognise boost? .... What's the deal there buy the kit and then what else is needed? Omex 600 and loom? Or the ktec gen 90
SharkyUK
ClioSport Club Member
Bodies? Pfft. Go boost... 
Without trying to sound biased here... ITB's are awesome! But, and this is important, I am very much a fan of NA and I decided to go down this route for the driving experience that such a setup would afford / provide me with. I wasn't chasing numbers (which are never going to be massive with NA tuning on these engines for reasons that have been pointed out elsewhere) but I was looking for an exciting and 'highly strung' nature to the drive; which is what I get. It's not cheap and, personally, I would look to get ITB's done along with some other supporting mod's (such as decent cams, valves, ECU, etc) and, of course, the mapping.
The biggest thing I tend to see / read is that people go down the ITB route with unrealistic expectations and, ultimately, become disappointed when they cannot catch their mate up in his or her Evo (a bit of a generalisation there, I know!) A well sorted ITB setup can result in a rapid and engaging drive (when pushing on) and a fantastic soundtrack, but it won't result in a properly fast car (like, say, a high-boost turbo setup would). It's all about reality and expectations and what you are looking for from the car.
Without trying to sound biased here... ITB's are awesome! But, and this is important, I am very much a fan of NA and I decided to go down this route for the driving experience that such a setup would afford / provide me with. I wasn't chasing numbers (which are never going to be massive with NA tuning on these engines for reasons that have been pointed out elsewhere) but I was looking for an exciting and 'highly strung' nature to the drive; which is what I get. It's not cheap and, personally, I would look to get ITB's done along with some other supporting mod's (such as decent cams, valves, ECU, etc) and, of course, the mapping.
The biggest thing I tend to see / read is that people go down the ITB route with unrealistic expectations and, ultimately, become disappointed when they cannot catch their mate up in his or her Evo (a bit of a generalisation there, I know!) A well sorted ITB setup can result in a rapid and engaging drive (when pushing on) and a fantastic soundtrack, but it won't result in a properly fast car (like, say, a high-boost turbo setup would). It's all about reality and expectations and what you are looking for from the car.
210 would need cams as well as bodies by the way (and hence the expense of belts to fit them)
300bhp n/a touring car and 300bhp turbo touring car are similar pace. Physics doesn't care how you get the power particuarly.
Power is power ultimately and while bodies offer the ultimate in control the reality is that "only" 225bhp is still very easy to lay down on track in a turbo Clio.
Turbo involves a little more weight etc. so there probably wouldn't be much in it between your two examples. The difference though is you could then relatively cheaply add another 30bhp to the turbo but not to the n/a.
Clio 172 phase 1
I suppose at least with the turbo conversion aswell once the cost of it's been bought and fitted later down the line forged pistons and rods are on like 1k and then up the boost ..... I guess in real life like chip said ud have to rag the car less as itd be shooting along with the torque " obv more boost later means up rated clutch and possibly diff " but still it's deffo something I'll consider in a few months when the money's there
..... I guess in real life like chip said ud have to rag the car less as itd be shooting along with the torque " obv more boost later means up rated clutch and possibly diff " but still it's deffo something I'll consider in a few months when the money's there
SharkyUK
ClioSport Club Member
I totally agree. I can't drive for s**t so it's definitely for the fun!
Having heard my new setup yesterday... yeah, it's a lot of money for not a lot of power but that sound. Ooft. I wouldn't say it's worth it for the sound alone (unless money is no issue and you really want to go NA) but it certainly helps.
